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Touchy Messianic Question about the feasts - 8/14/2009 11:54:39 PM
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splost
Posts: 47
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Hi fellow Messianic believers,
Before I start with my touchy issue, let me say that I have done the feasts and I don't see anything wrong with them and how they point to Messiah. Here is where it gets tricky.
Some Messianic congregations believe the feasts are still required for believers, while other Messianic congregations don't. I already have had the famous Galations misunderstanding explained, along with the "we are no longer under the law" misunderstanding explained. Both were used to promote keeping the feasts.
I am not in question for myself about keeping kosher or the Sabbath or Passover (since there is a new testament reference to keeping it).
Since the feasts centered around the temple (I understand they point to Christ) and there is no temple, are we do keep them since it's impossible to follow the original instructions?
After the destruction of the temple in 90 AD, or whenever it was, were early believers still keeping the feasts with no temple? Part of them?
This train of logic has got me seriously thinking about it. I will be honest (please don't be offended anyone as I do not want to hinder someone's conviction or take the Jewishness of the gospel away) the feasts for me have become a bit tricky trying to find work, and I don't feel like I have had the "grace" per say to observe a feast on a day that wouldn't interfere with employment some way.
Are believers "required" to keep all the feasts? Even though I know there are verses talking about the law being good, the parts on what we are to still keep confuses me
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RE: Touchy Messianic Question about the feasts - 8/15/2009 12:57:57 PM
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navyblueret
Posts: 1971
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From: S/W Nebraska
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splost, Shalom.
Sadly, I cannot say yea, or nay, with any authority. I can but offer my own 'IMO' for your consideration.
God never gave HIS Feasts to man to determine if nor when they would be viable to following His will. Our Love, and Worship of Him should be our motivation for honoring His Feast Days. (Note, also, that the Feast stays in place, even though the original reason for honoring it, changes. An example would be Tabernacles. Messiah (almost for sure) was born on day one of that Feast, yet it also holds an important slot in the when/fore of Messiahs second 'coming.' Same Feast, having numerous reasons. Another would be Yom Teruah (Rosh Hashanah), just full of reasons for honoring.
And then, of course is the notice that during the Millennial reign of Messiah, Feast of Tabernacles holds an extremely important position in Messiahs Theocracy. Any nation who don't show up, don't get rain, and does get plague. Now that is what I call a 'Rod of Iron.' 
Sorry I cannot give you a perfect answer, so, for now, until someone much better versed than I can answer, you be stuck with my simple IMO.
In Messiah, His Blessing, and Answers. Arley
PS: I do not know of any scripture that says God's Feasts have been retired from service.//as//
_____________________________
In the name of 'THE' Mashiach, Man the wall, set the watch, sound the Shofar. Our redemption draws nigh.
Messiah, my Captain, and Helmsman.
(Joh 14:6 KJV) ... I am the way, the truth, and the life: ...
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RE: Touchy Messianic Question about the feasts - 8/15/2009 3:13:46 PM
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Bluethread
Posts: 2923
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quote:
ORIGINAL: splost
Are believers "required" to keep all the feasts? Even though I know there are verses talking about the law being good, the parts on what we are to still keep confuses me
Agreed we can not do the sacrifices but there is more to the feast than just going to the temple to make sacrifice. There are three pilgrimage feasts. (De 16:16) "Three times a year all your men must appear before the Lord your God at the place he will choose: at the Feast of Unleavened Bread, the Feast of Weeks and the Feast of Tabernacles. No man should appear before the Lord empty-handed:" Now this has be interpreted several ways.
Some says, since there is no temple, this verse does not apply until there is a Temple. However, as stated before there are other things in the feasts that do not require the Temple and we are not forbidden from keeping the feasts without the temple.
There is the "do the next best thing" view. These individuals travel to the "wailing wall". Others send a community representative. This latter could be what took place in Acts 2. Since the Scriptures speak of times and a place. Some see that as "around the time of" and "near Jerusalem". These argue that, if everyone went at the exact same time to the temple, one might not get any closer than that anyway.
Finally there is the pragmatic or "spirit of the law" view. Under this view one does what one can where one is and only travels to Jerusalem, when the opportunity arises. Since, as you have pointed out, there is no Temple, one is to convene with those near by and follow the instructions regarding each feast. In this way we become a light to the nations and are able to identify with Adonai's people and reinforce the principles in the Scriptures.
Now, which one of these views is right before Adonai, I am not sure. I follow the third option, since Adonai has not blessed me with the resources to follow the second option. Maybe that is why I have not been blessed with more resources, who knows? The first option is not one I entertain, because, in my opinion, if one looks at the Scriptures in this manner, one would soon wittle one's service to Adonai down to nothing more than being fat and happy.
_____________________________
"Show me wherein I have errored and I will hold my tongue." Iyov(Job)
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RE: Touchy Messianic Question about the feasts - 8/15/2009 3:42:00 PM
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benelchi
Posts: 4566
Joined: 9/14/2007
From: California
Status: online
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quote:
ORIGINAL: splost
Hi fellow Messianic believers,
Before I start with my touchy issue, let me say that I have done the feasts and I don't see anything wrong with them and how they point to Messiah. Here is where it gets tricky.
Some Messianic congregations believe the feasts are still required for believers, while other Messianic congregations don't. I already have had the famous Galations misunderstanding explained, along with the "we are no longer under the law" misunderstanding explained. Both were used to promote keeping the feasts.
I am not in question for myself about keeping kosher or the Sabbath or Passover (since there is a new testament reference to keeping it).
Since the feasts centered around the temple (I understand they point to Christ) and there is no temple, are we do keep them since it's impossible to follow the original instructions?
After the destruction of the temple in 90 AD, or whenever it was, were early believers still keeping the feasts with no temple? Part of them?
This train of logic has got me seriously thinking about it. I will be honest (please don't be offended anyone as I do not want to hinder someone's conviction or take the Jewishness of the gospel away) the feasts for me have become a bit tricky trying to find work, and I don't feel like I have had the "grace" per say to observe a feast on a day that wouldn't interfere with employment some way.
Are believers "required" to keep all the feasts? Even though I know there are verses talking about the law being good, the parts on what we are to still keep confuses me
In Galations 3 Paul makes a strong argument against the kind of legalism that demands that Christians follow the feast as a religious requirement of their faith. He points out that the promise was given to Abraham 430 years before the Law was given and the the giving of the Law did not set aside the promise already given to Abraham.
I personally have chosen to celebrate Pesach every year, but not because I am obligated to celebrate but because I believe it is a wonderful opportunity to teach my children about the gift God has given us in offering us redemption.
_____________________________
אשת־חיל מי ימצא ורחק מפנינים מכרה
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RE: Touchy Messianic Question about the feasts - 8/18/2009 12:42:37 PM
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DaveW
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You should take a long hard look at Acts 15. From the Judaizers in verse 1 to the letter sent out to the gentile congregations.
If you are a Jewish believer, IMO you should be keeping the feasts, at least a bibilcal kosher, etc. If you are a gentile believer, all that is optional, except for what is listed in Acts 15.
BTW, the 'church' was considered a part of Pharasaic Judaism (even the predominately gentile congregations) until the final seperation of church and synagogue following the Bar Kochba revolt of 135 ad.
_____________________________
Avatar is my daughter Laura and SIL David on their wedding 9/20/09 ====================================
Our CD is now available here:
http://cdbaby.com/cd/dswaggoner
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RE: Touchy Messianic Question about the feasts - 8/18/2009 1:26:53 PM
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lchamale
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From: Mesa, AZ
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Good morning to all. I'm new to this forum but not new to messianism, judaism, christianity. I wanted to respond to this by commenting on my own experiences and opinion. One thing to remember is that although there is an ideal way to try to live a hebraic-roots life, there is always ambiguity about which is the absolute and more right way to do it. Welcome to hebraic thought! That may not be what G-d intended but it's how it's been for thousands of years. G-d says something in the Torah, and then there is many opinions about what he meant, and how to apply it.
As for the feasts, i would like to comment that my belief is "depends". It depends on your obligation towards Torah...i have always thought interesting Rav Shaul's (Paul) opinion on how to follow Mashiach (messiah/christ). If one was called while in the circumcission, let him remain circumcised...if one is called while uncircumcised, let him remain uncircumcised. How can one break this rule if one is circumcised? how could you become uncircumcised?
I've been taught that this means that if one is jewish (circumcised) when called to yeshua, that you don't stop your obligation to follow the 613 mitzvot (instructions) found in the Torah that apply to you. This means to some following the Torah and mitzvot the same way orthodox jews follow it, and being more fervently observant about it because after all, we must be more righteous than those that sit on the seat of Moses. This applies to jews who convert to christianity, to christians who have jewish ancestry (especially a jewish mom), and to many latin americans whose ancestors were spanish jews who converted to catholicism due to persecution.
To those that are not jewish, ergo not religiously circumcised, then we must follow what acts 15 tells us, to begin with the four laws that relate to eating blood (keeping kosher???), eating food offered to idols (chinese food???), sexual inmorality (see joke about the 20 commandments), and eating meat from strangled animals (which also has blood).
So there you have the two ranges.....you can have at minimal NO FEASTS and follow those four rules relating to idolatry and keeping some kosher aspects......or you can have all 613 mitzvot, and some have even suggested that Yeshua added more mitzvot well into the 1000 range, because he doubled some of the commandments, for example: if one has lust in their heart, they have now commited adultery in their heart.
Somewhere between these two ranges, we all will follow G-d. My suggestion to most people is to not go full-force into the feasts. Because it's very easy to fall into the trap of learning HOW to do it, but not knowing why it's done that way, and soon you find out that everyone keeps them differently. And that this is not a negative thing, but rather very natural since regions of the world are exposed to different cultural differences and the expressions of the feasts will surely be influenced by the local culture. For example, for some spanish jews, rice is not considered leavened bread, but for some german jews it is....(during the week of Passover, one cannot eat anything with leavening, which represents sin).
In addition, i would also suggest to learn how to do it the traditional way first. Sometimes in messianic circles, there is a messianic seder, or messianic blessings, i even attended a passover seder once that a participant took over the ceremony and began to discuss the eucharist representation of the bread and the wine. Again, i would suggest learning how it is 'normally' done in a jewish traditional setting....with the blessings in hebrew/transliterated. Maybe even invite some non-religious jews (that SHOULD be an oxymoron, but unfortunately it's not).
Once you've done the feasts in a traditional setting, then you can begin to explore the messianic representation that yeshua brings to those feasts. For some, you don't even have to do this because the spirit of Mashiach (messiah) has been in these feasts all along, since G-d commanded them in Sinai. But if you do want to incorporate messianic passages from the NT or teachings of Yeshua, then you may do so as well.
With regards to the temple...you will learn that many traditional non-messianic jews run into that question as well, but those smarty rabbis have an answer for everything...hahaha.... i say that light-heartedly because i love understanding those bright men of G-d that study Torah 24 hours a day and with the best good faith, try to guide their congregations and their people in the way of G-d.
I once asked a messianic rabbi the same thing, rabbi, why is it that the feast of passover is "celebrated" even though there is no temple....what aobut the daily paschal sacrifices...etc etc. He told me that we don't celebrate passover, because it is impossible to do it without the Temple and the temple sacrifices......we conmemorate it! And whoallah, i never asked again, since i imagine this applies to other feasts that require sacrifices at the Temple of G-d.
So, you may celebrate or conmemorate, whichever way you feel is better for you. I think we have to begin the practice of participating in G-d's feasts, and let the spirit guide our heart's emotions. The job of our minds is to learn how to do it right (the traditional way), our messianic faith will help us to make that traditional way feel more 'yeshua-like', and the Spirit of Holiness of G-d will reward our hearts emotions when we know why we are doing it....which in my own answer is that we do it out of Love of G-d, to show love for G-d, not because it's obligatory or a burden or a heavy yoke.
Okay, this is the longest introduction i've ever done of myself. Sorry to make it so long. And i hope i answered your question or at least you can get something out of my explanation. Shalom Ubrachot, peace and blessings!
Luis ben Avraham
lchamale@msn.com
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RE: Touchy Messianic Question about the feasts - 8/18/2009 1:51:36 PM
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p31woman
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Welcome to the forums, Luis!
_____________________________
So don't let anyone pass judgment on you in connection with eating and drinking, or in regard to a Jewish festival or Rosh-Hodesh or Shabbat. These are a shadow of things that are coming, but the body is of the Messiah. Colossians 2:16-17
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RE: Touchy Messianic Question about the feasts - 8/18/2009 3:09:36 PM
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Lapidoth
Posts: 5721
Joined: 4/13/2005
From: OKLAHOMA
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quote:
Are believers "required" to keep all the feasts?
Hello splost.
My answer is a simple one.
No.
But that does not mean there aren't a lot of things to learn.
If and when we keep a feast here, it is educational.
Demonstrating what it might have been like in the first century.
When we began trying to observe messianic "style" worship,
it seemed to open the flood gates to all the sabbatarian kooks
in this area. I didn't realize how many there were. LOL.
In all that, it made us dig so deep into the Scripture to see what
is really said that it all worked out for the better for us.
We have repented, changed course, and so much more in our studies.
This is like so many topics where you have both extremes.
So, you will have to study and decide for yourself. God Bless You.
_____________________________
Why does He keep quoting Torah? Doesn't He know He's about to abolish it?
http://www.tedpearce.com/Videos/TheForgottenpeople.html
BARUCH HABA BASHEM YAHUAH
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RE: Touchy Messianic Question about the feasts - 8/18/2009 3:26:56 PM
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navyblueret
Posts: 1971
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From: S/W Nebraska
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Lapidoth, Shalom.
Wouldn't it be right to note that Sukkot will be observed even in the Millennium? Just a thought.
In Messiah. Arley
_____________________________
In the name of 'THE' Mashiach, Man the wall, set the watch, sound the Shofar. Our redemption draws nigh.
Messiah, my Captain, and Helmsman.
(Joh 14:6 KJV) ... I am the way, the truth, and the life: ...
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RE: Touchy Messianic Question about the feasts - 8/19/2009 12:41:01 PM
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Lapidoth
Posts: 5721
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From: OKLAHOMA
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quote:
ORIGINAL: navyblueret
Lapidoth, Shalom.
Wouldn't it be right to note that Sukkot will be observed even in the Millennium? Just a thought.
In Messiah. Arley
Yep, and I can't wait.....................but guess I'll have to....lol
_____________________________
Why does He keep quoting Torah? Doesn't He know He's about to abolish it?
http://www.tedpearce.com/Videos/TheForgottenpeople.html
BARUCH HABA BASHEM YAHUAH
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RE: Touchy Messianic Question about the feasts - 8/21/2009 10:47:51 PM
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Covaan_Meshuga
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Well, I readily admit that I disagree that we are not necessarily to keep the feasts. Too many Scriptures don't make sense, if that were true. Do I keep them? You bet.
_____________________________
While in prayer or praise, I am only as devoted to G-d as I am in my most private moments.
Abiyah, if you had known them as G-d knows them, you would have answered them differently.
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RE: Touchy Messianic Question about the feasts - 8/22/2009 5:28:37 PM
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Bluethread
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Covaan_Meshuga
Well, I readily admit that I disagree that we are not necessarily to keep the feasts. Too many Scriptures don't make sense, if that were true. Do I keep them? You bet.
Yes, there seems to be some confusion regarding "have to". The difference is have to for what. We are all in agreement that one does not "have to" observe the feasts for salvation. However, do we "have to" observe the feast to be living as Adonai desires, is another question. This is at the heart of the two track controversy that is currently one of the most "touchy" issues among observant followers of Yeshua. I personally have a problem with two track theology. If jews are no better or worse than gentiles, as most two track believers profess, then why are there more requirements for proper living for the jew than there are for the gentile.
< Message edited by Bluethread -- 8/22/2009 5:40:37 PM >
_____________________________
"Show me wherein I have errored and I will hold my tongue." Iyov(Job)
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RE: Touchy Messianic Question about the feasts - 8/22/2009 8:53:21 PM
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Covaan_Meshuga
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I agree, Blue. We are all called to follow, and Paul clearly makes no distinction. I don't have to do the feasts if I don't want to, but I believe with all my heart that if my intention is to follow Adonai completely, without reservation, I will enter into the feasts and fast He prescribes. I am certainly not one who is going to decide that the supposed "Noachide laws" are enough, nor am I going to decide, as have some, that Yeshua is unnecessary.
G-d, help us to set a path, a right path, and follow through!
And really, who wouldn't want to do the observances? Not doing them is like being invited to a grande feast and deciding, "No, I'd rather to McDonald's."
_____________________________
While in prayer or praise, I am only as devoted to G-d as I am in my most private moments.
Abiyah, if you had known them as G-d knows them, you would have answered them differently.
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RE: Touchy Messianic Question about the feasts - 8/27/2009 5:07:17 PM
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lchamale
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From: Mesa, AZ
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Great analogy about McDonalds, Abiya! Thanks for that one! The two track messianics, i think i may be one of them. Where i believe there is one burden for the circumcised, and one different burden for the uncircumcised...
I don't think that the jews are 'better' for having more commandments (i.e. 613) than the gentiles (i.e. 7 or 4 depending who you ask). Perhaps, that is the story of why yeshua had to come to explain the Torah to us. We as humans want to KNOW what is the absolute 'minimum' that i can do to get by. We see this in our jobs, we see this in our kids, and of course in ourselves. So tell me rabbi, one would say, what do i HAVE TO do to be in your group?
It is sad, but because the rabbis (paul, and the nazarene sanhedrin in israel) gave it, we now believe that that is enough. Perhaps what it all means is that there is 4 that we require to know someone is not still a pagan worshipper who eats blood of animals and attends the weekly orgies. But that we must continue our spiritual path from eating milk to a more mature observance of G-d's proscribed way of living (i.e. eating meat). -- that's the analogy of not eating milk and begin to eat meat....we now have teeth, maturity, etc.
It is VERY easy to get caught up in the arguments that these things we must do, these we should do, these we don't have to do.....but still many people continue to ask the questions, and it's hard not to guide them for fear that they will conclude that they don't have to do anything. I guess i haven't met anyone that believes they don't have to do anything....many folks tithe, or wear nice clothes to church, or refrain from cursing, not to mention stealing, murdering and all those other 'commandments'.
I know that for a long time i went head first into orthodox messianism and although i was grateful for the amount of learning and experience i had, i think for my own self, it would ahve been better to take one step at a time, and not go from pagan gentile one day to orthodox rabbi the next day.
Okay, i've rambled enough. Have a great weekend all of you!
Shalom,
luis chamale
lchamale@msn.com
Phoenix, AZ
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RE: Touchy Messianic Question about the feasts - 8/27/2009 5:35:33 PM
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Bluethread
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quote:
ORIGINAL: lchamale
The two track messianics, i think i may be one of them. Where i believe there is one burden for the circumcised, and one different burden for the uncircumcised...
Perhaps what it all means is that there is 4 that we require to know someone is not still a pagan worshipper who eats blood of animals and attends the weekly orgies. But that we must continue our spiritual path from eating milk to a more mature observance of G-d's proscribed way of living (i.e. eating meat). -- that's the analogy of not eating milk and begin to eat meat....we now have teeth, maturity, etc.
If one merely acknowledges that someone needs to observe only a few to begin with and learn of the rest later is not two track in my opinion. Two track is more a matter of never challenging a gentile to examine the majority of the commandments or avoiding discussing them.
The problem with using the discision of the Jerusalem Council as an entrance exam for fellowship is that it appears to be a bit circumstantial. Each of the four "rules" appears to be related to a common practice among the gentiles at that time. Today, there appear to be different concerns. Therefore, I would say the minimum requirements for attending a Shabbot convocation would be somewhat different. It is difficult in a global forum to say what those would be, but none the less I would say what constitutes a serious compromise with unacceptable practices has changed somewhat.
_____________________________
"Show me wherein I have errored and I will hold my tongue." Iyov(Job)
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RE: Touchy Messianic Question about the feasts - 10/23/2009 6:03:19 PM
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lchamale
Posts: 8
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From: Mesa, AZ
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Bluethread
The problem with using the discision of the Jerusalem Council as an entrance exam for fellowship is that it appears to be a bit circumstantial. Each of the four "rules" appears to be related to a common practice among the gentiles at that time. Today, there appear to be different concerns. Therefore, I would say the minimum requirements for attending a Shabbot convocation would be somewhat different. It is difficult in a global forum to say what those would be, but none the less I would say what constitutes a serious compromise with unacceptable practices has changed somewhat.
Hi Blue,
What a wonderful response...you are indeed full of wisdom, while i tend to think i'm full of head-knowledge, as some of my christian friends accuse of me.
So i agree that few people who go around eating the limbs of living animals (although i have come to think this applies to raw food, like oysters), or drinking blood (is rare meat part of this? ) ...so what would be today's equivalent for 2009 america?
So here are my four that i would recommend:
1. Refrain from laughing at people when they get hurt on youtube videos
2. Abstain from all things that lead to the pain and suffering of children
3. Do not have contempt or belittle your spouse in public (nor in private either)
4. Refrain from wearing shorts and sandals to G-d's house
Some of those are serious some are joking...but i think i have homework for the next few days, all i'm gonna think about is what would be today's equivalent ruling or way to apply the spirit of the ruling within our modern day environment. Certainly i think we agree that the ruling in Acts 15 was to be able to not impose pagan-behavior on Torah-observant jewish messianics of the time; since they did not have churches and synagogues that worshipped the G-d of Israel back then. It was only the synagogue. Can you imagine a drugged out junky, smelling of booze and women's perfume, with women's ligerie hanging from his back pocket showing up to a synagogue and saying, "ok folks! sorry i'm late, let's start praising our G-d together."
Certainly there is some visual way of seeing when someone has not left their idolatry behind, and ways in which you can see it. That guy would be really lucky if that was a reform and they work with him on it...but imagine after a few years, he keeps showing up to Shabbat that way? So i believe having a so-called 'Minimum' standard of proving you're not a idolater any more is essential not only to the growth of the congregation, but also to the way society views that congregation. I may have gone into other topics that are unrelated, but again, i had never thought of updating the four 'suggestions' of Acts 15:21.
Have a wonderful shabbat and hope to hear from you soon. Keep the dialogue going.
--Luis ben Avraham
lchamale@msn.com
< Message edited by lchamale -- 10/23/2009 6:25:33 PM >
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RE: Touchy Messianic Question about the feasts - 10/23/2009 9:58:02 PM
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Bluethread
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Well, the instructions to sojourners in our group vary depending on the house in which we meet. However, we tell them not to bother bringing anything for Oneg and be prepared to have your views challenged. We also point out that the barucha' is not the same as "communion". We have more that once entertained mormon missionaries that happen to come to the door on shabbat.
_____________________________
"Show me wherein I have errored and I will hold my tongue." Iyov(Job)
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RE: Touchy Messianic Question about the feasts - 10/26/2009 1:17:25 PM
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DaveW
Posts: 3795
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quote:
We also point out that the barucha' is not the same as "communion". You mean "Kiddish?" If you will note, the order of kiddish and communion are reversed.
Baracha means blessing. The brachot said at kiddish are hagaffen and the hamotzie. The actual blessings are the same but in different order.
Kiddish => Hagaffen, then hamotzie
Communion => Hamotzie, then hagaffen
< Message edited by DaveW -- 10/26/2009 1:24:51 PM >
_____________________________
Avatar is my daughter Laura and SIL David on their wedding 9/20/09 ====================================
Our CD is now available here:
http://cdbaby.com/cd/dswaggoner
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RE: Touchy Messianic Question about the feasts - 10/27/2009 3:32:27 AM
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Bluethread
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quote:
ORIGINAL: DaveW
quote:
We also point out that the barucha' is not the same as "communion". You mean "Kiddish?" If you will note, the order of kiddish and communion are reversed.
Baracha means blessing. The brachot said at kiddish are hagaffen and the hamotzie. The actual blessings are the same but in different order.
Kiddish => Hagaffen, then hamotzie
Communion => Hamotzie, then hagaffen
Point well taken. I think "communion" comes from the mistaken idea that these were to only blessings that occured at "the last supper". As you know, in the Pesach Haggadah there are four cups. The reversal in the histories of Yeshua indicates that the bread and the cup refer to the afikoman and the cup of redemption and not just any bread and cup, or "new" practice.
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RE: Touchy Messianic Question about the feasts - 10/27/2009 6:50:07 AM
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DaveW
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Communion of course is inextricably linked to Passover. However, it is also connected to the Shabbat kiddish which is celebrated every week.
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RE: Touchy Messianic Question about the feasts - 10/27/2009 9:13:18 AM
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Lapidoth
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I would be interested to know if these "four cups" can
be found in Scripture.
thanks
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BARUCH HABA BASHEM YAHUAH
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RE: Touchy Messianic Question about the feasts - 10/27/2009 10:22:17 AM
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DaveW
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No they cannot. However, they were authorized either by Hillel or a predecessor to represent these 4 promises:
1st cup of Freedom: I will bring you out from under the burdens of the Egyptians, Exo 6:6
2nd cup of deliverance: I will deliver you from their bondage. Exo 6:6
3rd cup of Redemption: I will also redeem you with an outstretched arm and with great judgments. Exo 6:6
4th cup of Acceptance: Then I will take you for My people, and I will be your God; - Exo 6:7
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Avatar is my daughter Laura and SIL David on their wedding 9/20/09 ====================================
Our CD is now available here:
http://cdbaby.com/cd/dswaggoner
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RE: Touchy Messianic Question about the feasts - 10/28/2009 4:11:48 AM
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Bluethread
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quote:
ORIGINAL: DaveW
Communion of course is inextricably linked to Passover. However, it is also connected to the Shabbat kiddish which is celebrated every week.
In what way is it connected to the latter?
_____________________________
"Show me wherein I have errored and I will hold my tongue." Iyov(Job)
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RE: Touchy Messianic Question about the feasts - 10/28/2009 6:28:52 AM
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DaveW
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It is not so much a theological connection as a cultural and practice connection. The weekly sabbath kiddish is where the church got the idea that communion was to be done weekly.
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Avatar is my daughter Laura and SIL David on their wedding 9/20/09 ====================================
Our CD is now available here:
http://cdbaby.com/cd/dswaggoner
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