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Whose responsibility is it? - 10/8/2009 12:44:52 PM
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Liveloved
Posts: 1814
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I grew up in what I thought a large family. There were five children. Today I am seeing many in the church choose to have large families as well. But I am seeing another aspect that concerns me so want to ask the question here.
If you and your husband choose to have a large family, who do you see as responsible for all the work a family of that size entails? How do you decide? Are your children, especially the older ones, given responsibility that they should not have?
I have observed in many of these families a tendency to give alot of responsibility to the older children. And I am conflicted about this. IOW, the older children often are raising/caring for the younger ones and aren't given the opportunity to be children. In my family, we were allowed to be children. We had small jobs but the majority of the 'work' was my mother's.
So I ask, how do you think we are to live this out in a godly way?
_____________________________
Liveloved
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Now may the God of hope fill you with all joy and peace in believing, that you may abound in hope by the power of the Holy Spirit. Romans 15:13
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RE: Whose responsibility is it? - 10/8/2009 1:09:27 PM
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Consecrated2God
Posts: 4926
Joined: 4/4/2005
From: Formerly Jesus Land
Status: online
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quote:
If you and your husband choose to have a large family, who do you see as responsible for all the work a family of that size entails? How do you decide? Are your children, especially the older ones, given responsibility that they should not have?
Everyone who is a member of the family should contribute to that family in some way. The older ones do more than the younger ones, only because the younger ones aren't able. When we all get together and clean the house, the older ones will help with dishes because the little ones are too short and lack the strength to lift heavy pans and glass plates high onto the shelves. The younger ones have tasks more suited to their ages, like picking up toys off the floor.
_____________________________
"A faith that can be destroyed by suffering is not faith."--Richard Wurmbrand
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RE: Whose responsibility is it? - 10/8/2009 1:13:29 PM
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stampinlady
Posts: 2590
Joined: 4/12/2005
From: Northern IL
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quote:
Its a parents responsibility to equip their children for life and that means teaching them to do things. There is nothing wrong with kids having household responsibilities.
And I'm sure that if these are boys and they get married their wives will appreciate that greatly.
I only have 2 kids and have never been around large families for most of my life. Oh we had a few growing up, but they all seemed wild to me. The larger families at our new church home school and seem pretty average to me. I always thought it was wrong to have the older ones "parent" the little ones, but since I don't come from a large family maybe you have to do that to keep everyone safe.
_____________________________
Deb
"When the fufillment comes the types and shadows cease."
Author unknown
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RE: Whose responsibility is it? - 10/8/2009 1:50:20 PM
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kohls356
Posts: 642
Joined: 8/22/2007
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I think kids should have responsibilities in the home whether they are an only or one of many. What I have seen though with the large families I have known is the older children do grow up with more work. They do take care of the younger children and help more around the house because they can do more work.
What I have seen is once the older children are grown the younger ones are older with no younger siblings they are responsible for and there are less people in the house so the house work, such as laundry and preparing meals and simply cleaning, is less for them than it was their older siblings because there are less people in the house. The younger kids seem to get to have that childhood that the older ones didn't have because they were taking care of the house and the younger kids.
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RE: Whose responsibility is it? - 10/8/2009 1:54:45 PM
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stellaluna
Posts: 4161
Joined: 4/11/2005
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Yeah, if you'd asked my mother who was in charge when we were kids she would have said her. As the oldest, I can tell you for a fact it was me. Now that I'm an adult she freely admits that I did most of the "raising" and had way too much responsibility...especially seeing how the responsibility dwindles as the younger ones come along.
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RE: Whose responsibility is it? - 10/8/2009 2:11:58 PM
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purejoy
Posts: 350
Joined: 4/15/2005
Status: online
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Liveloved
I have observed in many of these families a tendency to give alot of responsibility to the older children. And I am conflicted about this. IOW, the older children often are raising/caring for the younger ones and aren't given the opportunity to be children. In my family, we were allowed to be children. We had small jobs but the majority of the 'work' was my mother's.
I am the second oldest of seven, and the oldest girl, so in a way it felt like I was the "oldest" as far as responsibility for the other kids. I had the opportunity to be a child when I was a child. When I was old enough to take on responsibility, that's what I did. And I would have done that whether or not I had younger siblings. We had chores...I would have had those regardless of younger siblings. I think a lot of it was the way my parents are, how they chose to raise their kids, and their work ethic. At the time it seemed soooo unfair that I was doing chores while my friends were watching TV or playing video games or sitting around being bored. As someone else said, now I see those same people, grown up, that have no work ethic or sense of responsibility.
As for my younger siblings...sure, things are MUCH cushier for them than they were for me.  But to me, that's just the way it is. Of course I wouldn't take that away from them. My parents are in a better financial situation now than when they had all seven at home...so would I deny my younger siblings the benefit and blessing of that? Of course not. Do they have less chores than I did? Sure, because there is less to do, and there are not little ones to take care of anymore. So do I think my parents should find more for them to do just to make it "fair?" Of course not.
I guess, for me, it boils down to this: that's just the way it is. I wouldn't trade my situation for anything. I loved having a big family, and I loved being one of the "oldest." I know there are situations where people have lots of children and the older children do all of the child rearing and are resentful of that. That certainly wasn't the case for me, but in those cases, it's a parenting issue.
I guess what I'm trying to say is that, while I understand the piece of "kids being kids," that term has very broad meanings, and I don't think it's realistic to say that the event of childhood should be the same for every single child, because that won't happen regardless of family size.
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RE: Whose responsibility is it? - 10/8/2009 2:28:20 PM
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kohls356
Posts: 642
Joined: 8/22/2007
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quote:
ORIGINAL: peculiar_lady2
quote:
The younger kids seem to get to have that childhood that the older ones didn't have because they were taking care of the house and the younger kids.
So what exactly is the solution for this? "Keep popping out kids?" Sorry, but life isn't fair...you deal with the hand you are given. If that"s a lot of responsibility because it's a large family or if it's a little responsibility. It has nothing to do with the number of kids. Larger families just tend to really show it more because of two reasons...1) it is more people and we finally realize after a certain number that we can't handle it all ourselves and shouldn't try to overload ourselves with picking up after every single person just because...and 2) we are under more scrutiny...more people watch us or want to know how we can handle it because they are just SURE they couldn't. Then they want to mock or belittle us for our personal decisions. (Not saying that's what you are doing, or really anyone here, just in general that's what we run into all the time). Whether we had 15 kids or 2 kids, my kids would have the same responsibility as they do now. The chores might differ (such as if we didn't have another baby they of course wouldn't get daily experience with changing them), but the teaching responsibility part would still be there.
Oh trust me, I am not mocking your or belittling anyone. I personally don't care how many children a person has. Each family has to come up with their own solution to how it works in their family. However, it does have to do with the number of kids because that is what makes a large family and the more there are the more responsibility there is. You even said that you finally realize after a certain number that you can't handle it all yourself and shouldn't try to overload yourself with picking up etc. So there is a certain number, according to you, where you can't handle it all. I am sure that number is different for each family.
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RE: Whose responsibility is it? - 10/8/2009 2:30:22 PM
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AslansChild
Posts: 66
Joined: 6/30/2005
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Liveloved has not checked in so I may be misrepresenting here. But I understand her question to be more about parental responsibility than chores. My only exposure to this is what I have seen from a certain family on reality TV. And To me having the older kids responsible to parent younger siblings because the number of children is greater than the ability for the parents to parent. As an example if I manage 15 people at my job I am lucky if I get to talk to each one every day let alone see them face to face. As a parent there are responsibilities towards your children that are hourly at the least. I realize as children grow there is a natural seperation as well as an acceptance of greater responsibilities but IMHO having to rely on my 12 yo daughter to be "responsible" for my 2 yo for the day is stretching comon sense. I have two kids and the older one is at the age where they can "babysit" for an evening and be there when the younger one gets home from school but I would not expect them to be the caregiver everyday. And both have chores and responsibilities outside of school work, music and sports. Children should be children with graduating responsibilities and accountablities that teach them to become adults. Below the age of 18 and rasining someone elses children is a situation where childhood is being taken away.
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RE: Whose responsibility is it? - 10/8/2009 2:32:51 PM
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peculiar_lady2
Posts: 4332
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quote:
ORIGINAL: kohls356
quote:
ORIGINAL: peculiar_lady2
quote:
The younger kids seem to get to have that childhood that the older ones didn't have because they were taking care of the house and the younger kids.
So what exactly is the solution for this? "Keep popping out kids?" Sorry, but life isn't fair...you deal with the hand you are given. If that"s a lot of responsibility because it's a large family or if it's a little responsibility. It has nothing to do with the number of kids. Larger families just tend to really show it more because of two reasons...1) it is more people and we finally realize after a certain number that we can't handle it all ourselves and shouldn't try to overload ourselves with picking up after every single person just because...and 2) we are under more scrutiny...more people watch us or want to know how we can handle it because they are just SURE they couldn't. Then they want to mock or belittle us for our personal decisions. (Not saying that's what you are doing, or really anyone here, just in general that's what we run into all the time). Whether we had 15 kids or 2 kids, my kids would have the same responsibility as they do now. The chores might differ (such as if we didn't have another baby they of course wouldn't get daily experience with changing them), but the teaching responsibility part would still be there.
Oh trust me, I am not mocking your or belittling anyone. I personally don't care how many children a person has. Each family has to come up with their own solution to how it works in their family. However, it does have to do with the number of kids because that is what makes a large family and the more there are the more responsibility there is. You even said that you finally realize after a certain number that you can't handle it all yourself and shouldn't try to overload yourself with picking up etc. So there is a certain number, according to you, where you can't handle it all. I am sure that number is different for each family.
I disagree. I was one of 3, and I had much more responsibility then my kids (I have five) have. I think it has more to do with personality/parenting style of the parents then anything else
What I meant by the number statement is...those that don't want to give responsibility would really change their mind after they hit a certain number. They would realize easier that they can't and shouldn't do it alone. However, if they only had one or two and were never pushed to make the kids help. they probably wouldn't. Again- more about parental personality/parenting style then the number of kids.
_____________________________
Proud to be...  
"When God said 'brains', some thought He said 'trains' and got on the wrong track" -Maxine
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RE: Whose responsibility is it? - 10/8/2009 2:35:23 PM
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Ellie-Mae
Posts: 2645
Joined: 4/9/2005
From: The EMPIRE state!
Status: online
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quote:
ORIGINAL: kohls356
quote:
ORIGINAL: peculiar_lady2
quote:
The younger kids seem to get to have that childhood that the older ones didn't have because they were taking care of the house and the younger kids.
So what exactly is the solution for this? "Keep popping out kids?" Sorry, but life isn't fair...you deal with the hand you are given. If that"s a lot of responsibility because it's a large family or if it's a little responsibility. It has nothing to do with the number of kids. Larger families just tend to really show it more because of two reasons...1) it is more people and we finally realize after a certain number that we can't handle it all ourselves and shouldn't try to overload ourselves with picking up after every single person just because...and 2) we are under more scrutiny...more people watch us or want to know how we can handle it because they are just SURE they couldn't. Then they want to mock or belittle us for our personal decisions. (Not saying that's what you are doing, or really anyone here, just in general that's what we run into all the time). Whether we had 15 kids or 2 kids, my kids would have the same responsibility as they do now. The chores might differ (such as if we didn't have another baby they of course wouldn't get daily experience with changing them), but the teaching responsibility part would still be there.
Oh trust me, I am not mocking your or belittling anyone. I personally don't care how many children a person has. Each family has to come up with their own solution to how it works in their family. However, it does have to do with the number of kids because that is what makes a large family and the more there are the more responsibility there is. You even said that you finally realize after a certain number that you can't handle it all yourself and shouldn't try to overload yourself with picking up etc. So there is a certain number, according to you, where you can't handle it all. I am sure that number is different for each family.
Just because someone can't handle all the work themselves doesn't mean that it is necessarily time to stop having kids. No parent should have to do the work all themselves. It is just when you have a lot of kids you are forced a lot more to recognize the need to train the kids to take part in the responsibility for their environment. When there is only a couple of kids it is much easier to just do it yourself.
_____________________________
"You can" makes no difference. "You will" changes the world.
~BillyBob Jones in Grey soon to be authored by Caleb (12) for NaNoWriMo
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RE: Whose responsibility is it? - 10/8/2009 3:05:21 PM
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Liveloved
Posts: 1814
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quote:
ORIGINAL: stellaluna
Yeah, if you'd asked my mother who was in charge when we were kids she would have said her. As the oldest, I can tell you for a fact it was me. Now that I'm an adult she freely admits that I did most of the "raising" and had way too much responsibility...especially seeing how the responsibility dwindles as the younger ones come along.
OK, I'm checking in now and glad to see all the insightful responses. Obviously this is a topic that others have or are willing to think about.
I'm picking on stellaluna by using her response because this is my concern. I totally agree that our children need to be trained/equipped for caring for themselves, a household, a family, or generously giving of themselves in many ways.
I was trained by watching my mother give. She had a servant's heart and ministered to her family and then to others. . . all the time.
What I have observed in some of the larger families is not what I had the blessing to live. Instead I see mothers straddling their children (and especially oldest daughters) with the responsibilities of childcare and housekeeping. It is a way of freeing herself of duties she has become burdened by and is, in turn, burdening her child/children. There is not a servant's heart or a ministering to anyone outside the home.
I hate even expressing this but it is what I am seeing and it makes me sad for the children. My goddaughter is one of them. I recently took her on an outing and one of the booths had balloons that were twisted into animal shapes. She would not/could not take one. "My mom won't allow me to have one of these because they're not safe for the younger ones." I could have cried for her. She's a child! And at nine she should be able to have fun. She has her whole life to 'be responsible' for others. I guess I see this as a situation like the one stellaluna grew up in.
So I guess my reason in asking the question is to just prompt thinking about the choices we are making and how they affect others and whether they are the choices the Lord would have us make.
_____________________________
Liveloved
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Now may the God of hope fill you with all joy and peace in believing, that you may abound in hope by the power of the Holy Spirit. Romans 15:13
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RE: Whose responsibility is it? - 10/8/2009 3:14:53 PM
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zoebob
Posts: 7961
Joined: 4/13/2005
From: land of limbo
Status: online
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I agree Erin. Any mother with toddlers might say "no balloons in the house"
_____________________________
L-R: DD1, Ellies DS2, DD2, Ellies DS1
L-R: Ellies DD1, Ellies DD2, DS, Ellies DS3
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RE: Whose responsibility is it? - 10/8/2009 3:23:57 PM
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garsyt
Posts: 1738
Joined: 4/12/2005
From: the bottom of the laundry basket
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Liveloved
I grew up in what I thought a large family. There were five children. Today I am seeing many in the church choose to have large families as well. But I am seeing another aspect that concerns me so want to ask the question here.
If you and your husband choose to have a large family, who do you see as responsible for all the work a family of that size entails? How do you decide? Are your children, especially the older ones, given responsibility that they should not have? My husband and I are responsible and that includes making sure we raise responsible children that in turn become responsible adults.
quote:
I have observed in many of these families a tendency to give alot of responsibility to the older children. And I am conflicted about this. IOW, the older children often are raising/caring for the younger ones and aren't given the opportunity to be children. In my family, we were allowed to be children. We had small jobs but the majority of the 'work' was my mother's.
So I ask, how do you think we are to live this out in a godly way?
I have 4 kids - currently 15 (nearly 16), nearly 12, 10 and 8. My 15 year old does have more responsibilities than the nearly 12 year old who has more responsibility than the younger two. Responsibility here ALSO depends on maturity and ability.
The way I see it is that THE entire family makes the messes in the home and lives in it, so everyone should be willing to help. Moms should NOT be expected to do EVERYTHING! It's simply not fair and it's not doing our kids a favor by coddling them and not training them take care of themselves and their future families.
My 15 year old is responsible for his siblings on occasion and thus has grown into a very caring young man whom is very protective of his younger siblings. But he also knows that he is NOT a parent and thus does NOT have the right to tell his siblings what to do unless we have expressly given him that permission. But my kids are still kids and trust me still act like kids and have plenty of free time to pursue what ever silly endeavors they want to pursue - but I also know that once they leave home that they'll be able to take care of themselves, their future families, and their homes.
Blessings,
Garsy
_____________________________
My Blog: www.moredayslikethisplease.wordpress.com
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RE: Whose responsibility is it? - 10/8/2009 3:25:44 PM
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Consecrated2God
Posts: 4926
Joined: 4/4/2005
From: Formerly Jesus Land
Status: online
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I told my kids once they weren't allowed to have gum until they were 35, (out of frustration) and the next time someone offered them gum, they seriously answered, "I'm sorry--we're not allowed to have gum until we're 35."-
_____________________________
"A faith that can be destroyed by suffering is not faith."--Richard Wurmbrand
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RE: Whose responsibility is it? - 10/8/2009 3:32:47 PM
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macokjc
Posts: 278
Joined: 2/24/2008
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quote:
Just because someone can't handle all the work themselves doesn't mean that it is necessarily time to stop having kids.
Even though I have 5 kids, I have to disagree with that statement. If you are unable or unwilling to do the work yourself, than I do think it is time to stop having kids. I think that kids should do chores because they need to learn responsibility, they need to learn to have a servant's heart, and they need to learn to pick up after themselves. My husband remembers spending every Saturday with his siblings cleaning the house from top to bottom while his mom sat there with a magazine and yelled at them for not cleaning fast enough.
I, like the PureJoy, am the second oldest of 7, and I am the oldest girl. I spent a lot of time watching my younger brothers and sisters, but I didn't mind. My mom worked so, so, so, hard and never asked us to do anything that she wasn't willing to do herself. We all had chores and were expected to help out, but my mom did the majority of work. My little brothers and sisters did have it easier, more money and less work, but I would never call my own childhood deprived.
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