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conservatives want to "Conservatize" the Bible - 10/5/2009 7:36:47 PM
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shakezula
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http://blog.beliefnet.com/crunchycon/2009/10/conservatizing-the-bible.html
"The eager young men at Conservapedia are p.o.'d that the Bible might be seen as too liberal. So they've come up with the Wiki-style Conservative Bible Project, to make sure the Lord doesn't go all wobbly on us. Excerpt:
As of 2009, there is no fully conservative translation of the Bible which satisfies the following ten guidelines:[1]
Framework against Liberal Bias: providing a strong framework that enables a thought-for-thought translation without corruption by liberal bias
Not Emasculated: avoiding unisex, "gender inclusive" language, and other modern emasculation of Christianity
Not Dumbed Down: not dumbing down the reading level, or diluting the intellectual force and logic of Christianity; the NIV is written at only the 7th grade level[2]
Utilize Powerful Conservative Terms: using powerful new conservative terms as they develop;[3]
Combat Harmful Addiction: combating addiction by using modern terms for it, such as "gamble" rather than "cast lots";[4]
Accept the Logic of Hell: applying logic with its full force and effect
Express Free Market Parables; explaining the numerous economic parables with their full free-market meaning
Exclude Later-Inserted Liberal Passages: excluding the later-inserted liberal passages that are not authentic, such as the adulteress story
Credit Open-Mindedness of Disciples: crediting open-mindedness, often found in youngsters like the eyewitnesses Mark and John, the authors of two of the Gospels
Prefer Conciseness over Liberal Wordiness: preferring conciseness to the liberal style of high word-to-substance ratio; avoid compound negatives and unnecessary ambiguities
Thus, a project has begun among members of Conservapedia to translate the Bible in accordance with these principles. The translated Bible can be found here:"
http://conservapedia.com/Conservative_Bible_Project
what do you think of this?
_____________________________
watch out for the oo moo and the blehblehbleh
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RE: conservatives want to "Conservatize" the ... - 10/5/2009 7:53:15 PM
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litfire2000
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quote:
ORIGINAL: shakezula
what do you think of this?
I think they're nuts.
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Ps. 122:6 Pray for the peace of Jerusalem
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RE: conservatives want to "Conservatize" the ... - 10/5/2009 8:49:48 PM
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NiceGuy
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From: The Great State of Confusion
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***Incoming Message from the Big Giant Head ***
To borrow a phrase:
You cannot be serious!
NiceGuy 
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Look, I brought a Sombrero! Now we can both be "cool"! - Hobbes, of Calvin and Hobbes
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RE: conservatives want to "Conservatize" the ... - 10/5/2009 10:00:19 PM
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letusreason
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I think we have had enough americanization of the bible with the {cough} {cough} Message Bible.
Besides that, isnt' conservatizing the Bible a little redundant anyways?
_____________________________
Proverbs 16:2
All the ways of a man are clean in his own sight, But the LORD weighs the motives.
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RE: conservatives want to "Conservatize" the ... - 10/5/2009 10:32:14 PM
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shakezula
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i checked of their Mark translation. it would be hilarious if they weren't serious about it.
Ex:
Mark 1:3: The voice of one crying in the wilderness, Prepare ye the way of the Lord, make his paths straight. (KJV)
The messenger preaches among skeptics, "Prepare for the way of the Lord and make straight His path. (Conservative Bible - CB)
Mark 1:8: I indeed have baptized you with water: but he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost. (KJV)
I have baptized you with water, but He shall baptize you with the Divine Guide. (CB)
Mark 6:40: And they sat down in ranks, by hundreds, and by fifties. (KJV)
After they did, everyone sat down in long lines, of fifty or a hundred people. (CB)
_____________________________
watch out for the oo moo and the blehblehbleh
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RE: conservatives want to "Conservatize" the ... - 10/5/2009 10:47:17 PM
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ManimalX
Posts: 2564
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I try not to pass judgment on something like this until I know more about it.
That being said, from what is presented in the OP, it looks like a wonderful idea. "Conservative" ideas are such because they are biblical anyway, and given the liberal "creep" into literature and theology, it wouldn't hurt to have a translation that helps modern Christians understand the thought behind the original passage.
Safeguards against 21st century American liberalism are NEVER a bad idea, especially when it comes to the Bible.
Also, new translations are generally always opposed.
Can someone tell me if this is the work of only ONE "translator", or is it a properly sized group of folks that are necessary for a serious Bible translation?
_____________________________
"And the Lord's servant must not be quarrelsome but kind to everyone, able to teach, patiently enduring evil, correcting his opponents with gentleness. God may perhaps grant them repentance leading to a knowledge of the truth." - 2nd Timothy 2:24,25
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RE: conservatives want to "Conservatize" the ... - 10/5/2009 11:28:58 PM
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relady
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Bunch of loons. But I'm sure some people don't really care how accurate their version is as long as the words they like are in there. It sounds to me like they just wanna change it to suit their purposes which really makes them not much different from the "liberals" they so hate. In fact I might go so far as to call it HERESY.
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RE: conservatives want to "Conservatize" the ... - 10/5/2009 11:31:57 PM
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sue244
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I think this is stupid. The Bible is Conservative as it is, We don't need ANOTHER translations. There are more then enough out there.
_____________________________
My country owes me nothing. It gave me, as it gives every boy and girl,
a chance. It gave me schooling, independence of action, opportunity for
service and honor.
Equal rights for all, special privileges for none.
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RE: conservatives want to "Conservatize" the ... - 10/6/2009 12:19:05 AM
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sue244
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Its funny that they change "Holy Ghost" to Divine Guide considering that seems to be a more liberal post modern new age term. That was the first thing I thought when I saw that they had changed that. I don't know of anyone who could really accuses the KJV of being Liberal.
_____________________________
My country owes me nothing. It gave me, as it gives every boy and girl,
a chance. It gave me schooling, independence of action, opportunity for
service and honor.
Equal rights for all, special privileges for none.
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RE: conservatives want to "Conservatize" the ... - 10/6/2009 12:36:17 AM
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blessedinnyc
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quote:
ORIGINAL: henny
They are translating it via the "wiki" method (i.e. anyone on their sight can translate it) and they aren't using the original Greek/Hebrew as their sources. Rather, they are just rephrasing the wording of the King James version to make it less "liberal."
Apparently, the 17th century English Puritans were a little too liberal for their tastes.
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RE: conservatives want to "Conservatize" the ... - 10/6/2009 2:19:43 AM
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ManimalX
Posts: 2564
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quote:
ORIGINAL: sue244
I think this is stupid. The Bible is Conservative as it is, We don't need ANOTHER translations. There are more then enough out there.
I don't know, Sue. Language changes very quickly, especially English. As different words and phrases come to have different meanings, it is important to maintain a solid understanding of them. I have a difficult time navigating a King James Bible, and that is as an English major and a writer. Out of all of the people under 40 I have spoken with regarding the KJV Bible, none of them like it or use it because it is essentially a foreign language.
In these last days (since the ascension of Jesus), God has chosen to rule and govern His people through the written word. It is therefore vital for those words to retain their meaning; it is vital that people can understand what God has communicated.
_____________________________
"And the Lord's servant must not be quarrelsome but kind to everyone, able to teach, patiently enduring evil, correcting his opponents with gentleness. God may perhaps grant them repentance leading to a knowledge of the truth." - 2nd Timothy 2:24,25
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RE: conservatives want to "Conservatize" the ... - 10/6/2009 2:40:19 AM
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ManimalX
Posts: 2564
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quote:
ORIGINAL: henny
This is hilarious (not to mention completely anachronistic).
If you want to see their conservative Bible, they've already begun translating it (although most of the books aren't finished yet). You can see it here:
http://conservapedia.com/Conservative_Bible
They are translating it via the "wiki" method (i.e. anyone on their sight can translate it) and they aren't using the original Greek/Hebrew as their sources. Rather, they are just rephrasing the wording of the King James version to make it less "liberal." This includes doing things like changing the words "Holy Ghost" to "Divine Guide" because ghosts "conjure up images of haunted houses," debating whether or not they should change the word "damsel" to "bimbo," inserting the word "homosexuality" everywhere (even in places where more conservative Bibles wouldn't translate it as such), changing all mentions of the word Pharisee to "intellectuals" (which is its most naked example of ideology destroying original meaning), and completely botching all nuance by rephrasing things in a completely dumbed down manner.
Seriously, you guys totally need to read the talk pages on the wiki. Some of it's quite funny. 
People keep saying this is "funny" or "hilarious", as if translating Scripture into modern vernacular is a joke. You might no agree with the finished product, but it is at least intriguing and interesting. "Hilarious" is hardly the proper description.
While this will probably never be an authoritative version of Scripture, from the little bit I have read so far, I have been enjoying being forced to go through various translations and the original language in order to "test" this version. Some of it is... weird, but some is quite well done for a thought-for-thought type of translation.
I would be interested to read actual analysis of some passages by the members here, instead of just, "I don't like it".
I have found several areas where certain phrases or words have simply been omitted, such as Philemon 25 - "The grace of our Lord Jesus Christ be with your spirit. Amen." (KJV). The CBP removes "your spirit" with the explanation that the phrase is "anachronistic". However, the word pneuma that is translated "spirit" conveys a very important message about the existence of such a thing AS the "spirit", and to throw it out completely changes the meaning of a lot of Scripture.
For example, the same word is used in Matthew 5:3 - "Blessed are the poor in spirit (pneuma), for theirs is the kingdom of heaven"
This becomes, "Blessed are the poor, for theirs is the kingdom of heaven". That isn't even close to what Jesus was teaching.
Overall the project needs a LOT of work and attention, but it could be a very useful thing someday.
_____________________________
"And the Lord's servant must not be quarrelsome but kind to everyone, able to teach, patiently enduring evil, correcting his opponents with gentleness. God may perhaps grant them repentance leading to a knowledge of the truth." - 2nd Timothy 2:24,25
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RE: conservatives want to "Conservatize" the ... - 10/6/2009 3:06:47 AM
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keithyhuntington
Posts: 814
Joined: 7/7/2009
From: Tulsa, Okla.
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quote:
ORIGINAL: henny
This is hilarious (not to mention completely anachronistic).
If you want to see their conservative Bible, they've already begun translating it (although most of the books aren't finished yet). You can see it here:
http://conservapedia.com/Conservative_Bible
They are translating it via the "wiki" method (i.e. anyone on their sight can translate it) and they aren't using the original Greek/Hebrew as their sources. Rather, they are just rephrasing the wording of the King James version to make it less "liberal." This includes doing things like changing the words "Holy Ghost" to "Divine Guide" because ghosts "conjure up images of haunted houses," debating whether or not they should change the word "damsel" to "bimbo," inserting the word "homosexuality" everywhere (even in places where more conservative Bibles wouldn't translate it as such), changing all mentions of the word Pharisee to "intellectuals" (which is its most naked example of ideology destroying original meaning), and completely botching all nuance by rephrasing things in a completely dumbed down manner.
Seriously, you guys totally need to read the talk pages on the wiki. Some of it's quite funny.
so its not a translation, but a paraphrasing then, right?
_____________________________
Jesus Christ please help me 'cause i'm lonely. Whats the use in living, if you can't make a good living?
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RE: conservatives want to "Conservatize" the ... - 10/6/2009 3:20:29 AM
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dbark
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quote:
If you want to see their conservative Bible, they've already begun translating it (although most of the books aren't finished yet). You can see it here:
http://conservapedia.com/Conservative_Bible
They are translating it via the "wiki" method (i.e. anyone on their sight can translate it) and they aren't using the original Greek/Hebrew as their sources. Rather, they are just rephrasing the wording of the King James version to make it less "liberal."
If this is the case, calling it a translation is not accurate. What they are doing is paraphrasing.
At first glance it seems a little bit like putting a spin or a slant on the scriptures - which is not unique. That is basically what Eugene Petersen did with "The Message", but at least he used the original languages to come up with his paraphrase.
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"In seeking wisdom thou art wise; in imagining that thou hast attained it, thou art a fool." ~ Rabbi Ben Azai
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RE: conservatives want to "Conservatize" the ... - 10/6/2009 4:03:51 AM
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ManimalX
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In all fairness, reading through some of the "analysis" columns, some contributors are consulting original languages.
I still want to know more about the people who actually decide what gets in and what doesn't.
_____________________________
"And the Lord's servant must not be quarrelsome but kind to everyone, able to teach, patiently enduring evil, correcting his opponents with gentleness. God may perhaps grant them repentance leading to a knowledge of the truth." - 2nd Timothy 2:24,25
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RE: conservatives want to "Conservatize" the ... - 10/6/2009 4:56:11 AM
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everjoyful
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I took this excerpt from the beliefnet link in the OP.
quote:
More seriously, the insane hubris of this really staggers the mind. These right-wing ideologues know better than the early church councils that canonized Scripture? They really think it's wise to force the word of God to conform to a 21st-century American idea of what constitutes conservatism? These jokers don't worship God. They worship ideology
I tend to agree with this.
I thought it was a joke. A mocking of conservative Americans. At least tongue in cheek. But it's seriouse?
I think the bible should be an accurate translation with information available about the historical context and language changes etc(just like it widely is already.). To change it's wording to suit the ideology of one branch of christianity would then seperate that branch from the rest of the body. There are other "Christian" groups with their own versions of scriptures ie Mormons, jehova's witnesses and catholics. They have become seperate from the rest, with each group proclaiming that they know best.
Is conservatism becoming the new denomination? the new catholocism? Ie "If you are not with us you are not saved"?
There are many practices and teachings amongst American conservatives that are not taught or believed in other parts of the world. For example I had never heard of the "rapture" until I came onto the internet. Neither had I heard much about seed sowing and partnering. There are also some differences in beliefs about Gay people and sex education etc. I am farely liberal (to an extent-I do adhere to God's word) favouring mercy over judgement. I am also farely socialist. Amongst christian peers in the uk I am not unique. For an example until I came to the internet I had no idea that right wing and christian were two phrases that you could put together.
I say this not to judge or mock but rather to illustrate my point that across the world christians have different understandings and revelations of the word and varying political ideas. A bible that is written to emphasise the beliefs of one group over the others just sits really badly with me.
People should bend to the word. The word does not need to change to fit the teachers. If you can't read your chosen meaning in the scriptures then your chosen meaning is wrong. It is fine in my eyes for people to teach conservatism or any other position--but as long as you can do it with the same accurately translated bibles that everyone shares. If you need to change the bible to convince me of your position then I just won't take you seriousely. ( the You here is purely hypethetical-I mean anyone who should choose to teach me something that differes from my beliefs.)
Someone mentioned that English puritans wrote the KJV...no they didn't -they protested it and tried to blow up the houses of parliament to stop its translation. English puritans used the Geneva bible (which was calvinist). 
_____________________________
john 14 v27...do not let your hearts be troubled and do not be afraid.
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RE: conservatives want to "Conservatize" the ... - 10/6/2009 7:57:17 AM
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SonInMe1
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The last thing we need is another translation.
Its fine as it is.
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You adulterous people, don't you know that friendship with the world is hatred toward God? Anyone who chooses to be a friend of the world becomes an enemy of God.
James 4:4
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RE: conservatives want to "Conservatize" the ... - 10/6/2009 8:11:41 AM
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John_O
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quote:
ORIGINAL: relady
Bunch of loons. But I'm sure some people don't really care how accurate their version is as long as the words they like are in there. It sounds to me like they just wanna change it to suit their purposes which really makes them not much different from the "liberals" they so hate. In fact I might go so far as to call it HERESY.
You really shouldn't be accusing people of hating anyone. It's just not civil.
Even if they are somewhat misguided.
I agree with preserving the original conservative message of the bible but they are going about it all the wrong way. Thought for thought translation (Dynamic equivalence) is always incorrect. Word for word translation (formal equivalence) really is the only valid way.
(And if they go back to the KJV (or one of it's modern language formal equivalents) they are pretty much done anyway)
_____________________________
Psalms 46:10 Be still, and know that I am God: I will be exalted among the heathen, I will be exalted in the earth.
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RE: conservatives want to "Conservatize" the ... - 10/6/2009 10:20:04 AM
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ken1906_4
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From: Maryland
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Maybe scripture in it's current form doesn't line up with their conservative ideology. Well I think they are nuts. Also when doing something like this is it not appropriate to use Legitmate biblical scholars and historians? If not then this is no better than the NWT.
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"Choosing between Republicans and Democrats is like choosing between the Pharisees and Sadducees. Both are enemies of Christ."
True colors are being revealed
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RE: conservatives want to "Conservatize" the ... - 10/6/2009 10:27:36 AM
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HaveMercyonUS
Posts: 203
Joined: 8/16/2009
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quote:
ORIGINAL: sue244
Its funny that they change "Holy Ghost" to Divine Guide considering that seems to be a more liberal post modern new age term. That was the first thing I thought when I saw that they had changed that. I don't know of anyone who could really accuses the KJV of being Liberal.
Exactly what I thought when I read it. Using "Divine Guide" instead of "Holy Ghost" to me is like taking the Holy Spirit out of the Bible and sounds very much like New Age lingo.
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