|
FurGodWurLivin -> RE: I need info on IHOP with Mike Bickle! Please! (11/27/2007 2:18:25 AM)
|
Seeing as how I try to remain level-headed... this is probably going to be a legnthy response....quote:
The fact that Mike Bickle identifies himself and others as Prophets qualifies to me as a big error. Mike does not identify himself as a Prophet. A teacher, yes... part of the end-times prayer movement, yes... A Prophet of any standing? Far from it. That is what we call a "misnomer"... I'm sure you are quite familiar with the term. Now, I might be willing to discuss the matter of the Office of a Prophet in a different thread, but I believe I take issue with your definition of the same.quote:
Just FYI but that Forerunner School is non-accredited. Meaning that for all practicality that the degree is worthless. Sorry if this steps on toes, but I can not see how anyone could be fooled into spending money for a Bachelors degree that currently no other institution outside of IHOP would recognize (ie no M.Div, no Lay Ministry in other denominations, ect). I read the website faqs on Forerunner HERE and frankly the mentality that Accreditation is a hindrance scares me That is a misuderstanding of the mentality of Forerunner. The twelve apostles were believed to be "uneducated" (Acts 2), so the idea of accreditation is mostly for the benefit of the unsaved. Myself, I can see great benefit to taking four years of my life to spend studying the Bible and praying... even if the piece of paper doesn't impress a deacon board. FSM is currently in process of becoming accredited (not sure where they are IN the process, but they are in it), but they are not seeking it as a primary focus of the school... because it is a manmade stamp of approval. What is much more important to the school's faculty is that the alumni come out prepared and equipped to run after God, and teach others to do the same... not necessarily to become pastor of a megachurch. It's that simple. Were the school designed to produce denominational pastors, then yes... it is quite scary that they aren't desperate for accreditation. However, the school is more focused of getting the students to love God more... how you get a rubber stamp of education on that, I don't know. There is so much more to being a human than having everyone think you are awesome... the end-times will teach us that much (I hope).quote:
No, IHOP is not WoF, but it is (despite Mr Bickle's denials) a Latter Rain church. Actually, we are not a church, but a prayer ministry. Oh, and for the heck of it, we are not associated with the Latter Rain movement... influenced by? Somewhat, but not a part of. Now, to be specific, latter rain is a Biblical Term... even though the movement had its quirks. For example, we do agree with the LR eschatology of post-trib rapture and pre-millenial return of Christ, but we do not in any way endorse the "Manifest Sons of God" schlock.quote:
How often do people like myself have to explain our FIRST HAND experience in these matters. I might well ask you the same question. I am a staff member at the International House of Prayer. I am here, witnessing the goings on around the missions base 7 days a week. From this standpoint, I have much more experience that is actually "FIRST HAND" (as you are so adamant in pointing out) than yourself about what IHOP is trully all about. Not to make a big deal out of whatever you feel you know (or that I feel I know for that matter), because pulling rank really doesn't impress anyone as much as we think it does.quote:
I suppose you would have been against people listening to Luther, Calvin, Zwingli, and others who first tried to press the Catholic church to reform itself then, after they saw that it would not, separate from it to restore biblical truths and avoid errors. I will point out that Luther and Calvin did not want to seperate from the Catholic church, but to purify it. The problem being that many of the reformers and their followers were drummed out of the church (excommunicated being the proper term), so it looked like they seperated themselves, but they didn't actually.quote:
If you do any research whatsoever on Mike Bickle, you will find he is like the proverbial leopard who has never really changed his spots...he's still into a lot of the same things he was before he took all the heat over the Kansas City Prophets fiasco, he just calls it something else. Guilty until proven innocent..........? If you really don't believe that a man can do something good after being in something disgraced, how can you believe that men can be saved at all?quote:
After reading this, it would be interesting to see based on who has attended IHOP/read Bickle's books, or heard him speak vs those who have not. And then compare it to those who have not. Who has been blessed by IHOP's ministry? I am betting on the people who have experienced the move of God through this ministry. Just my guess. Am I correct? Have any of the naysayers been to IHOP? As noted earlier, I am a Fire in the Night internship alumnus and a staff member at the International House of Prayer. I have attended 4 of the 6 OneThing conferences, and read two of Mike's several books. From this, I know that the man doesn't travel much anymore because his main calling is to be in the prayer room (and I am witness to the man showing up in the prayer room at 6 AM no less than three days a week). I know that he preaches a brand of Eschatology that we have come to term "Apostolic Premillenialism"... I also know that he does extensive Bible study and intercession, and is teaching people to live the Sermon on the Mount lifestyle. If there is a problem with that, oh that I had such a problem.quote:
If IHOP as a whole still believes in this type of understanding for prophecy, then more so the reason to be very cautious about this group. To put that fear to rest, no, IHOP does not endorse this line of thinking. There is such a thing as getting revelation ON the Bible and WITHIN the Bible (ie, the Song of Solomon being an allegory of how God feels about the church, or connecting the ideas of God's love and God's jealousy being one and the same), but not in adding to it. The current Modus is that the there is new understanding of the Bible that comes from tagging one passage to another that we might not have thought of. This is the revealing of what is already in the Bible that we never noticed, and not adding to scripture (like the Apocrypha).quote:
I think the difference between going to a Jesus-centered worship house like IHOP and doing drugs, is one is a sin and the other lifts up Jesus and glorifies Him. **hears angels singing the Hallelujah Chorus** It is quite true, I have sat in several meetings in my time here, and I have heard much that directly contradicts people that argue against the merits of the House of Prayer. So really the difference is that I know what Mike actually says and doesn't say for myself, whereas someone who hasn't been here knows only what their friend or website told them. It's funny... we always trust people who seem to agree with us that they are reporting everything accurately and factually. It's to be expected on the one hand, but on the other, the true spirit of the Bereans was that they searched to find out if what they were being told was true. While I can appreciate the need to hold on to doctrines that we have been taught for a long time, if that doctrine turns out to be wrong, we have the potential to be devastated by holding on to it too tightly. I know beyond shadow or turning (today, anyways) that I am where I need to be for right now. Until God tells me otherwise, I am going to stay put right here.
Adam
|
|
|
|