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RE: Bad idea to pray together? - 4/6/2008 4:19:24 AM
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OLEEguacamole
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Melitac
MRSDASH,
Prayer for dating couples is NOT required but HIGHLY recommended!
RatherDashing,
You hit the nail on the head "prayer is a must for a strong relationship."
recommended by whom?
_____________________________
there's life in a pit.
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RE: Bad idea to pray together? - 4/6/2008 4:36:32 AM
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Melitac
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Not you?
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RE: Bad idea to pray together? - 4/6/2008 4:47:26 AM
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discgolfdad
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I can think of a lot worse things for a dating couple to do than Pray together.
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RE: Bad idea to pray together? - 4/6/2008 7:38:38 AM
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doer
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dating a friend, or something more serious than that......... I am a praying person!!!! I talk to the Lord many times in a day.... I LOVE HIM!!
if "she" cannot accept that about me, that's just tough... I will not fake being a non prayer for anyone, and wouldn't recommend that to anyone!!
don't EVER turn your communication with the LORD into a game.
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RE: Bad idea to pray together? - 4/6/2008 11:59:04 AM
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OLEEguacamole
Posts: 1188
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oh good grief. whose suggesting to pray less or to be fake and pretend you're not a praying person?
ther's a lot of reaction going on here.
whether one agrees with the idea that praying alone with a date has it's potential downside, or not, to suggest that anyone is promoting less of a spiritual life, is SILLY.
_____________________________
there's life in a pit.
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RE: Bad idea to pray together? - 4/6/2008 9:43:17 PM
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TMeeks
Posts: 1363
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Melitac
Teens praying??
Is is long known in this thread that it is inadvisable for "couples to pray". Heck, it's in the OP.
I don't have to show you jack smack.
Carry on the point and stop being OCD.
Sorry. But, it is exactly this kind of immaturity that prompts me to give the advice I posted. 
_____________________________
Galatians 6:7 Do not be deceived: God cannot be mocked. A man reaps what he sows. 8 The one who sows to please his sinful nature, from that nature will reap destruction; the one who sows to please the Spirit, from the Spirit will reap eternal life.
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RE: Bad idea to pray together? - 4/6/2008 9:54:29 PM
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TMeeks
Posts: 1363
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Melitac
TMeeks,
Are you a parent?
If so, how many teens have you raised?
You stated you were a youth counselor(?), do you believe in allowing teens of the opposite sex alone time together during gatherings you are in any way in charge of?
Do you believe that a teenager can be more spiritually mature than an adult?
Regarding prayer, do you pray "randomly" with people you barely know?
Do you only pray with people (men) you know?
Would you please provide scripture that "you" believe supports your position? (That prayer is dangerous/leading into sin, unless spiritually mature and with same sex.)
And don't regurgitate that nonsense about "the early church", YOU TELL ME WHERE JESUS FORBIDS IT IN SCRIPTURE.
Because that is all that matters to me and many more like me.
Thank you,
Mel~
P.S.
Still, WWJD?
JESUS would pray (console) if needed. Jesus had no problem talking with women that had ill-reputation.
This actually got Him alot of negative attention. So what of that...??
Are you saying we should not be like Jesus?
Sure sounds like it to me...
I am a father of two, now grown and married, daughters. I was a youth director of a church and a junior high teacher in a Christian school. When I teach Sunday School, it is usually the Junior High age group... and, I was an interim pastor for a year.
I care about kids and the advice I give is meant to protect them, not hurt them.
The reason the Bible doesn't speak directly about dating and praying is that dating did not exist in the time of the Bible. Parents chose the mates for their children. The children did not chose them or date to find a mate. A person mature in the Word of God would know this.
Melitac, I'm not your parent, so you can do whatever you want to do. So, let's revisit this when you've had 64 years of working with young people under your belt. If I'm not alive, then just think of me as you remember this conversation. 
< Message edited by TMeeks -- 4/6/2008 10:35:50 PM >
_____________________________
Galatians 6:7 Do not be deceived: God cannot be mocked. A man reaps what he sows. 8 The one who sows to please his sinful nature, from that nature will reap destruction; the one who sows to please the Spirit, from the Spirit will reap eternal life.
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RE: Bad idea to pray together? - 4/6/2008 10:04:49 PM
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TMeeks
Posts: 1363
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Melitac
Also,
According to scripture, "there is nothing new under the sun". So, if someone was a teenager 20, 30, 60 or even 400 years ago..the Word is as applicable TODAY as it was THEN.
Are you implying that the Word is not relevant today as it was the day It was written?
You are absolutely right, Melitac. There IS nothing new under the sun. Boys and girls have always been sexually attracted to each other because that is the way we are made.
For that reason, you will not find a SINGLE instance of a single young man praying with a single young woman in the Bible. Not one!
As a matter of fact, you'd be hard pressed to find an instance where a single young man was alone with a single young woman at all unless it was cited as a sinful encounter, as with David's son and his sister.
Because there is nothing new under the sun, the parents in the several thousands of years of Biblical history kept a very tight reign on their daughters and did not permit them to even choose their own husbands. They were chosen by the parents. If you insist on everything being done by the Biblical standard then fine. We can go back there.
You show me a single instance that a young man and a young woman prayed together, alone, in the Bible and I will tip my hat to you and declare I was wrong. Otherwise, you simply have no Biblical grounds for challenging the advice. You only have emotional grounds.
_____________________________
Galatians 6:7 Do not be deceived: God cannot be mocked. A man reaps what he sows. 8 The one who sows to please his sinful nature, from that nature will reap destruction; the one who sows to please the Spirit, from the Spirit will reap eternal life.
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RE: Bad idea to pray together? - 4/6/2008 10:28:09 PM
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TMeeks
Posts: 1363
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Melitac
In any case this is all basically about spiritual maturity when attempting to pray with another.
Not really. While SPIRITUAL maturity plays a roll, it's really about emotional maturity. And, we know that comes with age. A child's brain isn't even fully formed until 18 and the last part to be developed is the part that helps then so "NO" to temptation.
quote:
Prayer glorifies God. Plain and simple. ALL prayer.
That sounds truthful. But, it is absolutely false. To say so just plain shows a lack of Bible knowledge. The Bible specifically tells us that some of our prayers are not glorifying to God. It's in black & white.
James 4:3
Ye ask, and receive not, because ye ask amiss, that ye may consume it upon your lusts.
quote:
I am of the belief that He uses our sins to bring Him further Glory. Alot of people here don't subscrible to that school of doctrine. If you are of the other, then our discussion is over.
Here again, you demonstrate a clear lack of Biblical knowledge! Once again, the Bible directly challenges your contention! The reason a lot of people don't agree with you is that it is unScriptural. He is glorified in SPITE of our sins.
Romans 6:1-2
1 What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin, that grace may abound? 2 God forbid.
quote:
In any case,
I agree that the lost should probably not "play" prayer together.
And that is what you are really talking about....Lost people playing prayer.
But teenagers praying together....??
I'm sorry, but you are way out of touch with the world. Our problems TODAY don't come from our teens praying together, but from the LACK OF IT.
More problems are coming from the constant secular world they soak in. NOT from trying to pray to GOD together in whatever feeble way they might attempt to do so.
I never said that teens should not pray together. I said that it was not a good idea for teens to pray together ALONE. That is a HUGE distinction. I do believe that teens should pray... but, not alone in a car on a date.
quote:
How dare you attempt to undermine any attempt these kids might use to find God. How dare you.
I have already shown you that the Bible itself says that not all prayers are noble and God honoring. In fact, it even uses the term 'lust' right in that verse. I do not dare to stop young people from praying. But, I do dare to care enough to warn them that praying alone on a date is not the best idea.
quote:
You obviously do not know any teenagers or have ever really known any.
You are teaching and spreading dangerous ideas.
You are telling people (teens/youth) NOT to pray!!!!
This latter statement is just plain silly. What is obvious is that it is not ME with lack of a rich experience with either teens or the Bible in this discussion.
quote:
So in reality, you think that "lost" people should not pray together.
Thats is what you are saying, really.
No. I meant what I said. It is good advice to warn Christian young people, particularly teens, not to pray alone on a date. I stand by it based on experience, compassion and a desire than no teen be drawn into a situation that gets out of hand and causes them to sin. None.
< Message edited by TMeeks -- 4/6/2008 10:35:00 PM >
_____________________________
Galatians 6:7 Do not be deceived: God cannot be mocked. A man reaps what he sows. 8 The one who sows to please his sinful nature, from that nature will reap destruction; the one who sows to please the Spirit, from the Spirit will reap eternal life.
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RE: Bad idea to pray together? - 4/6/2008 10:39:43 PM
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TMeeks
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quote:
ORIGINAL: doer
dating a friend, or something more serious than that......... I am a praying person!!!! I talk to the Lord many times in a day.... I LOVE HIM!!
if "she" cannot accept that about me, that's just tough... I will not fake being a non prayer for anyone, and wouldn't recommend that to anyone!!
don't EVER turn your communication with the LORD into a game.
Praying is a very important part of our Christian life. And, praying spontaeously at any hour of the day or night is something that I always encourage.
In fact, I encourage young people to pray.
What I DON'T encourage... and let's get it perfectly straight... is two young people, alone in a car, praying together for an extended time.
I see nothing wrong with walking to the door of the young lady's house and saying, "Lord, thank you for this evening we had together. Amen" and having her go into her home.
What I caution against is praying alone together in a car or other private place. And, I especially discourage long prayers that include sentences regarding their relationshipship.
This is NOT about young people NOT praying. It's about the environment in which they pray.
_____________________________
Galatians 6:7 Do not be deceived: God cannot be mocked. A man reaps what he sows. 8 The one who sows to please his sinful nature, from that nature will reap destruction; the one who sows to please the Spirit, from the Spirit will reap eternal life.
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RE: Bad idea to pray together? - 4/6/2008 10:45:52 PM
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TMeeks
Posts: 1363
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quote:
ORIGINAL: discgolfdad
I can think of a lot worse things for a dating couple to do than Pray together.
So, can I and that is exactly why I advise young people NOT to pray alone together in a car. Sooner or later, they have to stop praying.
It's skydiving without a parachute. It's all exhilarating until you hit the ground.
I know how the brain works enough to understand at least a bit about bonding. And, I know enough about bonding to know at least a little bit about the chemistry that is created in bonding. And, I know enough about the chemistry that is created in bonding to know that in a young person it can set off a chain of events that they may not have the maturity to stop.
I don't want that to happen to anyone's child. Thus... my advice is to forego praying together in a car or other private place alone.
_____________________________
Galatians 6:7 Do not be deceived: God cannot be mocked. A man reaps what he sows. 8 The one who sows to please his sinful nature, from that nature will reap destruction; the one who sows to please the Spirit, from the Spirit will reap eternal life.
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RE: Bad idea to pray together? - 4/7/2008 12:00:55 AM
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TMeeks
Posts: 1363
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Melitac
You obviously do not know any teenagers or have ever really known any.
You are teaching and spreading dangerous ideas.
You are telling people (teens/youth) NOT to pray!!!!
Melitac,
The more I thought about what you wrote, the more I thought that maybe I should demonstrate that I DO know teenagers. But, first, remember, I am not talking about teens NOT praying. I simply concurred in the advice that it was not a good idea for them to pray together alone on a date. With that context, I'd like to explain my viewpoint a bit better to you.
I taught 7-9.
Most of the 7th graders at that time were about 13, if I remember correctly. They were lively and fiesty. They ran in giggling packs to the bathroom. They were just plain fun to be around.
In the 8th grade, these very same girls took a dive. They became very moody and uncooperative. To them, their parents were stupid, their teachers were stupid, school was stupid and boys in the 8th grade were stupid. In short, their parents thought their child had gone completely off the deep end.
In 9th grade, these same girls were, again, very different. Some were young ladies. Others, however, still held on to some of the moodiness and emotional attitude of the previous year. In most cases, I think this was in response to how their parents had reacted to them when they took that inevitable dive. They felt rejected. It is these girls that I want to talk about.
I taught in a Christian school and most of the kids had professed faith in Christ.
Suppose a girl, who feels rejection from her parents goes out with a guy that she thinks REALLY understands her. In fact, she thinks this guy is the ONLY one that understands her. And, they are alone in a car talking about their lives and begin to 'pray about it'.
What are they going to pray about? I'll tell you. And, the reason I can tell you is that it's the same thing I overheard in the classroom. Her parents "who don't understand her." That's what they are going to pray about!
Thus, the prayer starts out with both of them in a very emotional state before it ever gets started. "Lord, please tell my parents to let me stay out later with Joe." "Lord, let Linda know that you care how she feels and I care how she feels even if her parents don't care how she feels." Teens with feelings of rejection are going to pray prayers that build up their dependence on each other and minimize the dependence on their parents.
Teenage girls, feeling rejection, and their boyfriends, are NOT going to be praying prayers glorifying God. They are going to be praying prayers asking for relief of their pain. And, the person that they think that God has given them for relieving that pain is sitting right there beside them praying. You might think it's 'puppy love'; but, they sure don't see it that way! This is  LOVE with all caps to them.
In giving advice on a wide subject, one has to consider every level of maturity and every level of emotional stability.
Parents thinking I'm nuts are looking at their own kids and saying that couldn't be their child. But, the teen years are roller coaster years and there are so many ways for a boy or girl to feel rejected and depressed. And, when you have seen as many kids as I've seen and been with them (when they are NOT around their parents) for at least 3 years at a time, you realize that mom and dad are sometimes very clueless as to the real state of their children's emotional state and that of the person they pick as their one and only true love. (We know it's one of many. They don't! And, we fool ourselves if we think they do.)
If you only knew how many hurting boys and girls there are out there, feeling that nobody understands them. And, if you fully appreciated the emotional immaturity of the prayers that these young people pray... both in public and in private... you'd understand the danger. I urge every one that feels this advice is wrong to start listening to the prayer requests of 15 year old kids. It will astound you.
"I need prayer that my parents will let me see Jimsie when he gets out of rehab!"
"I need prayer for my parents to let me go out will MyGuy so I can help him get off drugs!"
God, to most 15 year olds... and, especially hurting ones... is somebody to ask for personal favors.
< Message edited by TMeeks -- 4/7/2008 12:18:45 AM >
_____________________________
Galatians 6:7 Do not be deceived: God cannot be mocked. A man reaps what he sows. 8 The one who sows to please his sinful nature, from that nature will reap destruction; the one who sows to please the Spirit, from the Spirit will reap eternal life.
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RE: Bad idea to pray together? - 4/7/2008 11:32:23 AM
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Focusing
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Still contemplating this thread .......
I don't think there's any question that young hormonal teenagers should be together in an intimate setting with no supervision. Praying or not, it's just not a good idea.
But ....... we need to remember that there are people of all ages who date. I believe the OP is in her late 20's, so from that perspective, would it be a bad idea for her to pray with someone she's dating? (apparently it is not a good idea is the case of the the lack-of-self-control-preacher)
How about people in their 40's or 50's or older who are mature, both spiritually and emotionally? I think that needs to be discussed in this thread as well.
There seems to be a lot of variables in the realm of dating, be it age or maturity (and one does not equate with the other), and that needs to be taken into consideration.
In my case, as I've mentioned, it does not pose a problem. It has been a blessing in our relationship. We also discuss the Bible in depth together, which I know in another thread has been declared a major no-no for people dating. Again, I think age and maturity need to be taken into consideration.
There is not a black-and-white answer to the question ....... there are as many variables as there are people.
So, perhaps we can discuss praying together as a dating couple for those who are beyond their hormonal teenage years?
_____________________________
Sam
"You're my nightcap"
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RE: Bad idea to pray together? - 4/7/2008 12:35:47 PM
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Striving2BVirtuous
Posts: 37
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quote:
ORIGINAL: mrsdash
all couples should pray. but dating couples should not pray together alone. really how is it hard to have a prayer life just because you can't pray alone with your date?
i know christian teens that are chaste and those who are not. do you or the young men realize that when most christian teens have a boyfriend they are thinking they are going to marry the guy? their perception of the bond is overinflated.
it is that conviction, that this is the guy, that often they rest on when giving up chastity. well, "i'm compromising but at least thisis the guy i'm going to marry" later they find that that guy leaves. the next guy seems like an imporvement. "THIS is the guy i'm going to marry..."
WOW!!!! (110% agree with this) Now that this topic has been put into this perspective....it is mind boggling that everyone else can not see why praying & dating should not go hand in hand. Praying for saftey during before going a road trip(out in the open)....cool....blessing a meal (out in the open)together....cool.....praying about the relationship TOGETHER & ALONE.....NEGATIVE...NOT GOOD.
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RE: Bad idea to pray together? - 4/7/2008 12:38:04 PM
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Striving2BVirtuous
Posts: 37
Joined: 3/15/2008
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quote:
ORIGINAL: TMeeks
Suppose a girl, who feels rejection from her parents goes out with a guy that she thinks REALLY understands her. In fact, she thinks this guy is the ONLY one that understands her. And, they are alone in a car talking about their lives and begin to 'pray about it'.
What are they going to pray about? I'll tell you. And, the reason I can tell you is that it's the same thing I overheard in the classroom. Her parents "who don't understand her." That's what they are going to pray about!
Teenage girls, feeling rejection, and their boyfriends, are NOT going to be praying prayers glorifying God. They are going to be praying prayers asking for relief of their pain. And, the person that they think that God has given them for relieving that pain is sitting right there beside them praying. You might think it's 'puppy love'; but, they sure don't see it that way! This is LOVE with all caps to them.
In giving advice on a wide subject, one has to consider every level of maturity and every level of emotional stability.
I AGREE!!
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RE: Bad idea to pray together? - 4/7/2008 12:50:06 PM
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Striving2BVirtuous
Posts: 37
Joined: 3/15/2008
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Focusing
Still contemplating this thread .......
I don't think there's any question that young hormonal teenagers should be together in an intimate setting with no supervision. Praying or not, it's just not a good idea.
But ....... we need to remember that there are people of all ages who date. I believe the OP is in her late 20's, so from that perspective, would it be a bad idea for her to pray with someone she's dating? (apparently it is not a good idea is the case of the the lack-of-self-control-preacher)
How about people in their 40's or 50's or older who are mature, both spiritually and emotionally? I think that needs to be discussed in this thread as well.
So, perhaps we can discuss praying together as a dating couple for those who are beyond their hormonal teenage years?
Yes I am in my late 20's and I agree with you to a certain extent. My argument is this: I do NOT feel that prayer together (beyond blessing a meal on a date) should be a part of EARLY dating when you first meet someone. I feel that praying during the EARLY stage should be done alone because you don't/won't know what this person's intentions are going to be. And this is where I will state once AGAIN: THERE ARE TOO MANY PEOPLE OUT THERE IN THE WORLD WHO USE PRAYER AS A FORM OF MANIPULATION IN AN ATTEMPT TO DRAW CLOSER TO THE OTHER PERSON TO BREAK THROUGH BARRIERS AND THERE ARE PEOPLE WHO FALL FOR THIS. ESPECIALLY OUR YOUTH AND COLLEGE AGED INDIVIDUALS. AND THESE PEOPLE END UP WITH SERIOUS EMOTIONAL SCARS AND THIS INDIVIDUAL SHOULD HAVE BEEN RELYING SOLEY ON THEIR OWN RELATIONSHIP WITH GOD TO GUIDE THE SITUATION So therefore, I feel that prayer should take place alone and that prayer should be focused more on discernment. Now this too is just my personal opinion, but I feel that a couple should conitue to pray individually (seperate from one another and alone), until after the engagement has taken place. Once an engagement has taken place and through pre-marriage couseling, THEN prayer should be introduced TOGETHER. (Again, just my opinion)
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RE: Bad idea to pray together? - 4/7/2008 2:39:58 PM
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OLEEguacamole
Posts: 1188
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teens are not the only ones vulnerable to sexual temptation. christian adults, even married adults fall often. christians working on church projects together etc.
more respect for the human tendancy and ability to bond and form attraction needs to be had.
people need to stop thinking that they are someone that would NEVER compromise. it's not a biblical perspective.
more caution. more prevention.
_____________________________
there's life in a pit.
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RE: Bad idea to pray together? - 4/7/2008 2:47:19 PM
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TMeeks
Posts: 1363
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Focusing
There is not a black-and-white answer to the question ....... there are as many variables as there are people.
So, perhaps we can discuss praying together as a dating couple for those who are beyond their hormonal teenage years?
I think that striving2bevirtuous, the OP, has pointed out the number 1 thing to look for in these situations and that is ensuring that the prayers are not manipulative.
But, as one moves from dating to being engaged, then I believe that praying together becomes an imperative. Even so, the couple needs to be sure that no manipulation masquerading as prayer is used... and, that goes for married couples as well.
_____________________________
Galatians 6:7 Do not be deceived: God cannot be mocked. A man reaps what he sows. 8 The one who sows to please his sinful nature, from that nature will reap destruction; the one who sows to please the Spirit, from the Spirit will reap eternal life.
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RE: Bad idea to pray together? - 4/7/2008 6:12:03 PM
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doer
Posts: 2752
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quote:
ORIGINAL: TMeeks
What I caution against is praying alone together in a car or other private place. And, I especially discourage long prayers that include sentences regarding their relationshipship.
This is NOT about young people NOT praying. It's about the environment in which they pray.
I still maintain that praying together is never a bad idea.
perhaps praying stupid prayers together, or manipulative prayers, prayers that are not really prayers at all is NEVER a good idea, especially in mixed company.
if you believe that it is the only way mixed company of any age can pray, then stand on your soap box and tell everyone to stop praying together.
all I can say is that I could never be interested in a relationship with a woman who was not interested or comfortable praying with me.
NOT about trashy things, or inappropriate prayer...... I am talking about acknowledging that Jesus Christ is in the very center of my life. (no room for sexual intimacy in that)
I have dated fellow believers who did not feel it was okay to pray together.......I completely respected it, but it was a deal breaker.
and to the OP
quote:
The reasoning was that praying together is almost considered just as intimate as sex. And that it makes it a little easier to cross the boundaries
a BIG principle in life is this: "you get what you're looking for"
Tit 1:15 To the pure, all things are pure; but to those who are defiled and unbelieving, nothing is pure, but both their mind and their conscience are defiled
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RE: Bad idea to pray together? - 4/7/2008 6:35:14 PM
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TMeeks
Posts: 1363
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quote:
ORIGINAL: doer
I still maintain that praying together is never a bad idea.
'Never' covers a lot of ground.
quote:
perhaps praying stupid prayers together, or manipulative prayers, prayers that are not really prayers at all is NEVER a good idea, especially in mixed company.
if you believe that it is the only way mixed company of any age can pray, then stand on your soap box and tell everyone to stop praying together.
Some arguments I appreciate and admire. "Straw Man" arguments are not among them.
quote:
all I can say is that I could never be interested in a relationship with a woman who was not interested or comfortable praying with me.
NOT about trashy things, or inappropriate prayer...... I am talking about acknowledging that Jesus Christ is in the very center of my life. (no room for sexual intimacy in that)
I have dated fellow believers who did not feel it was okay to pray together.......I completely respected it, but it was a deal breaker.
That's too bad. You may have missed the truly wise one.
Do what you are going to do and have a wonderful time. But, one that uses a term like 'never' in a behaviorally diverse, emotional diverse and age diverse context such as dating may not be seeing the whole picture in all it's ramifications.
quote:
and to the OP
quote:
original: Striving2BVirtuous
The reasoning was that praying together is almost considered just as intimate as sex. And that it makes it a little easier to cross the boundaries
a BIG principle in life is this: "you get what you're looking for"
Tit 1:15 To the pure, all things are pure; but to those who are defiled and unbelieving, nothing is pure, but both their mind and their conscience are defiled
Finally, please make sure that you apply Scripture correctly. I'm sorry; but, you've tried to score a point by completely taking a verse out of context. Doing so, in this context, in my opinion, is an utter misuse of Scripture. This passage relates to a group of false teachers (Judaizers) that were causing a great deal of trouble.
Here, for all to see, is the full context.
Titus 1:6-16
6 An elder must be blameless, the husband of but one wife, a man whose children believe and are not open to the charge of being wild and disobedient. 7 Since an overseer is entrusted with God's work, he must be blameless--not overbearing, not quick-tempered, not given to drunkenness, not violent, not pursuing dishonest gain. 8 Rather he must be hospitable, one who loves what is good, who is self-controlled, upright, holy and disciplined. 9 He must hold firmly to the trustworthy message as it has been taught, so that he can encourage others by sound doctrine and refute those who oppose it. 10 For there are many rebellious people, mere talkers and deceivers, especially those of the circumcision group. 11 They must be silenced, because they are ruining whole households by teaching things they ought not to teach--and that for the sake of dishonest gain. 12 Even one of their own prophets has said, "Cretans are always liars, evil brutes, lazy gluttons." 13 This testimony is true. Therefore, rebuke them sharply, so that they will be sound in the faith 14 and will pay no attention to Jewish myths or to the commands of those who reject the truth. 15 To the pure, all things are pure, but to those who are corrupted and do not believe, nothing is pure. In fact, both their minds and consciences are corrupted. 16 They claim to know God, but by their actions they deny him. They are detestable, disobedient and unfit for doing anything good.
To try to use that 'plucked' verse to say that anyone that is cautious and sees a potential problem looming has a defiled mind is just plain wrong. Wise Bible scholars NEVER take verses out of context simply to make a point. Sometimes 'never' is the right word to use.
< Message edited by TMeeks -- 4/7/2008 7:51:20 PM >
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Galatians 6:7 Do not be deceived: God cannot be mocked. A man reaps what he sows. 8 The one who sows to please his sinful nature, from that nature will reap destruction; the one who sows to please the Spirit, from the Spirit will reap eternal life.
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RE: Bad idea to pray together? - 4/7/2008 7:09:00 PM
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doer
Posts: 2752
Joined: 4/13/2005
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I still disagree with you, still think your opinion is a bit "out there"
think your slams on me were wonderful =) , a bit harsh, but that is just you.-
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RE: Bad idea to pray together? - 4/7/2008 7:50:12 PM
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TMeeks
Posts: 1363
Joined: 1/27/2007
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: doer
I still disagree with you, still think your opinion is a bit "out there"
think your slams on me were wonderful =) , a bit harsh, but that is just you.-
I don't care if someone disagrees with me. That makes for lively debate. But, I also care that they argue their points and keep it at that level.
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