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RE: A Christian WILL NOT Continuously Sin! - 4/16/2008 7:50:20 AM
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SonInMe1
Posts: 3644
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quote:
I see "sin" as a purposefully thought out action or thought and not something that catches you by suprise. My answer is an emphatic no!
You struggle with nothing?
_____________________________
You adulterous people, don't you know that friendship with the world is hatred toward God? Anyone who chooses to be a friend of the world becomes an enemy of God.
James 4:4
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RE: A Christian WILL NOT Continuously Sin! - 4/16/2008 9:26:33 AM
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URForgiven
Posts: 544
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Walker311
quote:
If we do not live in continual sin, then, is there any sin that challenges you? A sin you have to keep guard against all the time? A sin that pops up once in a while?
I don't know who you want to answer but personally, I see "sin" as a purposefully thought out action or thought and not something that catches you by suprise. My answer is an emphatic no!
It wasn't always this way and maybe age, years of marriage, fatherhood, and other responsibilities have helped me in this area.
When you grow in your walk with the Lord, sin is not a bull that you have to grab by the horns, it should become like a skeeter. They can draw a little blood but you can always smash em. I hate blood sucking skeeters and their little demon buddies.
You are assuming that everyone's life experience is the same as your own, and that simply is not true. Everyone has their own demons, their own weaknesses. When I see the circumstances some people have come from, it is amazing that they could ever be Christlike in any way.
I have known many Christians who have struggled with the same sin their whole lives. And you know what? God uses that. God can even use the sin in our lives, and sometimes that sin is continual...sometimes that sin never goes away.
Do not limit God. I have seen the results of continual sin in Christians life, and it is not always the result you would expect. I have seen that sin used to humble Christians, who without it would be unbearably overbearing. I have seen great intellects kept in check by the knowledge of their own sinfulness. God uses it as a thorn in their side, to keep them humble.
Do not judge your brother by yourself. We all have our own demons, we all have our own struggles, and God, in His wisdom, uses everything to His glory, including our sin.
_____________________________
The sin of the world is unbelief.
"I am a Believer, it is impossible for me to be an unbeliever."
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RE: A Christian WILL NOT Continuously Sin! - 4/16/2008 12:48:31 PM
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drmark
Posts: 3165
Joined: 7/10/2006
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quote:
quote:
If we do not live in continual sin, then, is there any sin that challenges you? A sin you have to keep guard against all the time? A sin that pops up once in a while? I don't know who you want to answer but personally, I see "sin" as a purposefully thought out action or thought and not something that catches you by suprise. My answer is an emphatic no! I quite agree with Walker on this issue. James 1 describes clearly the progression of temptation to full-blown sin. There's no doubt that Satan knows our greatest weaknesses and may exploit them at times.
In my own life, for example, sexual immorality is not something I struggle with at present, but I do sometimes feel tempted to place myself in a better light than others to maintain self-esteem. That then becomes an area where Satan can do some serious damage if I choose to relinquish God's grace and allow my will to overpower the Holy Spirit. So by recognizing my personal "sin challenges", I can draw closer to God at those times when I need Him more to stay pure. Does that make sense?
_____________________________
Jeremiah 31:31-34. The time is NOW, fellow saints!
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RE: A Christian WILL NOT Continuously Sin! - 4/16/2008 1:28:12 PM
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yustme
Posts: 328
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Walker311
Ro:6:1: What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin, that grace may abound?
Ro:6:2: God forbid. How shall we, that are dead to sin, live any longer therein?
Ro:6:3: Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death?
Ro:6:4: Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.
Ro:6:5: For if we have been planted together in the likeness of his death, we shall be also in the likeness of his resurrection:
Ro:6:6: Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin.
Ro:6:7: For he that is dead is freed from sin.
Do you believe that a Christian can continuously sin?
I'm not talking about a new Christian who doesn't know any better. Maybe not among the regulars that post here, but I believe that you would be very surprised at the number of Christians who believe that The Blood covers continuous and unrepentant sin.
Why would they believe this? Maybe they do not truly understand sin and what the bible says about it. Maybe they have continuous sin in their own lives or in the lives of family members and do not want to believe that they will be judged.
So, let me redefine some thoughts here. Also, I do not list any particular sin because we are familiar with them all.
I do not believe that a truly born again Christian will continue to knowingly sin. It is impossible in my opinion.
I do not believe a person is born-again if he/she continuously and unrepentantly sins.
Now, do you agree with the following statement? Why or why not.
A Christian WILL NOT Continuously Sin.
People are being taught that when we come to Christ,He forgives us for our past,present and future sins.This is not true.He forgives for our PAST sins.
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RE: A Christian WILL NOT Continuously Sin! - 4/16/2008 1:37:24 PM
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URForgiven
Posts: 544
Joined: 3/22/2008
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quote:
ORIGINAL: yustme
quote:
ORIGINAL: Walker311
Ro:6:1: What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin, that grace may abound?
Ro:6:2: God forbid. How shall we, that are dead to sin, live any longer therein?
Ro:6:3: Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death?
Ro:6:4: Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.
Ro:6:5: For if we have been planted together in the likeness of his death, we shall be also in the likeness of his resurrection:
Ro:6:6: Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin.
Ro:6:7: For he that is dead is freed from sin.
Do you believe that a Christian can continuously sin?
I'm not talking about a new Christian who doesn't know any better. Maybe not among the regulars that post here, but I believe that you would be very surprised at the number of Christians who believe that The Blood covers continuous and unrepentant sin.
Why would they believe this? Maybe they do not truly understand sin and what the bible says about it. Maybe they have continuous sin in their own lives or in the lives of family members and do not want to believe that they will be judged.
So, let me redefine some thoughts here. Also, I do not list any particular sin because we are familiar with them all.
I do not believe that a truly born again Christian will continue to knowingly sin. It is impossible in my opinion.
I do not believe a person is born-again if he/she continuously and unrepentantly sins.
Now, do you agree with the following statement? Why or why not.
A Christian WILL NOT Continuously Sin.
People are being taught that when we come to Christ,He forgives us for our past,present and future sins.This is not true.He forgives for our PAST sins.
All of your sins were in the future when Christ shed His blood on the cross.
_____________________________
The sin of the world is unbelief.
"I am a Believer, it is impossible for me to be an unbeliever."
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RE: A Christian WILL NOT Continuously Sin! - 4/16/2008 1:52:23 PM
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yustme
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Read Romans 3:25.Pay attention to the words "Sins that are past."No where in the Bible does it say we are forgiven for our past,present,and future sins.The forgivness is there,but only if we repent and ask for forgiveness.
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RE: A Christian WILL NOT Continuously Sin! - 4/16/2008 2:09:31 PM
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drmark
Posts: 3165
Joined: 7/10/2006
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quote:
quote:
People are being taught that when we come to Christ,He forgives us for our past,present and future sins.This is not true.He forgives for our PAST sins. All of your sins were in the future when Christ shed His blood on the cross What yustme is referring to is the incorrect doctrine of automatic forgiveness of (future) sins by previously saved Christians. This is basically just a poor way to rationalize OSAS theology (also incorrect), and as pointed out has no basis in Scripture.
_____________________________
Jeremiah 31:31-34. The time is NOW, fellow saints!
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RE: A Christian WILL NOT Continuously Sin! - 4/16/2008 2:17:43 PM
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URForgiven
Posts: 544
Joined: 3/22/2008
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quote:
ORIGINAL: yustme
Read Romans 3:25.Pay attention to the words "Sins that are past."No where in the Bible does it say we are forgiven for our past,present,and future sins.The forgivness is there,but only if we repent and ask for forgiveness.
ALL of your sins were in the future when Christ shed His blood on the cross.
_____________________________
The sin of the world is unbelief.
"I am a Believer, it is impossible for me to be an unbeliever."
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RE: A Christian WILL NOT Continuously Sin! - 4/16/2008 2:19:20 PM
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URForgiven
Posts: 544
Joined: 3/22/2008
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quote:
ORIGINAL: drmark
quote:
quote:
People are being taught that when we come to Christ,He forgives us for our past,present and future sins.This is not true.He forgives for our PAST sins. All of your sins were in the future when Christ shed His blood on the cross What yustme is referring to is the incorrect doctrine of automatic forgiveness of (future) sins by previously saved Christians. This is basically just a poor way to rationalize OSAS theology (also incorrect), and as pointed out has no basis in Scripture.
Salvation IS the receiving of ETERNAL LIFE. ..not the forgiveness of sins.
_____________________________
The sin of the world is unbelief.
"I am a Believer, it is impossible for me to be an unbeliever."
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RE: A Christian WILL NOT Continuously Sin! - 4/16/2008 3:09:02 PM
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yustme
Posts: 328
Joined: 5/2/2007
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I know that.But when we were born,we were not automaticly save.When we came to the understanding of what sin was and we knowingly commited sin,we needed to ask for forgivness.That's why He went to the Cross and shed His blood.I can't ask the Lord to forgive me for a sin I haven't commited.BTW,a sin is a wilfull transgression against the Lord.Knowing to do right yet not doing it.
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RE: A Christian WILL NOT Continuously Sin! - 4/16/2008 3:27:10 PM
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drmark
Posts: 3165
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quote:
Salvation IS the receiving of ETERNAL LIFE. ..not the forgiveness of sins. Actually, you cannot have one without the other, URForgiven. We are saved from sin unto eternal life. There will be no sin in heaven, will there?
_____________________________
Jeremiah 31:31-34. The time is NOW, fellow saints!
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RE: A Christian WILL NOT Continuously Sin! - 4/16/2008 3:34:53 PM
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yustme
Posts: 328
Joined: 5/2/2007
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quote:
ORIGINAL: URForgiven
quote:
ORIGINAL: drmark
quote:
quote:
People are being taught that when we come to Christ,He forgives us for our past,present and future sins.This is not true.He forgives for our PAST sins. All of your sins were in the future when Christ shed His blood on the cross What yustme is referring to is the incorrect doctrine of automatic forgiveness of (future) sins by previously saved Christians. This is basically just a poor way to rationalize OSAS theology (also incorrect), and as pointed out has no basis in Scripture.
Salvation IS the receiving of ETERNAL LIFE. ..not the forgiveness of sins.
That doesn't make sense to me."Salvation IS the receiving of ETERNAL LIFE..not the forgiveness of sins."?Explain that please.
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RE: A Christian WILL NOT Continuously Sin! - 4/16/2008 4:01:56 PM
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URForgiven
Posts: 544
Joined: 3/22/2008
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: yustme
quote:
ORIGINAL: URForgiven
quote:
ORIGINAL: drmark
quote:
quote:
People are being taught that when we come to Christ,He forgives us for our past,present and future sins.This is not true.He forgives for our PAST sins. All of your sins were in the future when Christ shed His blood on the cross What yustme is referring to is the incorrect doctrine of automatic forgiveness of (future) sins by previously saved Christians. This is basically just a poor way to rationalize OSAS theology (also incorrect), and as pointed out has no basis in Scripture.
Salvation IS the receiving of ETERNAL LIFE. ..not the forgiveness of sins.
That doesn't make sense to me."Salvation IS the receiving of ETERNAL LIFE..not the forgiveness of sins."?Explain that please.
Forgiveness of sins is only half of the Gospel.
When canning do you sterilize the jars just to have really, really clean jars? Or do you sterilize the jars because you want to put something precious into them, something that you do not want to spoil?
_____________________________
The sin of the world is unbelief.
"I am a Believer, it is impossible for me to be an unbeliever."
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RE: A Christian WILL NOT Continuously Sin! - 4/16/2008 4:04:55 PM
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URForgiven
Posts: 544
Joined: 3/22/2008
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: drmark
quote:
Salvation IS the receiving of ETERNAL LIFE. ..not the forgiveness of sins. Actually, you cannot have one without the other, URForgiven. We are saved from sin unto eternal life. There will be no sin in heaven, will there?
You DO not have one without the other. IN Christ is forgiveness of sins and eternal life. When you get Him, you get it all.
_____________________________
The sin of the world is unbelief.
"I am a Believer, it is impossible for me to be an unbeliever."
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RE: A Christian WILL NOT Continuously Sin! - 4/16/2008 4:16:53 PM
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yustme
Posts: 328
Joined: 5/2/2007
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Thanks for explaining that.However,when I came to Christ He forgave me of my PAST sins and promised me eternal Life IF I was willing to continue in Him.
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RE: A Christian WILL NOT Continuously Sin! - 4/16/2008 4:20:16 PM
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URForgiven
Posts: 544
Joined: 3/22/2008
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quote:
ORIGINAL: yustme
Thanks for explaining that.However,when I came to Christ He forgave me of my PAST sins and promised me eternal Life IF I was willing to continue in Him.
ALL of your sins were in the future when Christ shed His blood on the cross.
_____________________________
The sin of the world is unbelief.
"I am a Believer, it is impossible for me to be an unbeliever."
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RE: A Christian WILL NOT Continuously Sin! - 4/16/2008 4:37:54 PM
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ta_mosquito
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MODERATOR'S NOTE :: ATTENTION PLEASE
Please take the discussion about whether our past, present, AND future sins are forgiven to THIS THREAD as it's off topic here.
Thanks!
Tricia
Forums Moderator
Please do not reply to this message within the forums or chat.
Please email Community@salemwebnetwork.com with questions, comments, or concerns.
Please do not send me PMs regarding this message.
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RE: A Christian WILL NOT Continuously Sin! - 4/16/2008 7:08:16 PM
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jlp1
Posts: 121
Joined: 4/4/2008
From: Chicago
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When we willfully sin as in living together, fornication, adultery, ect .... you are making a choice to go against God's will. You can't repent after every time and then go the next day, week, or month and continually sin in the same fashion. You are then doing what you want to do by your own will. When you do sin and we will you must feel remorseful and repent and not sin anymore even if its fornication, adultery, ect...
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RE: A Christian WILL NOT Continuously Sin! - 4/16/2008 7:23:57 PM
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Walker311
Posts: 1859
Joined: 4/11/2005
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quote:
You can't repent after every time and then go the next day, week, or month and continually sin in the same fashion. You are then doing what you want to do by your own will.
Most people would say people doing this are not Christians. I say that many Christians, including myself, have tried this lifestyle cycle with God and hence, the title of this thread...
A Christian WILL NOT Continuously Sin!
We can't continue in sin. IT IS IMPOSSIBLE! A Christian will eventually be nudged by the Holy Spirit to get his act together or.... else! I have not seen "ELSE" yet because I know the Holy Spirit gets tired of nudging after awhile.
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RE: A Christian WILL NOT Continuously Sin! - 4/16/2008 9:12:21 PM
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SonInMe1
Posts: 3644
Joined: 4/16/2005
From: my mom by God
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quote:
However,when I came to Christ He forgave me of my PAST sins and promised me eternal Life IF I was willing to continue in Him.
Please define "continue in Him".
Sin isn't just adultry and murder. Its the little lie that keeps your job. Its not submitting to authority. Its a million little things..and big things we ALL do everyday.
We ALL sin continiously. There are no perfect people or christians. We don't however let sin control us. We have an advocate with the Father to take our sins to, to give our sins to Him and to define what sin is. Inside of us is the Councilor, to guide us from sin, to educate us to what sin is and to get us closer to God.
When we are saved we no longer "are" sinners, we no longer are under the YOKE of sin, we are free from the POWER of sin BUT there is no doubt that salvation does not bring perfection.
Its no wonder someone who does not believe in OSAS denies the FACT they still sin. They have to be PERFECT or they lose their salvation, always looking around the corner worrying if their sin will finally be exposed or that their sin will lose their salvation.
What a terrible guilt. A terrible burden. These people are not freed from the yoke of sin because they deny they do sin....or redefine sin so their sins do not apply anymore.
I struggle with a buncha sins. I suspect that even these perfect christians have a few struggles in their lives. Things that are always there. Things that take time to get over or to be controlled.
What do we have to be sanctified from if there is nothing challenging us? Is there a checklist where you sin, check it off the lst and then never have to worry about it again?
Why is there forgiveness? Do we forgive people of righteous acts? Are we forgiven when we are in perfect obediance to God? Of course not. We forgive and are forgiven of...yep....sins. Kinda hard to give or recieve forgiveness if you are perfect.....esspecially those 7 times 77 times.
Repentence...you know the deal...how can perfect christians repent? I don't think they can.
So, no doubt we do continiously sin. Wether its a lot or a little, the same one or different ones, we all, ALL fall short.
Ok. Then, what is the Good News? We don't have to sin. Our sins have been taken care of. There are porocesses to deal with sin in our lives. Sin has been defined and we have been educated on how to deal with it and to stop it.
We, as saved people are not under the YOKE of sin. It may not have any power in our lives....unless we give it power. It IS a choice.
Unfortunatley we are in this flesh and our perspective is clouded by it. Why have glorified bodies at the ressurection if...we did not need it? If we can become sinless here, there would be NO need for a glorified body. Our perceptions would already be formed here and besides the physical requirements of eternal life, we would need nothing in heaven.
I am sorry but when my body is glorified, I WILL NEED IT.
_____________________________
You adulterous people, don't you know that friendship with the world is hatred toward God? Anyone who chooses to be a friend of the world becomes an enemy of God.
James 4:4
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RE: A Christian WILL NOT Continuously Sin! - 4/16/2008 9:16:08 PM
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SonInMe1
Posts: 3644
Joined: 4/16/2005
From: my mom by God
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By the way I was in a holiness church once...preaching the sinless chriostian life. Always denying our natures and pretending.
Funny thing though...that pastor fell hard took a buncha people with him. Law suits and adultries and thievery.
Yeah, sounds like "perfect" christians to me.
_____________________________
You adulterous people, don't you know that friendship with the world is hatred toward God? Anyone who chooses to be a friend of the world becomes an enemy of God.
James 4:4
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RE: A Christian WILL NOT Continuously Sin! - 4/16/2008 9:40:59 PM
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jlp1
Posts: 121
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From: Chicago
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so, if i'm a christian I *will* not fornicate, lie, commit adultery, ect..? because anyone can fall, many have, but as long as they repent and *don't do it anymore*, or is it a one time, one sin deal and you are out of the grace of God?
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RE: A Christian WILL NOT Continuously Sin! - 4/16/2008 10:00:39 PM
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Walker311
Posts: 1859
Joined: 4/11/2005
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SonInMe1 said:
quote:
We ALL sin continiously. There are no perfect people or christians. We don't however let sin control us.
I am not going to pick apart all that you said previously but this one statement here pretty much sums up your previous post and it is an extreme contradiction of how a Christian CAN live and is NOT supported by scripture.
Check this out... You introduce yourself to a non-Christian and feel led to witness to this person and here is what you say...
"Though Jesus Christ gave His life for you and I, taught us, showed us how to live, and then was crucified on the cross for our sins, we all sin continuously but we wait... there's more... we don't let sin control us"
I'm really suprised at you!
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RE: A Christian WILL NOT Continuously Sin! - 4/17/2008 8:02:18 AM
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SonInMe1
Posts: 3644
Joined: 4/16/2005
From: my mom by God
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quote:
how a Christian CAN live and is NOT supported by scripture.
Sin is not condined scripturally and neither do I condone it.
I also live in the real world.
quote:
Though Jesus Christ gave His life for you and I, taught us, showed us how to live, and then was crucified on the cross for our sins, we all sin continuously but we wait... there's more... we don't let sin control us"
This would be an issue discussed between more mature christians I think than to a new or seeking person.
We also differ in the definition of what constitutes continuous sins. There is a difference, I think, between continious sin and those who sin continiously, or maybe a better defintion would be, those who are imperfect.
If I wallow in sin, and don't care if its wrong or even a sin, then I think there is a problem.
If I have certain sins, or an attitude, like a poor fruit of the spirit, that just gets me all the time, then that is different. Take..self control.
This is one fruit of the spirit I continiously struggle with. Its not always manifested in the same way, but a lot of my sin comes from a lack of self control. It could be temper one time, or lust, or gluttony. I might have a problem for an hour, or a second or for a week or for months.
Think about it...you had 300 sexual partners before you met Jesus. Think that just goes away? How about...smoking? Drinking? How about...them all? Throw in some drugs too.
These things don't disappear. Sometimes, yes God just wipes the slate clean and people never go back to those things. It does happen, but it does not happen all the time.
Its not about will power either. Will power denies God and involves pride. Is there commitment? Certainly. Even sacrifice and struggle and the old nose to the grindstone...I understand all of that well. I doubt you will ever meet someone with a more accomplishment orientated personality than mine.....
but there are things I CANNOT do.
I have prayed and prayed. I know the bible. I have repented and forgiven and asked for forgiveness.
Some....things....God....has...to....do.
Maybe you are blessed. Maybe God allows you to be next to sinless....
maybe God allows me to be sinful in order that His Grace might be manifest.
I often wonder if my witness is the Bizzaro Witness. The opposite witness. The, " if God let that guy be saved then anyone can be saved " witness.
Again I don't condone any sin ever, but I also don't have the mind of God. I don't know why it seems others do not struggle with sin and I do.
I love Jesus. I'd be dead without Him. I would be sick. I would have no future at all without Jesus but ya know something else?
I ain't dead yet. I cannot give up. ( Counter to some here who believe you can walk away from God to me, that is an impossibility. ) The race is not done and I will win that race not because I can do it. If anything my life is a witness to His power and not mine....
and as bad as I am, I am a whole lot better than I was. There is no doubt there has been change in me...the saving kind. So much so that my dad, who saw the change in me, stated it was a big reason why he came to the Lord at 67.
I just cannot proclaim perfection or a next to sinless state because...that would be a sin and not just because it is a lie.
_____________________________
You adulterous people, don't you know that friendship with the world is hatred toward God? Anyone who chooses to be a friend of the world becomes an enemy of God.
James 4:4
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