Police Found Not Guilty in Sean Bell Case (Full Version)

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Stratplayer -> Police Found Not Guilty in Sean Bell Case (4/25/2008 9:56:53 AM)

Breaking News!



earthless -> RE: Police Found Not Guilty in Sean Bell Case (4/25/2008 10:27:17 AM)

Thumbs up



earthless -> RE: Police Found Not Guilty in Sean Bell Case (4/25/2008 10:29:42 AM)

"One woman shouted at a black police officer, "How can you be proud to wear that uniform? Stand down! Stop working for the masters!""

And some people wonder why their gang banger kids don't respect the police, teachers, much less any authority figure.... and these are the same people crying on the news about their "honor roll student" getting shot at 2:00 AM, on a school night, while he was shooting dice.



1dblthnk02 -> RE: Police Found Not Guilty in Sean Bell Case (4/25/2008 10:32:22 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: earthless
Thumbs up

Oh, definitely.

Hope they do it again . . .



1dblthnk02 -> RE: Police Found Not Guilty in Sean Bell Case (4/25/2008 10:34:08 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: earthless
and these are the same people crying on the news about their "honor roll student" getting shot at 2:00 AM, on a school night, while he was shooting dice.

Oh, definitely. Someone should get shot for rolling dice at 2 am while black.



Stratplayer -> RE: Police Found Not Guilty in Sean Bell Case (4/25/2008 10:35:55 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: earthless

Thumbs up


You think it's cool for police to shoot someone 50 times?



earthless -> RE: Police Found Not Guilty in Sean Bell Case (4/25/2008 10:37:26 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: 1dblthnk02

quote:

ORIGINAL: earthless
and these are the same people crying on the news about their "honor roll student" getting shot at 2:00 AM, on a school night, while he was shooting dice.

Oh, definitely. Someone should get shot for rolling dice at 2 am while black.


Nice use of sarcasm. My example was a real one from a shooting a few days ago on Chicago's south side - the kid that was shot had a long rap sheet, priors, never went to school, and was out gambling at 2:00 AM, on a school night - but I guess that is OK for a 17 year old to do.



earthless -> RE: Police Found Not Guilty in Sean Bell Case (4/25/2008 10:40:43 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Stratplayer

quote:

ORIGINAL: earthless

Thumbs up


You think it's cool for police to shoot someone 50 times?


The guy was a felon with priors related to gun crimes and drug dealing (nation business). I am not ever going to place a criminal above an officer, never. Bell was a criminal, his friends were criminals, they were patronizing a place that was under investigation by the NYPD for drugs, guns, and prostitution.

If it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck, it may just be a duck. It's unfortunate, what happened, but it will be worse once "Reverends" and Poverty Pimps machine starts up (if it hasn't already) and we have another Crown Heights on our hands.



mapachito13 -> RE: Police Found Not Guilty in Sean Bell Case (4/25/2008 10:42:55 AM)

If I was leaving a strip club at 2am and saw a guy in regular clothes pulling out a gun, I'd try to get out of there too!

The only muzzle flash these cops saw was their own. How can they justify this barrage without being shot at? One of them even had to reload? This was literally overkill!



earthless -> RE: Police Found Not Guilty in Sean Bell Case (4/25/2008 10:51:40 AM)

Just to shed some light to those who do not know and are resorting to emotional appeals... These guys did not listen to lawful commands (again the problem of people not respecting authority figures).

As for being "unarmed"? He tried to run over the cops with his car, which is a deadly weapon and a felony. A lot of people seem to be ignorant to the fact that once you object to lawful commands, you are now an arrestable subject. No one, absolutely no one, has the right to resist arrest. It may be unlawful, but that is something you can fight over in a court room.

And once you use your vehicle in any form of aggression towards the police - it is akin to having pulled out a gun and taken a shot at them.



drnick -> RE: Police Found Not Guilty in Sean Bell Case (4/25/2008 10:54:41 AM)

I'm struggling to understand how emptying your gun, pausing to reload, and then doing it again, isn't excessive.

Lets face it, the cops panicked. And that led to the death of this man. It's irrelevant whether he was an honours student or a perp with a rap sheet a mile long - I doubt the cops knew that at the time - they messed up big time and have got away with it.



elastic -> RE: Police Found Not Guilty in Sean Bell Case (4/25/2008 11:05:36 AM)

i'm very happy with the verdict. i feel that justice was served.

Bell had been arrested three times, twice for drug dealing and once for a firearms possession. Bell had sold crack cocaine twice to a confidential police informant in August of 2006. Joseph Guzman was arrested nine times and Trent Benefield three times. Each one of them had been arrested at least once for illegal firearm possession. Benefield was also arrested at one point for hitting his child’s mother.

They tried to run over a cop, the same cop you would call if you knew your neighbors sold crack and had guns. None of you would introduce anyone of these guys to your daughter in hopes they would marry. You all probably decry that the police don’t rid the streets of criminals and yet when one of them gets killed through his own doing, you vilify the police and make saints of the criminals. These men were no saints.

as i said earlier, i am very very happy with the outcome of the trial.



HighPlainsDrifter -> RE: Police Found Not Guilty in Sean Bell Case (4/25/2008 11:54:08 AM)

quote:

I'm struggling to understand how emptying your gun, pausing to reload, and then doing it again, isn't excessive.


I'm wondering that too after reading the story. Sometimes the gangsters are wearing blue. [8|]



WesP -> RE: Police Found Not Guilty in Sean Bell Case (4/25/2008 1:31:08 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: HighPlainsDrifter

quote:

I'm struggling to understand how emptying your gun, pausing to reload, and then doing it again, isn't excessive.


I'm wondering that too after reading the story. Sometimes the gangsters are wearing blue. [8|]


What I'm wondering is: does anyone consider hitting someone with a car and then ramming a police vehicle with said car to be excessive? I would think that I would do whatever was necessary to protect myself if someone tried to run me down. Were the cops hyped up? Sure! How would you feel after being hit by a car? Upset? Non-chalant? One cannot do what the driver did and be deemed peaceful.



earthless -> RE: Police Found Not Guilty in Sean Bell Case (4/25/2008 1:57:40 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: WesSavedByGrace

quote:

ORIGINAL: HighPlainsDrifter

quote:

I'm struggling to understand how emptying your gun, pausing to reload, and then doing it again, isn't excessive.


I'm wondering that too after reading the story. Sometimes the gangsters are wearing blue. [8|]


What I'm wondering is: does anyone consider hitting someone with a car and then ramming a police vehicle with said car to be excessive? I would think that I would do whatever was necessary to protect myself if someone tried to run me down. Were the cops hyped up? Sure! How would you feel after being hit by a car? Upset? Non-chalant? One cannot do what the driver did and be deemed peaceful.


Exactly - it's assault with a deadly weapon/attempted murder (using a car to harm someone). In that same situation I would have unloaded all of my clips as well until the threat stopped.



mapachito13 -> RE: Police Found Not Guilty in Sean Bell Case (4/25/2008 2:18:53 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: WesSavedByGrace

quote:

ORIGINAL: HighPlainsDrifter

quote:

I'm struggling to understand how emptying your gun, pausing to reload, and then doing it again, isn't excessive.


I'm wondering that too after reading the story. Sometimes the gangsters are wearing blue. [8|]


What I'm wondering is: does anyone consider hitting someone with a car and then ramming a police vehicle with said car to be excessive? I would think that I would do whatever was necessary to protect myself if someone tried to run me down. Were the cops hyped up? Sure! How would you feel after being hit by a car? Upset? Non-chalant? One cannot do what the driver did and be deemed peaceful.


There was a question though whether the police properly identified themselves. How would you react if some people approached your car with a gun drawn and NOT wearing a uniform?

If a policeman did that to me, he had better have his sheild visible or depending on where he's at in relation to my car, I'd be aiming my only means of self-defense at him too! Anyone can say they are a cop without showing a badge.

Irregardless, 50 shots is excessive. It's this trigger happy mentality by police that causes distrust in the community!



Jhud -> RE: Police Found Not Guilty in Sean Bell Case (4/25/2008 2:25:19 PM)

I think the question really has to do with using lethal force; when an officer fires his gun, he intends to kill you, so I am not sure I understand the 'excessive' part of this - I mean once you're dead, what number of bullets is excessive?

If there is an argument against an officer firing a gun at all in this case, that is one thing, but the excessive argument wouldn't seem to fly.



mapachito13 -> RE: Police Found Not Guilty in Sean Bell Case (4/25/2008 2:40:08 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Jhud

I think the question really has to do with using lethal force; when an officer fires his gun, he intends to kill you, so I am not sure I understand the 'excessive' part of this - I mean once you're dead, what number of bullets is excessive?

If there is an argument against an officer firing a gun at all in this case, that is one thing, but the excessive argument wouldn't seem to fly.


I'm sorry I actually am questioning the officer's justification for firing the FIRST shot. But then, police officer's actions shouldn't be second guessed that would make me anti-law and order!

Now I admit I wasn't there so we'll never truly know what happened. But then again, cops NEVER lie, do they? [;)]



WesP -> RE: Police Found Not Guilty in Sean Bell Case (4/25/2008 2:40:22 PM)

quote:

There was a question though whether the police properly identified themselves. How would you react if some people approached your car with a gun drawn and NOT wearing a uniform?


So, do you convict on a maybe?

quote:

Irregardless, 50 shots is excessive. It's this trigger happy mentality by police that causes distrust in the community!


I believe that anyone who pulls a gun is ready to shoot to kill. It really does not matter how many times you "kill" someone. Once is enough if they are dead, but how much movement was still going on during the gunfire? Two of the men did not die. Were they completely still during this escapade? What would the officers think of the movement? What is the point at which it becomes an extreme?



WesP -> RE: Police Found Not Guilty in Sean Bell Case (4/25/2008 2:41:40 PM)

quote:

Now I admit I wasn't there so we'll never truly know what happened. But then again, cops NEVER lie, do they?


Nope, and neither do people at strip clubs. [&:]



earthless -> RE: Police Found Not Guilty in Sean Bell Case (4/25/2008 2:44:10 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Jhud

I think the question really has to do with using lethal force; when an officer fires his gun, he intends to kill you, so I am not sure I understand the 'excessive' part of this - I mean once you're dead, what number of bullets is excessive?

If there is an argument against an officer firing a gun at all in this case, that is one thing, but the excessive argument wouldn't seem to fly.



Especially when Bell was not unarmed. He was ramming their van with his car and also hit one of the officers with his car. He has a 4,000 pound weapon!! Last year 10 police officers were killed in vehicular assault.

And there is no rule for how many shots are too many when you're trying to disengage a mortal threat.



earthless -> RE: Police Found Not Guilty in Sean Bell Case (4/25/2008 2:45:51 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: WesSavedByGrace

quote:

Now I admit I wasn't there so we'll never truly know what happened. But then again, cops NEVER lie, do they?


Nope, and neither do people at strip clubs. [&:]



With a rap sheet the size of the Old Testament, with prior hang gun felonies, coming out of a known drug & prostitution house.

It's easy to second guess when you don't realize how fast a split second is when you have a situation of life and death like this.



lightshineon -> RE: Police Found Not Guilty in Sean Bell Case (4/25/2008 3:54:57 PM)

you, know it is just sad, all the way around. Sad the kid on his wedding day, did what he did, I am not that fimilar with the story. If he was a thug, he is still a dead thug, sad. Twenty-three is young, so young. The detectives, were sad, and emotionally effected, one said ' sorry to the family' blinking back tears. they had the right, with what I understand, to have done the shooting, but also realized I am sure it was a horrible mistake, he was unarmed. It is just sad, and tragic.



Leslie_JnJs_mom -> RE: Police Found Not Guilty in Sean Bell Case (4/25/2008 6:41:27 PM)

I feel for the police. I could care less that the city has one less criminal. You cannot go around trying to run police over and get away with it. The police on the other hand are in a no win situation. If they do what they have to and someone is hurt or killed people are screaming in the street. If they are gentle and a criminal gets away and later kills people, there are still people screaming in the street. I have heard a lifetime of these stories from my neighbor. He was a police officer in El Paso, tx, went on to be a detective and then moved here and was our sheriff. The stories of people expecting police to be perfect at catching criminals while no one ever gets hurt are sad. I am more of a mind to let the police do thier jobs.



redeemedsaint -> RE: Police Found Not Guilty in Sean Bell Case (4/25/2008 6:50:44 PM)

Justice was served.



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