Will FL. adn MI delegates be enough to bump BO? (Full Version)

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Leslie_JnJs_mom -> Will FL. adn MI delegates be enough to bump BO? (4/27/2008 7:43:39 PM)

I cant find the story now of course but this morning on the news they were discussing how hard HC is working to get those delegates counted. I wonder if that is enough to unseat BO from being the frontrunner. I keep changing which one I am rooting for. I want the one that is going to be easier to beat come Nov.[:D]



tracydolls -> RE: Will FL. adn MI delegates be enough to bump BO? (4/27/2008 8:31:17 PM)

No , even if they seat those delegates, she still will not be ahead, I think is what I heard. How can she justify seating though? In Michigan he was not on ballet, and over 2 million of the 4 million Democrats did not vote in Fla because they wer'e told it don't count anyways.

At this point anyone can beat these 2 idiots, I'm so sick of them I could cry.



wing2000 -> RE: Will FL. adn MI delegates be enough to bump BO? (4/27/2008 10:35:17 PM)

yea...hillary reminds me of the kid in grade school who always wanted to change the rules after the kick ball game had started. The fact that she still wants to seat the MI and FL delegates after all this time speaks to the kind of ethics she would practice as President.



inthysite -> RE: Will FL. adn MI delegates be enough to bump BO? (4/27/2008 11:40:52 PM)

No matter what happens Hillary cannot overtake Barack in the delegate count, even if MI and FL are seated.

However, and this is what Hillary is counting on, if MI and FL are seated then Hillary can overtake Barack in the popular vote, depending on what happens in the rest of the primaries.

This is why Howard Dean is so adamant about getting the Super Delegates to make known their decision now or at least no later than June 3rd. He does not want this to go to the convention because then it forces the issue of MI and FL.

The Democrats have always been the party of 'every vote counts' and always, always charged the Republicans with disenfranchising voters. So if they don't seat MI and FL then those voters are disenfranchised. If they do seat them, then the ones who didn't vote because they were told their votes wouldn't count will be disenfranchised. It's a lose/lose situation.

But the bottom line is the Democrats cannot go to the convention and not seat MI and FL. This will kill them in the general. If they don't seat them watch how these two states vote in the general. Remember, it was FL that basically gave Bush the victory in 2000.



lightshineon -> RE: Will FL. adn MI delegates be enough to bump BO? (4/27/2008 11:41:54 PM)

What if neither one wins. I am serious this could go on forever, through the courts. Reminds me of the movie Gladiator, where Comidus (sp) said to Maximus " What am I going to do with you? You just won't die."



saved9201 -> RE: Will FL. adn MI delegates be enough to bump BO? (4/28/2008 4:16:27 AM)

Hillary has done the math and she knows she's toast. She's staying in the race primarily to help insure an Obama loss in November so she'll be able to take on McCain in 4 years. She doesn't care about her party, this country or what's right, wrong or ethical. She just wants to be President and if she has to bring down the democratic party, I think she will.

- Julius



inthysite -> RE: Will FL. adn MI delegates be enough to bump BO? (5/7/2008 7:31:34 AM)

After Hillary's comments I thought it prudent to revive this thread.

2,025? Clinton camp says the 'magic number' of delegates is really 2,209

For weeks, the figure that the Associated Press, political reporters and the Democratic presidential campaigns have been citing as the minimum number of convention delegates needed to be the party's presidential nominee has been 2,025.

This morning, Hillary Rodham Clinton's campaign made the case that the goal line needs to be moved further back and that the real "magic number" is 2,209. It also laid out a scenario that has the primary season ending on June 3 with neither major contender having reached the 2,209 mark. In that event, Clinton strategist Geoff Garin said, "the process" would continue -- a process that could see Clinton and Barack Obama taking their battle for the nomination to the floor of the party's late-August convention in Denver.

One reader made the following comment:
"'DNC rule 20(c)(1) states that, If a “violation of timing' were to occur, then “the number of pledged delegates elected in each category allocated to the state pursuant to the Call for the National Convention shall be reduced by fifty (50%) percent, and the number of alternates shall also be reduced by fifty (50%) percent.” As it happens, it was the Rules and Bylaws Committee that decided to change the punishment from 50% to 100% ."

So the same committee now reconsidering and correcting their mistake, IS following the rules.

And there's also the rule that Obama should lose ALL his FL delegates because he broke the no-campaign agreement by running cable ads there. So by the rules, HIllary gets half, Obama gets none."



SuspenseWriter -> RE: Will FL. adn MI delegates be enough to bump BO? (5/7/2008 11:14:42 AM)

I doubt any of that will happen. Right now odds are Hillary is working on her concession speech, a speech that will end her run and give Obama the nomination. "For the good of the party," don'tcha know. All said, it was a heckuva run, and although I don't like her, I admit she's a tough, bare-knuckle campaigner.

The Chinese have a saying: "May you live in interesting times." And we are.

So this November it'll be the Secular Messiah against the Warhorse.

Have mercy.



Jhud -> RE: Will FL. adn MI delegates be enough to bump BO? (5/7/2008 11:45:44 AM)

I just wish Howard Cosell were still alive to cover this race. It would be assume to have blow by blow coverage:

And Obama is on the ropes - Hillary hits him with a Reverend Wright, then she jabs him with an Ayers, his knees are wobbling and his head is drooping...but wait, the Obama Bomber from Chicago isn't out yet, he throws a North Carolina and makes contact, Hillary defending with an Indiana hook, folks, it just goes on, and on, it is the fight of the new century...who will take home the prize is anyone’s call…



Leslie_JnJs_mom -> RE: Will FL. adn MI delegates be enough to bump BO? (5/7/2008 11:49:35 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: saved9201

Hillary has done the math and she knows she's toast. She's staying in the race primarily to help insure an Obama loss in November so she'll be able to take on McCain in 4 years. She doesn't care about her party, this country or what's right, wrong or ethical. She just wants to be President and if she has to bring down the democratic party, I think she will.

- Julius


That is exactly what my husband said!



inthysite -> RE: Will FL. adn MI delegates be enough to bump BO? (5/7/2008 1:23:49 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Jhud

I just wish Howard Cosell were still alive to cover this race. It would be assume to have blow by blow coverage:

And Obama is on the ropes - Hillary hits him with a Reverend Wright, then she jabs him with an Ayers, his knees are wobbling and his head is drooping...but wait, the Obama Bomber from Chicago isn't out yet, he throws a North Carolina and makes contact, Hillary defending with an Indiana hook, folks, it just goes on, and on, it is the fight of the new century...who will take home the prize is anyone’s call…




[:D][:D][:D][:D]

Kind of like the Rocky Balboa/Apollo Creed fight in Rocky.[sm=icon_smile_faint.gif][sm=funny.gif]

quote:

I doubt any of that will happen. Right now odds are Hillary is working on her concession speech, a speech that will end her run and give Obama the nomination.


Hillary just recently loaned her campaign another $5mil so I doubt she is going anywhere. This woman doesn't know the meaning of the word quit.



SuspenseWriter -> RE: Will FL. adn MI delegates be enough to bump BO? (5/7/2008 1:58:21 PM)

Neither do I (as a writer, I have to know I'm in this for the long haul). So as much as I abhor the woman's politics, I admire her grit.



wing2000 -> RE: Will FL. adn MI delegates be enough to bump BO? (5/8/2008 12:08:17 AM)

quote:

However, and this is what Hillary is counting on, if MI and FL are seated then Hillary can overtake Barack in the popular vote, depending on what happens in the rest of the primaries.



...actually, she can't overtake him in the popular vote (even with MI and FL)...he has over a 700,000 raw vote lead.

She has no case.



inthysite -> RE: Will FL. adn MI delegates be enough to bump BO? (5/8/2008 1:00:27 AM)

I made that statement prior to these last two primaries, she was hoping to fare better in the popular vote, then if you added in MI/FL she would have had a case.

But now you are correct, she cannot overtake him. Her only hope now is if something happens with Barack that shows that he cannot win the general election. Remember, the media has just now brought him under scrutiny, there are still several months to go until the general election and there is no telling if there are more skeletons in his closet.



Random -> RE: Will FL. adn MI delegates be enough to bump BO? (5/8/2008 5:52:09 AM)

I read an article with the math yesterday, and even if you count MI and FL, and when counting MI, you give Obama ZERO votes, the best she can do is basically a tie in the popular vote.

And that ignores the fact that caucuses are not designed to generated a countable popular vote, so they drastically undercount Obama's vote totals, since he won most of them.

This article also stated that the entire primary/caucus system is not designed to be able to count popular vote totals, so it's a strange argument anyway.



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