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RE: Tithes and Offerings - One Stop Thread - 6/3/2009 11:08:08 AM
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Richard656
Posts: 269
Joined: 5/18/2009
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Soxfan
There are numerous ways to give to God what is God's other than the local church.
But it's still a good idea to give to the local church in order to keep it going, don't you think?
quote:
My paycheck is not INCREASE. It is a wage that is given to me in exchange for the work I perform.
If my company paid me to do nothing, that would be INCREASE
It's more than you had before you got it, so it's an INCREASE.
quote:
Incorrect...Money existed in the OT, yet it was never tithed
I said these days. Try paying your tithes with corn or wheat now.
quote:
Once again, incorrect. The storehouse in Mal 3, is just that, a physical storehouse to hold grains and crops. There is no biblical evidence that the term storehouse meant the local church
Once again, I said now, not then. The church treasury is the storehouse for the tithes and offerings given TODAY.
quote:
That is correct. However, the NT command for that support is to give as the Holy Spirit leads.
I never said otherwise. If the Holy Spirit leads you to give 10% or more then you should do so. Anything less would be disobedience.
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RE: Tithes and Offerings - One Stop Thread - 6/3/2009 11:12:16 AM
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Eutychus
Posts: 6339
Joined: 4/11/2005
From: Dothan, AL
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The INCREASE I get from a paycheck is no different than the INCREASE farmers got in exchange for their labor of preparing the soil and sowing. They, like me, reaped what they sowed and in proportion to their labor.
_____________________________
Jesus answered and said to them, "This is the work of God, that you believe in Him whom He has sent." -John 6:29
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RE: Tithes and Offerings - One Stop Thread - 6/4/2009 6:59:38 PM
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Frok
Posts: 27
Joined: 1/24/2009
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Thanks for the responses.
What I have decided to do is to divert some of my tithe so I will be able to give more to my missionary friend on the monthly basis. I believe giving to the church and my missionary friend is one and the same especially since he is a member of my church. I have decided to increase the total amount I give in order to honor the call to support a missionary without being cheap however my tithe to the church will still be a bit smaller now.
Thanks once again for the advice.
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RE: Tithes and Offerings - One Stop Thread - 6/9/2009 9:14:41 AM
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informationguy
Posts: 325
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quote:
Incorrect...Money existed in the OT, yet it was never tithed
Food was the most popular form of money in OT times.
In today's economy American currency is of greater value than food.
In OT times food was of greater value than coinage. (Famine was their greatest fear)
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RE: Tithes and Offerings - One Stop Thread - 6/9/2009 9:20:17 AM
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informationguy
Posts: 325
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quote:
Thanks for the responses.
What I have decided to do is to divert some of my tithe so I will be able to give more to my missionary friend on the monthly basis. I believe giving to the church and my missionary friend is one and the same especially since he is a member of my church]. I have decided to increase the total amount I give in order to honor the call to support a missionary without being cheap however my tithe to the church will still be a bit smaller now.
Thanks once again for the advice.
Does your church not give regular support to this person?
Why not ask your church to give regular support to this "member" so that you can both keep your tax deduction - allowing you to give more and give greater support and financial stability to this missionary? Suggest this be part of your churches budgeted items.
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RE: Tithes and Offerings - One Stop Thread - 8/5/2009 3:51:59 PM
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madelin1970
Posts: 71
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Isn't the church more than just a building? Shouldn't the church be composed of people who believe in the Lord Jesus Christ, our brothers and sisters in Christ. If you are helping someone who is a believer, you are helping the church in some way.
_____________________________
That at the name of Jesus, every knee should bow, in heaven and on earth and under the earth, and every tongue confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father
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RE: Tithes and Offerings - One Stop Thread - 8/5/2009 4:11:56 PM
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Eutychus
Posts: 6339
Joined: 4/11/2005
From: Dothan, AL
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quote:
ORIGINAL: madelin1970
Isn't the church more than just a building? Shouldn't the church be composed of people who believe in the Lord Jesus Christ, our brothers and sisters in Christ. If you are helping someone who is a believer, you are helping the church in some way.
You are right that the church is not a building. It is a local fellowship of fellow believers that we commit to minister and worship with. Many of us also commit to strengthen ministry within and outside the fellowship through tithes and offerings. I also give to charities and other ministries, but I don't weaken my church ministries by giving parts of what I would have given to it to other ministries just to avoid sacrificing to give to them. Nowhere in scripture are we taught that ministering to others is without sacrifice.
Would you take away from your children's needs so that you could give to strangers? I don't know, but to me, my responsibility is first to my family, then to others. I may sacrifice some things for myself, but not to my children.
Your local church is family.
_____________________________
Jesus answered and said to them, "This is the work of God, that you believe in Him whom He has sent." -John 6:29
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RE: Tithes and Offerings - One Stop Thread - 8/5/2009 5:12:55 PM
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madelin1970
Posts: 71
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I fully understand the meaning of sacrifice and I'm not afraid to do it in the least. I sponser 3 kids through Compassion International and that's a financial stretch for me, one that I'm fully willing to do. Kids are my heart and where my passion lies.
_____________________________
That at the name of Jesus, every knee should bow, in heaven and on earth and under the earth, and every tongue confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father
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RE: Tithes and Offerings - One Stop Thread - 8/5/2009 5:19:02 PM
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Eutychus
Posts: 6339
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I'm just saying that some people decide to "give" ten percent and, if they find something else that interests them, they'll trim part of the ten percent they had been giving to their church and give to the new interest, and somehow feel like they are doing something extra special.
_____________________________
Jesus answered and said to them, "This is the work of God, that you believe in Him whom He has sent." -John 6:29
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RE: Tithes and Offerings - One Stop Thread - 8/5/2009 5:29:24 PM
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madelin1970
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Frankly I don't belong to any certain church right now, I'm still looking. I don't feel like I'm doing anything extra special because I feel like I've been given so much in my life that it's now time to give back to others. Life isn't just about me or my needs, it's about others as well who have needs far greater than mine. I am thankful for the opportunity to help others
_____________________________
That at the name of Jesus, every knee should bow, in heaven and on earth and under the earth, and every tongue confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father
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RE: Tithes and Offerings - One Stop Thread - 8/6/2009 2:51:13 PM
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hannahwilly
Posts: 23
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Tithing make me feel a part of a bigger unit and not just a guest.
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RE: Tithes and Offerings - One Stop Thread - 10/6/2009 4:51:59 AM
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pabrain
Posts: 301
Joined: 12/19/2008
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Tithe, a definition,
1. A tenth part of one's annual income contributed voluntarily or due as a tax, especially for the support of the clergy or church.
2. To contribute or pay a tenth part of (one's annual income).
Devine requirement,
Num 18:21 "To the Levites I have given every tithe in Israel for an inheritance, in return for their service that they do, their service in the tent of meeting,
Tithe occurs 22 times in 19 verses in the ESV, see.
http://www.blueletterbible.org/search/translationResults.cfm?Criteria=Tithe&t=ESV&sf=5
Reality,
What is said above must be considered in light of the fact that at the time Num 18:21 was given to the Nation of Isarel, they were not required to pay either Government income tax, or local Authority Council tax (known here as, "rates")
In the UK, at least the amount taken from it's citizens in this way is far more than 10%.
Should one financially support the Church one attends, undoubtedly yes, the amount being dependant on one's ability to do so, and as the Lord instructs.
Hope this helps.
Every blessing.
Edwin.
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RE: Tithes and Offerings - One Stop Thread - 10/6/2009 9:35:25 AM
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Eutychus
Posts: 6339
Joined: 4/11/2005
From: Dothan, AL
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quote:
ORIGINAL: pabrain
Should one financially support the Church one attends, undoubtedly yes, the amount being dependant on one's ability to do so, and as the Lord instructs.
I've tithed on less than minimum wage, I've tithed on more than $60K, and, now, tithe on considerably less than the most I've ever made. Ten percent of my gross has proven to be consistently fair and within my ability to give, as long as I was willing to learn how to live within the income the Lord has provided.
_____________________________
Jesus answered and said to them, "This is the work of God, that you believe in Him whom He has sent." -John 6:29
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RE: Tithes and Offerings - One Stop Thread - 10/6/2009 4:01:29 PM
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Eutychus
Posts: 6339
Joined: 4/11/2005
From: Dothan, AL
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Harvie
While I tend to use the word "tithe" when referring to our faith-related charitable giving, but we do not usually adhere to the "ten percent of our gross income rule."
Same here; it has been quite awhile since I limited my returning to the Lord to 10% of my gross, but it was a good starting point in learning how to be a good steward.
_____________________________
Jesus answered and said to them, "This is the work of God, that you believe in Him whom He has sent." -John 6:29
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RE: Tithes and Offerings - One Stop Thread - 10/15/2009 7:29:25 PM
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heremainsfaithful
Posts: 183
Joined: 10/14/2009
From: Alabama
Status: online
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I wanted to make a few comments. First, why should a pastor get paid? Uh, because it is not only his calling, it is his vocation. My husband was a full time minister. How were we supposed to eat and pay rent exactly? Going to visitation, singing in the choir, or mowing the church lawn doesn't even come close to comparing to the duties of a full time minister. That is both laughable and offensive.
I do believe there is biblical basis for giving and tithing, but I believe that ALL of the Bible - both testaments - are still relevant. However, I freely if somewhat sheepishly admit that if I faced eviction on one side and one week's tithe on the other....I'd probably pay rent. Then I'd try to catch up.
In the end, with a topic like this, maybe we have to decide if we would rather prove ourselves right or prove ourselves holy...they are not necessarily one and the same.
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RE: Tithes and Offerings - One Stop Thread - 10/15/2009 10:13:32 PM
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coolfamily6
Posts: 655
Joined: 4/18/2005
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If you are leaving a church in search of a new church home, do you continue to tithe to your church until the Lord leads you to a new church? or do you tithe to whatever church you visit that week? Opinions? Not giving is not an option.
_____________________________
If your bible is a mess; your life won't be.
~Encouragement a mom gave to our children at our First Grader's Bible Ceremony!
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RE: Tithes and Offerings - One Stop Thread - 10/16/2009 10:45:43 AM
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Eutychus
Posts: 6339
Joined: 4/11/2005
From: Dothan, AL
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quote:
ORIGINAL: coolfamily6
If you are leaving a church in search of a new church home, do you continue to tithe to your church until the Lord leads you to a new church? or do you tithe to whatever church you visit that week? Opinions? Not giving is not an option.
I always tithed in the church I was visiting when I was in search of a new home church.
_____________________________
Jesus answered and said to them, "This is the work of God, that you believe in Him whom He has sent." -John 6:29
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RE: Tithes and Offerings - One Stop Thread - 10/16/2009 11:14:20 AM
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jhuperetes
Posts: 472
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I have heard an interesting explanation on tithe. Someone might have mentioned this, but I am not going to trudge through 150 pages.
Tithe is equivalent of taxes. In Israel's Levitical time, as a theocracy, that was the primary taxation.
Therefore, paying income, sales etc. taxes levied by the government equates to paying the tithe in Levitical times.
Thoughts?
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RE: Tithes and Offerings - One Stop Thread - 10/16/2009 11:23:51 AM
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Eutychus
Posts: 6339
Joined: 4/11/2005
From: Dothan, AL
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: jhuperetes
I have heard an interesting explanation on tithe. Someone might have mentioned this, but I am not going to trudge through 150 pages.
Tithe is equivalent of taxes. In Israel's Levitical time, as a theocracy, that was the primary taxation.
Therefore, paying income, sales etc. taxes levied by the government equates to paying the tithe in Levitical times.
Thoughts?
How could paying taxes to a secular, temporal government be the same as giving to the eternal work of God?
In any case, what the Lord said in Matthew 22:21 seems to distinguish the two:
...Then He said to them, "Then render to Caesar the things that are Caesar's; and to God the things that are God's."
_____________________________
Jesus answered and said to them, "This is the work of God, that you believe in Him whom He has sent." -John 6:29
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RE: Tithes and Offerings - One Stop Thread - 10/16/2009 3:57:30 PM
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jhuperetes
Posts: 472
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Israel was not secular in the OT. Tithe was prescribed in a theocracy. Western civilization split government and house of God. But, government continues to collect the tithe.
As for the Matthew 22:21, Jesus doesn't say pay taxes to God, or tithe. He says "[just continuously/continue to] give/render (ἀποδίδωμι).. God's"
The "things" part, in the English translation implies material, but the Greek does not specify God's things are necessarily only tangible.
// Note that this is not my concepts, so I might be a bit rusty recalling his arguments.
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RE: Tithes and Offerings - One Stop Thread - 10/18/2009 5:31:09 PM
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coolfamily6
Posts: 655
Joined: 4/18/2005
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Eutychus
quote:
ORIGINAL: coolfamily6
If you are leaving a church in search of a new church home, do you continue to tithe to your church until the Lord leads you to a new church? or do you tithe to whatever church you visit that week? Opinions? Not giving is not an option.
I always tithed in the church I was visiting when I was in search of a new home church.
Thanks for your reply.
_____________________________
If your bible is a mess; your life won't be.
~Encouragement a mom gave to our children at our First Grader's Bible Ceremony!
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RE: Tithes and Offerings - One Stop Thread - 10/18/2009 6:59:52 PM
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truthrevealed
Posts: 718
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quote:
However, I freely if somewhat sheepishly admit that if I faced eviction on one side and one week's tithe on the other....I'd probably pay rent. Then I'd try to catch up.
Very interesting that you bring this up because I have personally been in this position and I've learned some things on this journey with God (but I expect no one to substitute what I believe God has revealed to me from their own understanding, the HolySpirit is capable  ).
God made it emphatically clear to dh and I that tithing is an act of faith...period! We were paying tithe, according to God, like we paid our bills (and with the same mindset as our "bills" I might add). Meaning, dh got paid weekly but we paid our tithe monthly. I thought as long as what we give per month is the equivalent of 10% per pay period what difference does it make, all of the money is still going where it belongs  . Not so, says God! We are to give off the top, to God...FIRST!!! Before[/i] rent, before bills. Our faith and trust is that we acknowledge thru our tithe that God is the giver of all (good) things and that He promises to take care of us. So, yeah, expect that our faith will be challenged because tithing isn't about money-----as if God needs our money(yes, the heating bill at our church building must be paid  ---but God doesn't need our money, He desires our trust).
Because of this, I don't think there's a such thing as "catching up" as it concerns the tithe. If we face a situation where it's either the rent or obedience to give God first, we either obey or we don't. And IMO, if we choose to pay rent first, then we show that we need to grow in our trust of God. And we will continue to face situations where we're "forced" to trust Him until we've learned to trust Him
< Message edited by truthrevealed -- 10/18/2009 7:24:20 PM >
_____________________________
I'll tell the world....where--ever I go. That I, have found, a Savior....and He's sweet I know!!!
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