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RE: Does your view of God affect your potential list? - 6/23/2008 2:10:25 PM
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Focusing
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Just throwing out that it's important to not allow our own carnal desires override what God may have in store for us. Simply because we have become smitten with Mister Hot or Miss Cutie doesn't mean they are The One for us. We need to be vigilent, guarding our hearts, always seeking God's will in our lives. Satan knows our desires as well, once we have spoken them, and how do we know whether it is him or Him that is guiding our heart?
Many of the threads right now tie into each other. I know I need to get over to the thread I started last week, and with recent events ... whew, I need to take a step back on that ... and my ex having had that personality trait (confidence) that, once I was "hooked" turned out to be nothing more than a well-disguised facade of arrogance I learned after the fact that even though someone seems like the perfect person, and we are blinded by "love" (or is it infatuation or lust ... ), we need to remain vigilent. Continuing to guard our hearts. Not rush into the relationship. Take our time. Pray. Seek God's will for our lives. We need to always be careful that we are following after God, not asking Him to bless our wants and desires.
_____________________________
For a little while longer the Light is among you. Walk while you have the Light, so that darkness will not overtake you; he who walks in the darkness does not know where he goes.
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RE: Does your view of God affect your potential list? - 6/23/2008 4:07:17 PM
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joy2give2u
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quote:
Isn't it possible that praying specifically helps us to understand what God wants for us? Is it also possible that it helps to deepen our relationship with Him when we take everything--even our specifics--to him in prayer?
For example, if I'm seeing a man that I think God might want me to spend the rest of my life with, shouldn't I present the relationship to God specifically so that I can know what God thinks of it? Shouldn't I ask specifically for God to give both me and the man wisdom and discernment in understanding God's desires and for God to direct the relationship as he wills it?
I pray asking God specific questions.... asking him to speak to me concerning specific circumstances or concerns I have in my life. I believe God wants us to be specific and direct when we are talking with Him........When we are clear and his voice is clear satan can't plant little seeds of doubt..........something amazing happens when God speaks directly, specifically to something on your heart.......you are changed when he specifically addresses the things on your heart. You recognize His voice and know it is him.
When we talk to God directly and he speaks to us about a specific concern on our heart our relationship with Him grows........Knowing he cares enough to listen to your heart and then respond specifically to what is on your heart........it draws you so close to Him.
Going to him with something on your heart, presenting it to him and then listening to him is different then going to him with a list of things you want, telling him this is my list for you to fulfill and when you do I will know it is from you. To me such an approach is more like Gideons fleece.
I believe a list is our way of telling God this is exactly what I want and when I find someone who meets my list I will know they are the one I am suppose to marry......it is a sign from God.......a wet fleece.......
quote:
Satan knows our desires as well, once we have spoken them, and how do we know whether it is him or Him that is guiding our heart?
As Sam pointed out the problem with this approach is satan also knows the list.
I have a friend who prayed for a very specific color, type of truck....She asked for very specific things on the truck. After searching for a long time she found a truck exactly as she had requested and was sure God had answered her prayer.......She had presented a fleece to the Lord and he had answered.......He had provided exactly what she had prayed for over and over. She was very excited.
Until it turned out to have all kinds of problems, the gas prices went sky high and she can't afford to drive it her long drive to work, the payments are more then she can afford now that she has switched jobs and she hates driving it.
She had a list. She found everything on her list.....
I asked her a few weeks ago if she had asked God if she should buy the truck? I asked her if she had even asked God if the truck was what she needed...........the answers to both was no.
God knew gas prices would go up even though she didn't...... God knew she would be forced to switch jobs giving her a longer drive........God knew she would not be able to afford the truck.........God knew the truck was not what she needed..........
Right before she bought the truck a friend of hers told her about a car for sale. It was small, got great gas mileage, was low in mileage, was priced well within her current budget and suited her lifestyle more...... she didn't even consider it because she had her list and was focused on looking for her list..........
Do you see the difference?
< Message edited by joy2give2u -- 6/23/2008 4:42:39 PM >
_____________________________
It is better to communicate the Spirit of what the Word says then the actual words read
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RE: Does your view of God affect your potential list? - 6/23/2008 5:06:57 PM
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Blazingson
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quote:
When we talk to God directly and he speaks to us about a specific concern on our heart our relationship with Him grows........Knowing he cares enough to listen to your heart and then respond specifically to what is on your heart........it draws you so close to Him.
This is different from how our relationship with God affects our "List". Our "list" is much like the wish list we make at Christmas time while browsing the Sears catalog. Like our Earthly parents, our Heavenly Father knows what we want but I won't get everything on it because I'm way too young and irresponsible to handle a pellet gun. (Metaphorically speaking.)
On the other hand if I go to God with a concern, such as my sister having a traffic accident, I will be specific and ask, "Lord, please heal my sister from her injuries. But your will be done." Again, a very different scenario from a list of characteristics I want my future to have.
_____________________________
*Eric G.*
Matthew 5:16
Let your light shine before men, that they may see your good deeds and praise your Father in heaven.
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RE: Does your view of God affect your potential list? - 6/23/2008 5:13:10 PM
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Blazingson
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quote:
I have a friend who prayed for a very specific color, type of truck....She asked for very specific things on the truck. After searching for a long time she found a truck exactly as she had requested and was sure God had answered her prayer.......She had presented a fleece to the Lord and he had answered.......He had provided exactly what she had prayed for over and over. She was very excited.
Until it turned out to have all kinds of problems, the gas prices went sky high and she can't afford to drive it her long drive to work, the payments are more then she can afford now that she has switched jobs and she hates driving it.
She had a list. She found everything on her list.....
I asked her a few weeks ago if she had asked God if she should buy the truck? I asked her if she had even asked God if the truck was what she needed...........the answers to both was no.
God knew gas prices would go up even though she didn't...... God knew she would be forced to switch jobs giving her a longer drive........God knew she would not be able to afford the truck.........God knew the truck was not what she needed..........
Right before she bought the truck a friend of hers told her about a car for sale. It was small, got great gas mileage, was low in mileage, was priced well within her current budget and suited her lifestyle more...... she didn't even consider it because she had her list and was focused on looking for her list..........
Do you see the difference?
This is similar to the times when God let the Israelites have what they wanted. They complained about the Manna the Lord provided so He gave them quail and just about buried them in it.
I think her prayer should've gone something like this, "Lord, I need reliable transportation. You know my needs better than I do so I request that you keep me alert to your guidance so I will see my next vehicle when I come across it." We need to stay close to Him so we will hear him speak to us.
_____________________________
*Eric G.*
Matthew 5:16
Let your light shine before men, that they may see your good deeds and praise your Father in heaven.
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RE: Does your view of God affect your potential list? - 6/23/2008 5:25:36 PM
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Focusing
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Amen!
Lists = our desires
Prayer seeks the Lord's will
Lists can be good. They can help us prioritize. Once they are written down, we can review them and see the *right* and the *wrong* in our desires ... and how our desires change over time. God is the same yesterday, today and tomorrow. He does not change. He knows what's best for us.
While there are things I would like, I won't list them out publicly ... the exception being that a potential husband must be a man whose primary goal in life is to seek to please the Lord. I will bring my wants to the feet of Jesus and seek His input ... and leave it to Him to make the final decision. He knows the future, I do not. He knows what I need far better than I do.
_____________________________
For a little while longer the Light is among you. Walk while you have the Light, so that darkness will not overtake you; he who walks in the darkness does not know where he goes.
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RE: Does your view of God affect your potential list? - 6/23/2008 9:22:29 PM
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John_O
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Blazingson
I agree with you that we have no control and that there is no way of getting control, but that doesn't stop man from trying. Instead of letting God fill our requests His way, out of His love and wisdom, out of His knowledge and grace, we attempt to direct God to do things the way we want them done.
I've never seen asking for something as manipulating God. I cannot direct Him to do anything. I can only bring my requests before Him.
quote:
I am not aware of anyplace in the Bible where we are commanded to pray "specifically".
Philippians 4:6 says, "Do not be anxious about anything, but in everything, by prayer and petition, with thanksgiving, present your requests to God." It doesn't say, "...with thanksgiving, present your requests to God and be specific so He doesn't get it wrong or miss anything."
Likewise, in the model prayer; Matthew 6:11 says, "Give us today our daily bread." not "Give us today our daily whole wheat split-top bread with honey smoked ham, swiss cheese, dijon mustard, a dill pickle spear, 20 oz. bottle of Coca-Cola and cheesecake for dessert."
...
I believe we are doing best by making our requests known to God and letting Him work out the details.
So the only difference we have is where the line of detail needs to be drawn.
By praying specifically I am doing exactly as you are doing by praying generally. I bring my requests before God as He has commanded us to do.
Taking the general prayer one step further... You ask him to bring you a wife, as He already knows what you need and would like. So why even bother asking for a wife. You can stop at "Please God..." since he knows what you are going to ask for and what is best for you. In fact, you can stop at "please" since He knows who you are asking. Or you can not even bother at all because He knows what you have need of. But then that wouldn't really be bringing your requests before God.
I pray specifically. Not to let Him know what I want but to make sure I know what I want. And since He knows who he will bring me it's all good.
Note that the scriptures you reference also do not fobid praying in great detail
Mt 18:19 Again I say unto you, That if two of you shall agree on earth as touching any thing that they shall ask, it shall be done for them of my Father which is in heaven.
Have to know in detail what you are both agreeing to...
See also John chapters 14 through 16 where Jesus talks at length on asking. If you want God to do something for you, you should know what it is you want him to do.
But again we differ only on degree
_____________________________
Psalms 46:10 Be still, and know that I am God: I will be exalted among the heathen, I will be exalted in the earth.
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RE: Does your view of God affect your potential list? - 6/23/2008 9:24:52 PM
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John_O
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Blazingson
As I stated in an earlier post, Prayer requests or "prayers of supplication" are not about placing an order with God. It's about maintaining and strengthening our relationship with Him. Only that. God knows what we need and what pleases us.
Exactly. And what please God is when we bring our requests to Him. He knows what we need. So why does He want us to ask for it anyway? And since we are asking why wouldn't we ask for what we want?
_____________________________
Psalms 46:10 Be still, and know that I am God: I will be exalted among the heathen, I will be exalted in the earth.
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RE: Does your view of God affect your potential list? - 6/23/2008 9:30:48 PM
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John_O
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quote:
ORIGINAL: joy2give2u
I have a friend who prayed for a very specific color, type of truck....She asked for very specific things on the truck. After searching for a long time she found a truck exactly as she had requested and was sure God had answered her prayer.......She had presented a fleece to the Lord and he had answered.......He had provided exactly what she had prayed for over and over. She was very excited.
Until it turned out to have all kinds of problems, the gas prices went sky high and she can't afford to drive it her long drive to work, the payments are more then she can afford now that she has switched jobs and she hates driving it.
She had a list. She found everything on her list.....
I asked her a few weeks ago if she had asked God if she should buy the truck? I asked her if she had even asked God if the truck was what she needed...........the answers to both was no.
God knew gas prices would go up even though she didn't...... God knew she would be forced to switch jobs giving her a longer drive........God knew she would not be able to afford the truck.........God knew the truck was not what she needed..........
Right before she bought the truck a friend of hers told her about a car for sale. It was small, got great gas mileage, was low in mileage, was priced well within her current budget and suited her lifestyle more...... she didn't even consider it because she had her list and was focused on looking for her list..........
Do you see the difference?
If I had compared women to car shopping, you, and almost every other woman would have been all over me like white on rice. 
But since you made the comparison I'll continue it.
Looking without a list is like going car shopping and deciding to buy the very first car in your price range. No matter what it is. You'd end up with 6'5" tall men driving little Geo Metros that they can't even fit in. Or little ladies driving big pickups where their feet don't reach the pedals.
You have to know what you want in order to know what to ask for. And that is where the list comes in. Writing down what you want shows you what really matters to you and what is not so important.
Now does my view of God change what's on my list? It may for some. In my case what I wanted was slightly refined but pretty much accurate from the start . (had to get back to OP)
_____________________________
Psalms 46:10 Be still, and know that I am God: I will be exalted among the heathen, I will be exalted in the earth.
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RE: Does your view of God affect your potential list? - 6/23/2008 9:33:58 PM
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John_O
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Blazingson
This is similar to the times when God let the Israelites have what they wanted. They complained about the Manna the Lord provided so He gave them quail and just about buried them in it.
I think her prayer should've gone something like this, "Lord, I need reliable transportation. You know my needs better than I do so I request that you keep me alert to your guidance so I will see my next vehicle when I come across it." We need to stay close to Him so we will hear him speak to us.
Or it could be that she foolishly asked for more vehicle than she could afford and God let her have it as a lesson to her.
But we know that cars are not spouses. You can sell a car. Once you are married you are married till death do you part.
God wouldn't trap you in a marriage that would not be right for you (and could not be made right). So if we ask specifically what we want and one or more of those characteristics is not in line with the bible then God will say no.
_____________________________
Psalms 46:10 Be still, and know that I am God: I will be exalted among the heathen, I will be exalted in the earth.
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RE: Does your view of God affect your potential list? - 6/24/2008 3:33:48 PM
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Bridgitt
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My relationship with the Lord definitely has an effect on my view of a potential husband.
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RE: Does your view of God affect your potential list? - 6/24/2008 4:17:00 PM
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Focusing
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quote:
Or it could be that she foolishly asked for more vehicle than she could afford and God let her have it as a lesson to her.
Possibly. JMO, but it seems to me she decided she wanted what she wanted and that's what she went for. God allows us to make our own choices, even if He doesn't agree with them. He's kinda like that.
But, since we're talking about potential spouses, and this was just an analogy and not a comparison to dating, as we are all in agreement on ...  ... I think it's important to seek after God's will, which requires lots of prayer from each him and her individually, as well as prayer together, requesting His guidance. I firmly believe God will answer our prayers when we seek Him with an open and humble heart, truly desiring Him to be in the middle of our relationship.
We need to be on guard to wanting what we want and going for it.
And as I walk closer with Him each day, my view of Him becomes a little clearer, and my desire for a mate who is walking this same Path is most definitely affected by my walk.
_____________________________
For a little while longer the Light is among you. Walk while you have the Light, so that darkness will not overtake you; he who walks in the darkness does not know where he goes.
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RE: Does your view of God affect your potential list? - 6/24/2008 5:20:50 PM
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John_O
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Focusing
But, since we're talking about potential spouses, and this was just an analogy and not a comparison to dating, as we are all in agreement on ... ... I think it's important to seek after God's will, which requires lots of prayer from each him and her individually, as well as prayer together, requesting His guidance. I firmly believe God will answer our prayers when we seek Him with an open and humble heart, truly desiring Him to be in the middle of our relationship.
We need to be on guard to wanting what we want and going for it.
This is exactly correct.
_____________________________
Psalms 46:10 Be still, and know that I am God: I will be exalted among the heathen, I will be exalted in the earth.
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RE: Does your view of God affect your potential list? - 6/24/2008 6:27:50 PM
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Blazingson
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quote:
Taking the general prayer one step further... You ask him to bring you a wife, as He already knows what you need and would like. So why even bother asking for a wife. You can stop at "Please God..." since he knows what you are going to ask for and what is best for you. In fact, you can stop at "please" since He knows who you are asking. Or you can not even bother at all because He knows what you have need of. But then that wouldn't really be bringing your requests before God.
That's a fatuous argument. If you stop at "Please God..." you are no longer bringing your requests before God. Prayer is absolutely essential to a persons relationship with God. If I stop with what you suggest, it's no longer a prayer because it lacks all of the essential parts of a prayer. Worship, thanksgiving, confession and supplication.
_____________________________
*Eric G.*
Matthew 5:16
Let your light shine before men, that they may see your good deeds and praise your Father in heaven.
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RE: Does your view of God affect your potential list? - 6/24/2008 6:29:44 PM
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Blazingson
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quote:
ORIGINAL: John_O
quote:
ORIGINAL: Blazingson
As I stated in an earlier post, Prayer requests or "prayers of supplication" are not about placing an order with God. It's about maintaining and strengthening our relationship with Him. Only that. God knows what we need and what pleases us.
Exactly. And what please God is when we bring our requests to Him. He knows what we need. So why does He want us to ask for it anyway? And since we are asking why wouldn't we ask for what we want?
By asking God for a wife, I am asking for what I want. I'm also trusting Him to work out the details.
_____________________________
*Eric G.*
Matthew 5:16
Let your light shine before men, that they may see your good deeds and praise your Father in heaven.
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RE: Does your view of God affect your potential list? - 6/24/2008 6:32:00 PM
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Blazingson
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quote:
ORIGINAL: John_O
quote:
ORIGINAL: Blazingson
This is similar to the times when God let the Israelites have what they wanted. They complained about the Manna the Lord provided so He gave them quail and just about buried them in it.
I think her prayer should've gone something like this, "Lord, I need reliable transportation. You know my needs better than I do so I request that you keep me alert to your guidance so I will see my next vehicle when I come across it." We need to stay close to Him so we will hear him speak to us.
Or it could be that she foolishly asked for more vehicle than she could afford and God let her have it as a lesson to her.
But we know that cars are not spouses. You can sell a car. Once you are married you are married till death do you part.
God wouldn't trap you in a marriage that would not be right for you (and could not be made right). So if we ask specifically what we want and one or more of those characteristics is not in line with the bible then God will say no.
That is exactly the point I was making. She, like the Israelites, got more than she could handle.
_____________________________
*Eric G.*
Matthew 5:16
Let your light shine before men, that they may see your good deeds and praise your Father in heaven.
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RE: Does your view of God affect your potential list? - 6/24/2008 7:16:03 PM
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Elena1030
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Blazingson,
Well, of course, with any two human beings -- fallen, fallible people -- coming together in marriage (one man + one woman, of course) each one is going to get "more than he/she can handle"!! That's exactly why we need God to live in and through us --- otherwise we cannot love each other properly in marriage. It is He who works the agape into us and causes it to course out of us.
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As I have spent more time with God over the years (meaning, not just quiet times but also the experiences He's delivered me from and delivered me through), He has taught me how to shape the "list."
I have a list b/c I am a list maker and b/c my memory is visually oriented: if I write it down, I'm more likely to remember it. And I'm a writer, so I like to put ideas, thoughts, feelings, principles into black and white. Feels more concrete, more real to me. God knows that my brain works that way. He created it!
So... I've put things on the list that I'd like and put things that are must haves --- character things, values, goals, priorities, etc.
BUT even then, God has shown me that how I envision those elements coming together in one person is really limited. "Intelligence," which is on my list, can mean a lot of things. And can manifest itself in a myriad of ways. (God is so creative in creating people... there are so many possible ways that men can be highly intelligent.)
And really, it's all still very hypothetical, because I've not met anyone I really, really, really want to be pursued by for the purpose of examining whether we ought to marry or not. (Which is why one dates/courts, in my book.)
Some dude could come along and totally blow out of the water my perception of how a guy should be in order for me to be compatible with him and him to be compatible with me and it be a wise and Kingdom-enhancing idea for us to marry.
I think God is helping me recognize more quickly who I even like to spend time with as a person, out of the men I know and meet. Which is important! In marriage, you spend a lot of time together!
So... I think it's OK for me to have a written list AND to think of it as a document in transition. It's really a tool to help me remember the lessons God has taught me about myself; about people; about life; about men; about dating, courtship, and marriage --- so that I don't forget those lessons as I make decisions... wise ones!!!
Make sense?
Good!
 
< Message edited by Elena1030 -- 6/24/2008 7:22:18 PM >
_____________________________
"We're not odd, we're just over-expressive."—Helen in Howard's End
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RE: Does your view of God affect your potential list? - 6/24/2008 7:26:54 PM
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Blazingson
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quote:
Make sense?
Sure does.
_____________________________
*Eric G.*
Matthew 5:16
Let your light shine before men, that they may see your good deeds and praise your Father in heaven.
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RE: Does your view of God affect your potential list? - 6/24/2008 7:41:22 PM
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Elena1030
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Blazingson
quote:
Make sense?
Sure does.
w00t!
_____________________________
"We're not odd, we're just over-expressive."—Helen in Howard's End
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RE: Does your view of God affect your potential list? - 6/24/2008 7:54:49 PM
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makarizo
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quote:
Does your view of God affect your potential list?
yes it does, but not in the way I think you are thinking....
Rom 8:25 But if we hope for what we do not see, with perseverance we wait eagerly for it.
Rom 8:26 In the same way the Spirit also helps our weakness; for we do not know how to pray as we should, but the Spirit Himself intercedes for us with groanings too deep for words;
Rom 8:27 and He who searches the hearts knows what the mind of the Spirit is, because He intercedes for the saints according to the will of God.
Rom 8:28 And we know that God causes all things to work together for good to those who love God, to those who are called according to His purpose.
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RE: Does your view of God affect your potential list? - 6/24/2008 8:24:00 PM
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Elena1030
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Good points and great overall point, doer!
Even with "lists," there is still so much unknown about the future.
But it's not what (the future) you know. It's who you know --- the Almighty God, who created everything by speaking it into being and created humans with both His hands and His breath.
Amen, doer. Really, our task --- overall, under all, through all --- is to trust Him. To love Him, believe Him, obey Him.
Everything else pales in comparison, when considering what is priority of our "tasks."
It is so much less important that I figure out what types of man I want to be with or "should" be with. To figure out what my pool of potentials should be like. Than it is to know Christ, to study HIM.... and to ask Him to teach me His ways, and then I'll live by His truth. (Psalm 86:11, our VBS theme verse this week.)
Thus.... who is it who is living by His truth? Who knows the truth, speaks the truth, and lives the truth? (More VBS. Our motto, it is. w00t!)
Am I that woman?
I need to be able to recognize the men who are truly His men. That's where it starts, when it comes to evaluating marriage prospects.
"Jesus, Jesus, how I trust Him; how I've proved Him o'er and o'er. Jesus, Jesus, precious Jesus, oh for grace to trust You more!" --- the chorus of the beloved hymn "'Tis So Sweet to Trust in Jesus" --- again, more from VBS this week --- the hymn's chorus forms part of a song called "Jesus Is."
More of the lyrics state: "And I'm so glad I know who He is and I want the whole world to know who Jesus is." --- my marriage and childrearing will be part of that. One part. An important part. But only a part of it.
I cannot and must not lose sight of the entire picture: Jesus. He was, is, and is to come. Life begins with Him and ends with Him. Alpha and Omega.
_____________________________
"We're not odd, we're just over-expressive."—Helen in Howard's End
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RE: Does your view of God affect your potential list? - 6/24/2008 9:04:28 PM
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makarizo
Posts: 2785
Joined: 4/13/2005
Status: offline
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quote:
I need to be able to recognize the men who are truly His men. That's where it starts, when it comes to evaluating marriage prospects.
Someone that I can share my faith with.... that understands what that means.
I suppose that it was a revelation about what I really wanted. what was more important to me than anything else.
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RE: Does your view of God affect your potential list? - 6/24/2008 10:54:39 PM
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John_O
Posts: 6947
Joined: 9/5/2006
Status: offline
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(combined two of your posts)
quote:
ORIGINAL: Blazingson
That's a fatuous argument. If you stop at "Please God..." you are no longer bringing your requests before God. Prayer is absolutely essential to a persons relationship with God. If I stop with what you suggest, it's no longer a prayer because it lacks all of the essential parts of a prayer. Worship, thanksgiving, confession and supplication.
quote:
ORIGINAL: John_O
quote:
ORIGINAL: Blazingson
As I stated in an earlier post, Prayer requests or "prayers of supplication" are not about placing an order with God. It's about maintaining and strengthening our relationship with Him. Only that. God knows what we need and what pleases us.
Exactly. And what please God is when we bring our requests to Him. He knows what we need. So why does He want us to ask for it anyway? And since we are asking why wouldn't we ask for what we want?
By asking God for a wife, I am asking for what I want. I'm also trusting Him to work out the details.
Since God knows what we want, and what we are going to ask "Please God" is bringing our requests before him and trusting him to work out the details. Likewise approaching God with a detailed list is bringing our requests before him and trusting him to work out the details.
I know that if I meet someone who matches my list, and I match theirs, then it would have to be a move of God. (I'm not a bi believer in coincidence)
Do you see my point? We are both praying the same way, bringing our requests before God. The only difference is in degree. You are more general, I am more specific. If you are comfortable praying as you do, fantastic. I am comfortable praying as I do.
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Psalms 46:10 Be still, and know that I am God: I will be exalted among the heathen, I will be exalted in the earth.
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