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RE: A Conscious Creator - 7/11/2008 8:37:27 AM
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hellohellohi
Posts: 538
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From: North Carolina!
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quote:
While it may be as powerful, or even more powerful, as meeting a living person it is still not the same.
The funny thing is, even when I meet people, I go around with ideas of them in my head. Sometimes, I feel like I am treating people as their own images. Further, people can change, and there is often or always a bit of an ambiguity about them. Also, I sometimes feel like I haven't fully met someone, as if there is some unfinished business that we have to acknowledge if we are to really say that we have "confronted on another's reality" or something-such.
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RE: A Conscious Creator - 7/11/2008 1:00:27 PM
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Method
Posts: 1162
Joined: 9/19/2007
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quote:
ORIGINAL: hellohellohi
The funny thing is, even when I meet people, I go around with ideas of them in my head. Sometimes, I feel like I am treating people as their own images. Further, people can change, and there is often or always a bit of an ambiguity about them. Also, I sometimes feel like I haven't fully met someone, as if there is some unfinished business that we have to acknowledge if we are to really say that we have "confronted on another's reality" or something-such.
If I told you that I met Achilles would you doubt me? What if I told you that you can meet him too by reading the Illiad? Wouldn't it become apparent that I have not met Achilles and that I am stretching the meaning of the word?
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RE: A Conscious Creator - 7/11/2008 2:39:33 PM
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hellohellohi
Posts: 538
Joined: 12/10/2007
From: North Carolina!
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Yes, I agree that saying one has "met Jesus" may involve a stretching of the word. However, I was trying to undermine the surety of the original definition.
Certainly, though, meeting Achilles, meaning a person, and meeting him by reading the Iliad are different.
I am just saying that even when we meet someone again and again, there is some doubt as to who they are. I don't think Christians would say the same about the "meeting" of Jesus in that his contemporaneity may be even LESS doubtful than our fellow-travellers' so to speak. But I also acknolwedge this sounds ridiculous on the face of it.
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RE: A Conscious Creator - 7/13/2008 10:35:27 PM
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Jhud
Posts: 7212
Joined: 4/11/2005
From: Lake Wobegon
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quote:
If I told you that I met Achilles would you doubt me? What if I told you that you can meet him too by reading the Illiad? Wouldn't it become apparent that I have not met Achilles and that I am stretching the meaning of the word?
I think of course this is one of the great reasons that Lewis and Tolkien saw such differences between ancient mythologies and the gospels - no one ever portrayed Achilles as having existed at a particular time, interacting with specific contemporaneous people, the importance of him being dependent on certain circumstances having actually occurred as was written - in short, no one claimed to have ever have actually known Achilles. But a number of people attested to having known the historical Christ, and many went to their death claiming to have known Him - and the reason people claim to still is because their lives were transformed by Him, in reality.
_____________________________
Jack
“I mean to live my life an obedient man, but obedient to God, subservient to the wisdom of my ancestors; never to the authority of political truths arrived at yesterday at the voting booth”
William F. Buckley Jr. 1925-2008
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RE: A Conscious Creator - 7/16/2008 5:47:24 PM
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Real_Solitude
Posts: 346
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Jhud
I think of course this is one of the great reasons that Lewis and Tolkien saw such differences between ancient mythologies and the gospels - no one ever portrayed Achilles as having existed at a particular time, interacting with specific contemporaneous people, the importance of him being dependent on certain circumstances having actually occurred as was written - in short, no one claimed to have ever have actually known Achilles.
I thought he was depicted as having existed during the Trojan War, and having interacted with quite specific people. Agamemnon, Calchas, Telephus etc... (To pull a few randomly from the Wiki)
I'm not sure about the rest, because I'm not any sort of expert on Greek mythology.
quote:
But a number of people attested to having known the historical Christ, and many went to their death claiming to have known Him - and the reason people claim to still is because their lives were transformed by Him, in reality.
Source?
To my knowledge, the only person we know of that knew the living Christ that died still claiming it was James (?). His death being recorded in the same book that made the original claim of Christ's divinity.
People still claiming to know Christ really has no bearing on the truth value of the Biblical Christ having existed. After all, people claim to know Buddha/Allah/etc... without this adding anything to their existence/divinity.
_____________________________
"Instead of feeling alone in a group its better to have real solitude all by yourself."
~Faye Valentine
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