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RE: Men's/Women's roles in the Home - One Stop Thread - 9/20/2009 11:59:59 PM
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myka
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What about the men who feel alienated from their families because they are working full time and are not part of the 'raising' of the child? They also can feel stretched thin by their responsibilities to work, family, household duties, etc. I know a lot of men in my own life who struggle with how to balance all the responsibilities that they have and maintain the kind of home life that they want for their families.
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RE: Men's/Women's roles in the Home - One Stop Thread - 9/21/2009 7:56:00 AM
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3cappuccinosmom
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Some of the struggle comes with families being all over the place with activities. My husband worked long hours, but when he was home, he was *home*. That was one of the many reasons we didn't have TV and rarely watched movies. I made sure that we were ready when he came home, did all my errands and cleaning before that, finished our school lessons in the morning, and didn't schedule activities or appointments in the late afternoon, so that we were free to spend time with him, or any of the boys were free to go with him on a walk or somewhere in the car with him. He took the Sabbath rest seriously and we rarely went out an did stuff on Sundays, but spent the day together at home as a family, maybe had company in the evening.
Working long hours doesn't have to mean a dad doesn't see his kids. It does mean sacrificing things like outside activities and TV/computer time. But the parent at home can coordinate the household so that when dad comes home, everyone is ready to spend time with him.
_____________________________
 Moo
The Ballad of Bad Biruk
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RE: Men's/Women's roles in the Home - One Stop Thread - 9/21/2009 8:20:46 AM
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SurpassingPeace
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I try to do things much like 3Caps. I try to have everything done so he can just be here with us when he is off. That isn't working out perfectly right now becase we have 4.5 month old. But he will be the first to tell that the first 6 months of a new baby is triage. Also, because of what my husband does he would be working long hours anyway. With me at home it takes a great deal of pressure off of him because he doesn't have to worry about the bills, housekeeer, having clean clothes, food etc. The only he thing that is really his responsibility is the law. Next year we will have most of the medical bills paid off so I will probably hire that done.
I am also very picky with our activities. I think long and hard before I add another one on to our schedule. The benefit has to greatly outweigh the time it will take up. I do not want to be one of those families that run all over the place all the time eating half of their dinners in the car.
Karen
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RE: Men's/Women's roles in the Home - One Stop Thread - 9/21/2009 10:57:47 AM
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myka
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These are people who do not have a lot of extra activities and who spend time with dad when he is home; he just isn't home much. These men feel alienated from the daily life of their families, sometimes because their wives are taking care of much of the daily life at home. They also feel a sense of guilt because they aren't caring for their families' in the daily activities.
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RE: Men's/Women's roles in the Home - One Stop Thread - 9/21/2009 12:48:05 PM
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solo_soprano23
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I think I know what you mean, myka. I didn't have many extra activities when I was young, and still to this day, I go entire days without seeing my dad (although I'm an adult, he still works the same). He worked all day, and usually by the time he got home, I was in bed because it was late. I wish he'd been here more, but there was really nothing I could do about it. My mom worked too, but I always had her around. I know both my parents did what they did for our good, but I just don't want that for my own kids. I want both parents around.
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For God, For Learning, Forever.
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RE: Men's/Women's roles in the Home - One Stop Thread - 9/21/2009 1:01:15 PM
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hnt
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quote:
ORIGINAL: myka
These are people who do not have a lot of extra activities and who spend time with dad when he is home; he just isn't home much. These men feel alienated from the daily life of their families, sometimes because their wives are taking care of much of the daily life at home. They also feel a sense of guilt because they aren't caring for their families' in the daily activities.
I can certainly understand that myka. I think at times my own father struggled with that. He and my mother changed things around a bit so he would feel more involved. It does effect some men differently, and that's okay! 
_____________________________
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Emotional abuse and Faith
Reaching for IT!!!!!!
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RE: Men's/Women's roles in the Home - One Stop Thread - 9/21/2009 1:08:59 PM
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SurpassingPeace
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That is why my husband gets up at 5am to go into the office so he can normally be home around 4-4:30pm each day. He is then able to spend time with us, have dinner together, give Hannah a bath and put her to bed. Then after the kids are in bed, if he needs to he will work on his laptop. It works for our family. In case anyone was wondering, I get up and start my workday around the same time.
Karen
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RE: Men's/Women's roles in the Home - One Stop Thread - 9/21/2009 1:22:09 PM
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3cappuccinosmom
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quote:
That is why my husband gets up at 5am to go into the office so he can normally be home around 4-4:30pm each day. He is then able to spend time with us, have dinner together, give Hannah a bath and put her to bed. Then after the kids are in bed, if he needs to he will work on his laptop. It works for our family. In case anyone was wondering, I get up and start my workday around the same time.
And even when a husband can't set his own schedule, being at home has the advantage of allowing me to arrange the family's schedule to fit his work schedule.
When my husband worked 2nd shift at a factory, he'd come home at 11 pm and we'd have supper together then, with ds1 sitting in his lap eating off his plate, and then we'd all sleep in with him in the morning.  When he worked third shift, we had the hours before he left together. Homeschooling allowed us to continue the schedule-shifting as the children got older. Had I been working, I could not have done this, and the kids simply would have seen even less of both of us, which doesn't seem to me like a great solution to seeing less of dad than of mom. 
I think the absolute ideal would be a family business where both parents were working in and around the home, available all the time, and the kids grew up spending their days with and working with their parents. However, since that's not always possible, we're going by what we see as our Biblical obligations, him to work to provide for his family, and me to keep the home and run it well (and fullfill my infant's biological design to need mommy closeby), and if we can't have the ideal, we do our absolute best with what we do have.
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Moo
The Ballad of Bad Biruk
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RE: Men's/Women's roles in the Home - One Stop Thread - 9/22/2009 7:46:29 AM
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car2ner
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quote:
I wish it were that extended family pulled together with the children. How wonderful to have aunts, uncles, grandmas, papas, cousin, etc. in your life.
In a perfect world this would probably be the cast. This is where the old saying, "It takes a village to raise a child" comes in to place. Growing up our neighborhood was close knit, or atleast it seemed so to us kids. In gaining more choices it seems we have lost others. For a SAHM it may be lonely with most of the other moms going off to work and the neighborhood is quiet.
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RE: Men's/Women's roles in the Home - One Stop Thread - 9/22/2009 8:38:51 AM
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Sideways
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And I know parents who both work who arrange their schedules creatively, so that the kids see a lot of their parents and mom and dad maintain a good relationship with each other. I think the point is that depending on the family, there are a lot of different ways to make things work.
_____________________________
Row, row, row your boat, gently down the stream. If you see a crocodile, don't forget to scream.
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RE: Men's/Women's roles in the Home - One Stop Thread - 9/29/2009 3:32:04 AM
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rockominal
Posts: 679
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From: Indiana
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quote:
ORIGINAL: myka
What about the men who feel alienated from their families because they are working full time and are not part of the 'raising' of the child? They also can feel stretched thin by their responsibilities to work, family, household duties, etc. I know a lot of men in my own life who struggle with how to balance all the responsibilities that they have and maintain the kind of home life that they want for their families.
I don't get to see alot of my relatives or friends.
You know, I never really listened to this particular folk or pop song on the radio much until recently. I've rarely IF EVER really listened to the words to popular songs in my life. I've always been partial to instrumental music. Anyways, check it out, "if you can find the time" , no pun intended:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zH46SmVv8SU&feature=related
_____________________________
I might tell you the truth, or something pretty close to it. Jesus says, "I Am the Truth."
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RE: Men's/Women's roles in the Home - One Stop Thread - 9/29/2009 4:02:11 AM
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rockominal
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From: Indiana
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Belle_Texas
Hi Connie, my name is Carrie, Im a woman and I totally agree with you.
I guess Im old fashioned but I don't get why some women would want the role of a man..we all have our place and I believe that God knew what He was doing when He designed us the way He did.
Men should be head of the house, they will be held accountable for that when they stand before the Lord, I believe.
Just as, us as women, will be held accountable for our roles.
Society, as a whole, is so messed up as far as who does what, when and how, that why is it as God's children we should fall in that same trap???
He's given us His Word..isn't that enough?
If you're old fashioned, then other than what you've said here would be considered the new fashion (?) , I guess. Is there some sort of way you could be cloned, Belle? You know, like where there could be more of you and less of everything else out there?
On a sort of related note, Sue244 posted a comment, I don't mean to plagiarize this but let me know if I am:
quote:
If you really think about it most of supposed feminist advancements have actually freed men from their responsibility. So I don't think its really much of a surprise that female happiness is declining.
That was in regards to the Paradox thread by Marcus, if I may. I don't know much or anything about the feminist movement. If such is the case, I don't have a daughter or anything, but if I did, I know that severing any responsibility I had to her or for her, wife, or women in general, would certainly make me jump up and down with joy. 
Maybe I don't know what love is all about. Or do I? Who knows? I don't know. Is that what this is all about? Man and his "happiness" up +1; female score -1? Here I go again with yet another one of my favorite tunes. Is that what this is all about,.. Alfie?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0lDSf0A9RTk
_____________________________
I might tell you the truth, or something pretty close to it. Jesus says, "I Am the Truth."
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RE: Men's/Women's roles in the Home - One Stop Thread - 10/1/2009 10:59:11 PM
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rockominal
Posts: 679
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From: Indiana
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Belle_Texas
quote:
If you're old fashioned, then other than what you've said here would be considered the new fashion (?) , I guess. Is there some sort of way you could be cloned, Belle? You know, like where there could be more of you and less of everything else out there?
On a sort of related note, Sue244 posted a comment, I don't mean to plagiarize this but let me know if I am:
now THAT's a scary thought...if I think the world is messed up now I can't even imagine how messed up it would be with more one of me...  but thank you for saying that.
You're more than welcome Belle. I don't want to rain on this lighthearted topic or anything but sometimes I obsess over this stuff and I get quite serious. When I say cloning, I mean verbatim. All the nuances and everything else. Not one, not two, but 2,000 Belle's spread out everywhere. That would give these social engineers a taste of their own medicine.
I think it started after watching that movie The Sixth Day with Arnold Schwarzenegger. Don't watch that if it's too disturbing. But then, there was another one with Michael Keaton called Multiplicity. It's more lighthearted and was on the AMC channel recently.
But I got to get off the cloud and realize that you know the truth of the matter. That God in His infinite wisdom put you here in this time and place. It's like He's saying "I can do just fine with one Belle". Therefore, that's even more dynamic and incredible than the cloning thing.
_____________________________
I might tell you the truth, or something pretty close to it. Jesus says, "I Am the Truth."
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RE: Men's/Women's roles in the Home - One Stop Thread - 10/2/2009 11:33:31 AM
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Covaan_Meshuga
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Hee-hee-hee!
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Abiyah, if you had known them as G-d knows them, you would have answered them differently.
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RE: Men's/Women's roles in the Home - One Stop Thread - 10/5/2009 8:26:57 AM
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Belle_Texas
Posts: 222
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From: Texas!! Where else???
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quote:
ORIGINAL: rockominal
quote:
ORIGINAL: Belle_Texas
quote:
If you're old fashioned, then other than what you've said here would be considered the new fashion (?) , I guess. Is there some sort of way you could be cloned, Belle? You know, like where there could be more of you and less of everything else out there?
On a sort of related note, Sue244 posted a comment, I don't mean to plagiarize this but let me know if I am:
now THAT's a scary thought...if I think the world is messed up now I can't even imagine how messed up it would be with more one of me... but thank you for saying that.
You're more than welcome Belle. I don't want to rain on this lighthearted topic or anything but sometimes I obsess over this stuff and I get quite serious. When I say cloning, I mean verbatim. All the nuances and everything else. Not one, not two, but 2,000 Belle's spread out everywhere. That would give these social engineers a taste of their own medicine.
I think it started after watching that movie The Sixth Day with Arnold Schwarzenegger. Don't watch that if it's too disturbing. But then, there was another one with Michael Keaton called Multiplicity. It's more lighthearted and was on the AMC channel recently.
But I got to get off the cloud and realize that you know the truth of the matter. That God in His infinite wisdom put you here in this time and place. It's like He's saying "I can do just fine with one Belle". Therefore, that's even more dynamic and incredible than the cloning thing.
I remember thinking back in the 70's when I was in school that society was so mixed up. I remember the feminist telling all the women that we could have it all and then some....look how that turned out?? I remember thinking that no one seems to know their place anymore.
My poor dad looked so confused when my mother, due to finances, had to go back into the workplace after being a stay at home mom for 17yrs. I almost fainted when I saw my dad vacuuming one day because helping out with the housework was one of the conditions my dad agreed to so my mother could work and help out financially.
I know that I am here for a reason, this time this place, but I do think about how it could have been had circumstances been different. I pray that God can use me for whatever purpose He has. Thank you again for your kind words. I really needed to hear that today.
_____________________________
Don't get tired of doing what's right for in due
season you shall reap if you don't faint.
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RE: Men's/Women's roles in the Home - One Stop Thread - 11/8/2009 8:30:02 PM
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cynthia
Posts: 7015
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From: Beautiful Puget Sound Region
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quote:
ORIGINAL: myka
What about the men who feel alienated from their families because they are working full time and are not part of the 'raising' of the child? They also can feel stretched thin by their responsibilities to work, family, household duties, etc. I know a lot of men in my own life who struggle with how to balance all the responsibilities that they have and maintain the kind of home life that they want for their families.
This is an all too common scenario. Mostly it is brought on by one or a combination of major factors:
- Not properly given life skills training by parents, which leads to #2
- Not properly prepared for marriage and family life
- Not planning properly
- Unforeseen circumstances that caused major life challenges
These are the ones that readily come to mind and have happened in my family. My husband and I are raising our children up so all of them have a means to support themselves come what may. We instill the values in our children that they must be prepared for children before they get married, because sex causes pregnancy whether you think it will or not. (We probably all know people that have had children unexpectedly. If you don’t, you can count me as the first.) People should not get married until they can care for a family and be able to raise up godly children.
I believe one or both parents should be home with the children. Biblically, I believe it is the husband that should be the main provider, but this can change in times of trouble. This can be done even in this day and age, but it is best accomplished by planning and training for it in advance. When a parent has a particularly demanding job, the couple should work together to provide for adequate family time. Some here have shown how they do it in their homes. It cannot always be done, but when it is impossible, the couple should fast, pray and plan for the changing the situation into something better. We are seldom stuck in a situation forever. Things can change dramatically. In the mean time, we do what we can to adapt and make it work while working to change things for the better.
If a husband is working too much, sending the wife to work as well won’t help the situation. It will only make it harder with two people working and trying to care for the children, keep the house, and do all the other things that need to be attended to in family life. I have been at home for 14 years now. It has eased my husband considerably, as he no longer has to cook, clean, drive the children around to appointments, etc. Those are my jobs for the most part, except on weekends, when we split some of those duties. When the children are adults, we will move back to a more balanced approach, as I will be working again. When we only had one child, but were both working full time, it was exhausting and much more difficult on our family. Quitting my job made things a lot harder financially, but we had a much better family life and were able to cut our expenses and live more cheaply with me at home.
If a husband and wife are working together in unity to make these things happen, life is much easier, but if a husband and wife are not on the same page, things will not go smoothly. It’s like conjoined twins trying to move in separate directions, nothing gets done and pain is the result. I remember watching a show on television about two men who were conjoined. They would get into physical fights. It was horrible and pathetic. They didn’t accomplish much. However, if they had worked together and learned to submit to one another who knows that they could have accomplished. It is the same within marriage. Rather than trying to drag one another around, we should be working together in unity to do the will of God and see to the health of our marriages.
< Message edited by cynthia -- 11/8/2009 8:37:36 PM >
_____________________________
My husband and I have a motto:
We are the leader. We are one.
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RE: Men's/Women's roles in the Home - One Stop Thread - 11/8/2009 11:13:25 PM
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Mollymouser
Posts: 3951
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From: california, land of the happy cows
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quote:
ORIGINAL: cynthia
I believe one or both parents should be home with the children. Biblically, I believe it is the husband that should be the main provider, but this can change in times of trouble. This can be done even in this day and age, but it is best accomplished by planning and training for it in advance....
I have been at home for 14 years now. It has eased my husband considerably, as he no longer has to cook, clean, drive the children around to appointments, etc. ...Quitting my job made things a lot harder financially, but we had a much better family life and were able to cut our expenses and live more cheaply with me at home.....
Rather than trying to drag one another around, we should be working together in unity to do the will of God and see to the health of our marriages.
Nice!
_____________________________
  MARRIED TO A MILITARY PILOT ~ PLEASE PRAY FOR OUR TROOPS!
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RE: Men's/Women's roles in the Home - One Stop Thread - 11/9/2009 1:11:31 AM
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myka
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quote:
It has eased my husband considerably, as he no longer has to cook, clean, drive the children around to appointments, etc. Those are my jobs for the most part, except on weekends, when we split some of those duties.
In my experience (both for my own family and others that I know), some husbands feel like they are not part of family life because they are not cooking, cleaning, taking the kids to appointments and such. For much of my married life, I took on those responsibilities to 'help' my husband be able to concentrate on earning a living and providing financially for our family. Through my dh's mental crisis, I realized that I had enabled his feeling of disconnection from our family; I had to change my thinking and my actions on various things. I had taken on too much of the home responsibilities and had freed him from contributing to the running of the household. I thought that it was giving him the ability to just be with us when he wasn't working, but he needed to feel like he was contributing in a practical way to the daily life.
quote:
If a husband is working too much, sending the wife to work as well won’t help the situation. It will only make it harder with two people working and trying to care for the children, keep the house, and do all the other things that need to be attended to in family life.
If it allows the husband to work less and take up the slack in caring for the children and household, it does help him to not work as much.
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RE: Men's/Women's roles in the Home - One Stop Thread - 11/9/2009 10:25:54 AM
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Anon101
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I'm reading this and sadly my husband just told me to go out and get a job. We had decided jointly that I'd stay home with our child once we had one. Our son has enjoyed having me around everyday and I have been blessed to have been with him as he hit all his big milestones (crawling, walking, talking, etc). I grieve that I will not be able to be with him, but my husband and his family and members of my own family have all weighed in a said "get a job". In today's world if you want to stay home with your child and work inside the home you are looked down upon.
I do not believe that our society puts much value on SAHMs. According to society and many churches you are expected to work outside the home. Your value is not what you bring to your family but how many $$ are on your paycheck. Many husband's/men's identities are wrapped up in their job title. They are no longer husbands/fathers but if you ask them who they are their answer will be "I'm a VP at... or a Director at ..." Just look at how many men took their own lives after getting fired losing their money in the stock market. It's crazy.
I know even within my own Christian family I'm not as valuable or accomplished because I "just" stay at home and take care of my son and home.
I had an acquaintance of mine ask me "so you're just going to suck off your husband's income?" I just rolled my eyes because their is not much you can say to people who do not value the contribution of SAHMs.
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RE: Men's/Women's roles in the Home - One Stop Thread - 11/9/2009 10:34:34 AM
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Sideways
Posts: 3376
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Lorilynn777
In today's world if you want to stay home with your child and work inside the home you are looked down upon.
I do not believe that our society puts much value on SAHMs. According to society and many churches you are expected to work outside the home. Your value is not what you bring to your family but how many $$ are on your paycheck.
I am truly sorry for what you are going through now. I can imagine it must be very difficult for you, but I can't agree that what you said is universally true. I live in Georgia, with extended family in New York, and I've been blessed with tremendous support for my decision to SAH from almost every corner.
I'm not trying to brag. I know that some do not receive such support, but sometimes I think attitudes are a product of where you live. At least half or more of the moms in my area SAH full time, and of those who don't, many only work part time, with very good child care arrangements (like the mom works at night or on weekends).
_____________________________
Row, row, row your boat, gently down the stream. If you see a crocodile, don't forget to scream.
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RE: Men's/Women's roles in the Home - One Stop Thread - 11/9/2009 12:34:15 PM
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cynthia
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From: Beautiful Puget Sound Region
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quote:
ORIGINAL: myka
In my experience (both for my own family and others that I know), some husbands feel like they are not part of family life because they are not cooking, cleaning, taking the kids to appointments and such. For much of my married life, I took on those responsibilities to 'help' my husband be able to concentrate on earning a living and providing financially for our family. Through my dh's mental crisis, I realized that I had enabled his feeling of disconnection from our family; I had to change my thinking and my actions on various things. I had taken on too much of the home responsibilities and had freed him from contributing to the running of the household. I thought that it was giving him the ability to just be with us when he wasn't working, but he needed to feel like he was contributing in a practical way to the daily life.
How would that be your fault? Did you ignore him and take over when he wanted to participate?
My husband is involved in family life and participates in running our household, but we both have our primary jobs. This is something we planned together so that we could spend the most time possible with our children and not be trying to do too many things at once.
It has been a mixed bag for me regarding staying at home. Some family members were extremely opposed to it, but we surround ourselves with supportive people and good relationships, as well as establishing healthy boundaries. The people who tried to discourage us are not longer bothering us.
ETA:
quote:
ORIGINAL: Lorilynn777
I'm reading this and sadly my husband just told me to go out and get a job.
So he commanded you? How do you feel about that? Do you think that is a husband honoring his wife and loving her? Does he make all the decisions? Does he usually include you in his decision making process? How do you think this will impact your son’s understanding of marriage and family life?
< Message edited by cynthia -- 11/9/2009 12:49:03 PM >
_____________________________
My husband and I have a motto:
We are the leader. We are one.
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RE: Men's/Women's roles in the Home - One Stop Thread - 11/9/2009 2:51:17 PM
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myka
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quote:
How would that be your fault? Did you ignore him and take over when he wanted to participate?
I took over things so efficiently and fully, that there was not really anywhere that he could participate. When he was at home there wasn't anything that he needed to do. He didn't recognize it as a problem until he had a mental health crisis. He said that he didn't want to have to be responsible for the household duties as well as his work responsibilities--until the crisis.
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RE: Men's/Women's roles in the Home - One Stop Thread - 11/9/2009 3:57:38 PM
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KaptZ
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I wouldn't say my wife and I have any set 'roles' as far that goes. I usually take care of the cars and the landscaping, but that more my 'thing' than a set role. We share the childrearing, cooking, cleaning, food shopping etc.
We're pretty good at covering eachother's back so it never really ends up being discussed at all.
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