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RE: President Obama - 11/10/2008 9:39:35 AM
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P31W
Posts: 2244
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quote:
If he moves outside of the law and becomes oppressive we should then fight against him personally. If we don't like his politics then we should fight against them and expect our representatives to do the same. If he lies, we should call him a liar. If he does something that is anti-American we should call it what it is.
Can we call him a murder if he enacts a law that expands abortion in my state and overturns our state laws that help to "protect life"?
Would calling him a murderer (one who takes the life of the innocent willingly and with forthought) be slander?
My understanding is that Christians are to be honest and tell the truth. Slander is about a falsehood.
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RE: President Obama - 11/10/2008 10:36:10 AM
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kernsfamily
Posts: 837
Joined: 4/26/2006
From: Dallas (originally Detroit)
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quote:
ORIGINAL: P31W
quote:
If he moves outside of the law and becomes oppressive we should then fight against him personally. If we don't like his politics then we should fight against them and expect our representatives to do the same. If he lies, we should call him a liar. If he does something that is anti-American we should call it what it is.
Can we call him a murder if he enacts a law that expands abortion in my state and overturns our state laws that help to "protect life"?
Would calling him a murderer (one who takes the life of the innocent willingly and with forthought) be slander?
My understanding is that Christians are to be honest and tell the truth. Slander is about a falsehood.
To call Obama a "murderer" would be a far "stretch" of the truth. And, as a conservative Christian, nothing irks me more than getting something in the mail about some issue, from a so-called "Christian" organization, only to find that what was stated, was a "far stretch of the truth"....
Abortions have occurred under ALL presidents....even BEFORE roe v. wade "legalized" it...Plenty have occurred in the past 8 years...does that make George W. one too?
For Obama to be a 'murderer', he would have to be the individual either performing the abortion....or, the person CHOOSING to get the abortion.
while abortion is "legal" here....that in no way means it's the only choice people have.
Ideally, we COULD live in a country where, while abortion is "legal", no one gets one. No one FORCES anyone to get one. (and, as mentioned, even BEFORE the "legalization", there were still plenty of abortions going on)....
As Christians, we have the ability to prevent at least some abortions...by reaching out into the community...and out to those who may THINK abortion is the 'only way'...and, guide them towards one of the other "options" out there....
< Message edited by kernsfamily -- 11/10/2008 10:45:19 AM >
_____________________________
Proud dad of 3 great girls....Blessed to have all of them in a "totally awesome" public elementary school!
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RE: President Obama - 11/10/2008 10:43:38 AM
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P31W
Posts: 2244
Joined: 6/13/2005
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quote:
For Obama to be a 'murderer', he would have to be the individual either performing the abortion....or, the person CHOOSING to get the abortion
My STATE has worked very hard to protect the rights of the unborn. OBAMA wants to take those state rights/laws away and have a clinic in every country of our state. He wants to take my tax dollars to fund these abortions, he wants to do away with our laws that require parential concent and 24 hour waiting period.
He has promised to do these things if elected. Now that he has been elected I expect him to stay true to that work and "help" women who want an abortion get one without any delay or obsticals set in their way. He promised the clear the path for children under 18 to get abortions in my state.
Hilter may have never murdered anyone with is own hands but that does not mean his is not a murderer. You cannot wash the blood off your hands if "you" were the one who enabled and encouraged the murders to occur. You cannot pretend that you were an innocent bystander without the ability to "prevent" what was occuring.
quote:
As Christians, we have the ability to prevent at least some abortions...by reaching out into the community...and out to those who may THINK abortion is the 'only way'...and, guide them towards one of the other "options" out there....
We also have had and still have the ability to help prevent muder of the innocent by working with our state legislatures to pass laws that make having an aboriton harder and more restrictions placed on the abortion provider so that they will have less chance of making profits. We can also work against Obama and the Freedom of Choice Act that he promised to sign into law.
There are many legals avenues still open to us. We must use them.
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RE: President Obama - 11/10/2008 10:46:23 AM
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kernsfamily
Posts: 837
Joined: 4/26/2006
From: Dallas (originally Detroit)
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quote:
OBAMA wants to take those state rights/laws away and have a clinic in every country of our state.
then, your state can CHOOSE to make sure those clinics are EMPTY....and put them out of business, due to the "lack of business".....
quote:
OBAMA wants to take those state rights/laws away and have a clinic in every country of our state.
aren't you in Texas? I am thinking you are...
If so, where has he stated that?
_____________________________
Proud dad of 3 great girls....Blessed to have all of them in a "totally awesome" public elementary school!
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RE: President Obama - 11/10/2008 10:49:57 AM
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StephK
Posts: 2843
Joined: 4/11/2005
From: Southwest Louisiana
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She lives in Mississippi.
_____________________________
Stephanie
Envy is always referred to by its political alias, "social justice."
~ Thomas Sowell
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RE: President Obama - 11/10/2008 10:51:43 AM
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LabGuy
Posts: 1140
Joined: 9/22/2007
From: NW Pennsylvania
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If the policies Obama implements directly lead to additional abortions being performed than otherwise would have, then he shares in the responsibility; blood will be on his hands.
It's like buying a gun for somebody you know will use it to commit murder. You don't pull the trigger, but you make the killing possible. Any court of law would convict you of being an accessory in a heartbeat.
As for the people who voted for Obama, that's the subject of another thread.
-Robb
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RE: President Obama - 11/10/2008 10:51:57 AM
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P31W
Posts: 2244
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I live in Mississippi. We have only ONE abortion clinic in our entire state. Obama wants one in each county. Our laws are some of the strictest in the nation.
Obama promised to sign into law "The Freedom of Choice Act". That act would strike down every state law there is across the country.
Your and my child could then at the age of 12 have an abortion paid with our tax dollars and WE not know about it until the next day when we found her bleeding to death in her bed.
(abortion is safe? sure?)
< Message edited by P31W -- 11/10/2008 11:01:09 AM >
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RE: President Obama - 11/10/2008 11:00:31 AM
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P31W
Posts: 2244
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Q. Even if the Supreme Court overturns Roe v. Wade, won't states protect women's reproductive rights?
A. Not everywhere. In recent years, state legislators have enacted hundreds of anti-choice laws, from biased counseling and mandatory delays, restrictions on young women's access, targeted regulation of abortion providers, and separate legal status for embryos and fetuses. The situation will likely worsen dramatically if Roe is overturned. Also, women in many states could face sweeping criminal bans on abortion if Roe v. Wade is overturned. It is essential that the federal government step in to protect women since the states have such a wide disparity in protections for reproductive freedom. Liberty should not be a patchwork available only to women fortunate enough to live in a state that recognizes a woman's fundamental human right to decide whether to continue a pregnancy.
Q. Does FOCA go beyond the rights granted to women in Roe v. Wade?
A. Like the Supreme Court decision in Roe v. Wade, FOCA will prohibit state interference with a woman's right to an abortion prior to the point of viability. As under Roe, states will be able to prohibit abortion after viability, unless necessary to protect the woman's life or health. FOCA will restore the reproductive rights recognized under the 1973 Roe decision, before these rights were eroded by onerous state and federal restrictions aimed at curtailing women's ability to make reproductive decisions.
FOCA also forbids government from interfering with a woman's right to choose to bear a child. Moreover, it prohibits discrimination against the exercise of reproductive rights.
Q. Does FOCA prohibit states from limiting access to abortion services for minors?
A. FOCA prohibits states from enacting laws intended to deny or interfere with a woman's fundamental right to choose abortion. Minors have long been included within the protections of Roe. Parental consent or notification statutes have been used as a tool to deny access to abortion services for minors. When such laws deny or interfere with the ability of minors to access abortion services, they would violate FOCA.
This is from NOW.org
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RE: President Obama - 11/10/2008 11:06:43 AM
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kernsfamily
Posts: 837
Joined: 4/26/2006
From: Dallas (originally Detroit)
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Ok..i found it...
wasn't sure if this was something that was WAY WAY 'out there' or not..
yes...very disappointing that Obama has "promised" that he will pass that legislation (if, indeed, it passes the house and senate)....
even more disappointing that individuals will actually "take him up on his offer"....as, no one forces anyone to do anything...
_____________________________
Proud dad of 3 great girls....Blessed to have all of them in a "totally awesome" public elementary school!
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RE: President Obama - 11/10/2008 11:14:42 AM
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P31W
Posts: 2244
Joined: 6/13/2005
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Many of those pregnant children will be taken to the abortion clinic by their molesters.
quote:
even more disappointing that individuals will actually "take him up on his offer"....as, no one forces anyone to do anything...
The role of the government is to protect the innocent. Just as laws need to be in existance that say it's wrong to molest children, muder the elderly or disabled we need to have laws in place that protect the "most innocent" among us. The unborn.
If everyone was "sin free" we would need "no laws". But a society must have certain laws in place if we want to live in a peaceful society.
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RE: President Obama - 11/10/2008 2:53:23 PM
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John_O
Posts: 7894
Joined: 9/5/2006
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quote:
ORIGINAL: LabGuy
If the policies Obama implements directly lead to additional abortions being performed than otherwise would have, then he shares in the responsibility; blood will be on his hands.
It's like buying a gun for somebody you know will use it to commit murder. You don't pull the trigger, but you make the killing possible. Any court of law would convict you of being an accessory in a heartbeat.
As for the people who voted for Obama, that's the subject of another thread.
-Robb
They gave the money to the man who's buying the gun. The way I see it they have blood on their hands too. (How can they sleep?)
_____________________________
Psalms 46:10 Be still, and know that I am God: I will be exalted among the heathen, I will be exalted in the earth.
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RE: President Obama - 11/10/2008 3:08:26 PM
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SovereignIsHe
Posts: 6479
Joined: 4/15/2005
From: Truth Project
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: kernsfamily
To call Obama a "murderer" would be a far "stretch" of the truth. And, as a conservative Christian, nothing irks me more than getting something in the mail about some issue, from a so-called "Christian" organization, only to find that what was stated, was a "far stretch of the truth"....
What is Obama guilty of in regards to abortion? Jesus said if you are angry with a brother without cause you have broken the commandment that says, Thou shall not murder...
What are those who champion abortion guilty of? And understand he's doing it from an ordained position of authority... The bible says it's an abomination for a ruler to be unjust...
What is the truth?
quote:
Abortions have occurred under ALL presidents....even BEFORE roe v. wade "legalized" it...Plenty have occurred in the past 8 years...does that make George W. one too?
Yes, since he believes it's just to murder the unborn child of a rape....
quote:
For Obama to be a 'murderer', he would have to be the individual either performing the abortion....or, the person CHOOSING to get the abortion.
Charles Manson never actually killed a person...
Obama is in a place of authority... To sanction murder from a position of authority is murder...
quote:
Ideally, we COULD live in a country where, while abortion is "legal", no one gets one.
The nature of man would dictate otherwise... Path of least resistance is the norm for man...
quote:
No one FORCES anyone to get one. (and, as mentioned, even BEFORE the "legalization", there were still plenty of abortions going on)....
Not over 3000 daily...
_____________________________
John
Proverbs 12:10 A righteous man regardeth the life of his beast: but the tender mercies of the wicked are cruel.
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RE: President Obama - 11/10/2008 4:47:03 PM
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John_O
Posts: 7894
Joined: 9/5/2006
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no. Which thread?
_____________________________
Psalms 46:10 Be still, and know that I am God: I will be exalted among the heathen, I will be exalted in the earth.
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RE: President Obama - 11/13/2008 8:11:53 AM
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wing2000
Posts: 1024
Joined: 4/14/2005
From: ...the beautiful Sonoran Desert
Status: offline
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quote:
My point is that we should not slander the man. I heard way too much of that when Clinton was in office and even more against Bush... I don't care for the name calling and slander.
Excellent thread...or at least it was until the last page or so.
I strongly disagreed with Bush foreign policy and made my position known since 2000 on these threads...yet quite frequently my policy disagreements were labled as:
Liberal
Bush Hater
Socialist
Terrorist sympathizer
etc.
Name calling is simply a good indicator that a poster is incapable of making logical argument...
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RE: President Obama - 11/13/2008 8:25:45 AM
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SonInMe1
Posts: 1870
Joined: 4/16/2005
From: my mom by God
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As I understand it, not only will Obama, if he can, expand the availability of abortions, he will cut funding for Crisis Preganacy Cenbters who offer alternatives to abortions.
If this is true, then it looks like he has an agenda...and since 35% of all abortions are from black mothers, with a 13% african american populace, it would seem Obama wants more of his own people killed.
What is that called? Someone started a thread comparing Obama with Joseph. I said he had more in common with Pharoh and Herrod, who killed children. It seems...appropriate.
_____________________________
You adulterous people, don't you know that friendship with the world is hatred toward God? Anyone who chooses to be a friend of the world becomes an enemy of God.
James 4:4
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