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RE: Texas Police shoot Pentecostal pastor with taser; attack congregation
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RE: Texas Police shoot Pentecostal pastor with taser; a... - 7/2/2009 1:09:53 PM
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ironsharpensiron
Posts: 1395
Joined: 4/21/2006
From: Los Angeles
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quote:
Wrong? Hardly. If a police officer assaults you with a deadly weapon for asking questions, you'd feel pretty ornary, too.
Although I wouldn't be interfering and asking questions when it is not my business...This pastor did, and got 'carnal' and ended up in the hospital because of his own actions.
All he had to do was wait, allow the officer to do his job, then, when finished, be the pastor for his congregant.
What sort of role-model is this guy for the other families and their kids..?
Matthew
_____________________________
"As iron sharpens iron, so a man sharpens the countenance of his friend." Proverbs 27:17
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RE: Texas Police shoot Pentecostal pastor with taser; a... - 7/2/2009 1:09:57 PM
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blessedinnyc
Posts: 2916
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From: NYC by way of Chicago
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quote:
ORIGINAL: _jjp_
quote:
ORIGINAL: blessedinnyc
Allegedly assaulted, contrary to the reports of 30 born-again Christian witnesses.
So you assume that the policeman is not a born again Christian? You do have a low view of those who maintain your safety.
No, I simply trust the morals that conservative evangelicalism imbues in the populace. It teaches leaders to avoid immorality and to respect authority. I trust God a lot more than I trust the police; you seem to have a dim view of Christian conservativism.
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RE: Texas Police shoot Pentecostal pastor with taser; a... - 7/2/2009 1:11:03 PM
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blessedinnyc
Posts: 2916
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quote:
ORIGINAL: ironsharpensiron
What sort of role-model is this guy for the other families and their kids..?
Matthew
That of Martin Luther King. If you see injustice, you question it. If you get attacked for doing God's work, all the better.
Me? I trust the pastor and the congregation.
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RE: Texas Police shoot Pentecostal pastor with taser; a... - 7/2/2009 1:11:18 PM
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_jjp_
Posts: 1844
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quote:
ORIGINAL: blessedinnyc
quote:
ORIGINAL: _jjp_
Had they watched and not interfered they wouldn't have been tased/sprayed.
So you trust the police over 30 born-again conservative evangelical Christians? Hmmm... trust the crowd of bystanders or one police officer who has more motive to lie than they do... And what happened to the dash cam?
Actually yes i would be more inclined to support a policeman who has as of yet not been proven of doing anything wrong over some people who have not had to undergo any sort of evaluation to be considered born again, whereas the policeman has been vetted to be stable enough to be in a position of power. I like how you assume that since these folks were in a pentecostal church for services that they are born again Christians. I am sure that quite a few of them were born again and also that many weren't.
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RE: Texas Police shoot Pentecostal pastor with taser; a... - 7/2/2009 1:12:16 PM
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SovereignIsHe
Posts: 6400
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From: Truth Project
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quote:
ORIGINAL: blessedinnyc
They hardly bum rushed in. They didn't even leave church property, and heck, they were pentecostal worshippers who have been trained to respect the authorities that be.
Doubtful they have been trained to respect authority...
_____________________________
John
Proverbs 12:10 A righteous man regardeth the life of his beast: but the tender mercies of the wicked are cruel.
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RE: Texas Police shoot Pentecostal pastor with taser; a... - 7/2/2009 1:12:24 PM
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GraceyGirl
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quote:
ORIGINAL: blessedinnyc
quote:
ORIGINAL: ironsharpensiron
What sort of role-model is this guy for the other families and their kids..?
Matthew
That of Martin Luther King. If you see injustice, you question it. If you get attacked for doing God's work, all the better.
Me? I trust the pastor and the congregation.
Way wrong answer. King was a peaceful questioner and demonstrator. Not a rabble rouser who put his congregants in potential harms way to justify his own grandstanding.
_____________________________
God called. He'd like His church back.
~John Wimber~
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RE: Texas Police shoot Pentecostal pastor with taser; a... - 7/2/2009 1:13:59 PM
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SovereignIsHe
Posts: 6400
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quote:
ORIGINAL: blessedinnyc
How do explain how the victim wound up in the hospital, then?
Stupidity and most likely a healthy dose of pride...
_____________________________
John
Proverbs 12:10 A righteous man regardeth the life of his beast: but the tender mercies of the wicked are cruel.
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RE: Texas Police shoot Pentecostal pastor with taser; a... - 7/2/2009 1:15:14 PM
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blessedinnyc
Posts: 2916
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From: NYC by way of Chicago
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quote:
ORIGINAL: blessedinnyc
Actually yes i would be more inclined to support a policeman who has as of yet not been proven of doing anything wrong over some people who have not had to undergo any sort of evaluation to be considered born again, whereas the policeman has been vetted to be stable enough to be in a position of power. I like how you assume that since these folks were in a pentecostal church for services that they are born again Christians. I am sure that quite a few of them were born again and also that many weren't.
They are members of the AG. You'd think that with all the influence the AG wields over its churches, some sort of rogue church that advocated resisting authority would have been weeded out.
Me? I trust the pentecostals. Christianity extends very well into politics and the evil liberal authorities that be should not be allowed to lie about what really happened. Release the dash cam or drop the charges.
quote:
Way wrong answer. King was a peaceful questioner and demonstrator. Not a rabble rouser who put his congregants in potential harms way to justify his own grandstanding.
CC: Bridge at Selma.
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RE: Texas Police shoot Pentecostal pastor with taser; a... - 7/2/2009 1:15:24 PM
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_jjp_
Posts: 1844
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quote:
ORIGINAL: blessedinnyc
quote:
ORIGINAL: _jjp_
quote:
ORIGINAL: blessedinnyc
Allegedly assaulted, contrary to the reports of 30 born-again Christian witnesses.
So you assume that the policeman is not a born again Christian? You do have a low view of those who maintain your safety.
No, I simply trust the morals that conservative evangelicalism imbues in the populace. It teaches leaders to avoid immorality and to respect authority. I trust God a lot more than I trust the police; you seem to have a dim view of Christian conservativism.
If the leaders are taught to respect authority under conservative evangelicanism then you have to assume that this "pastor" was not in line with conservative Christians and therefore you would have to assume that his congregation may have been being fed a false doctrine. See you make assumptions about a policeman that very well could be a born again Christian, could very well be serving in many different kind of ministries because of your bias against authority, I choose not to act like i can judge the heart of the man.
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RE: Texas Police shoot Pentecostal pastor with taser; a... - 7/2/2009 1:16:22 PM
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ironsharpensiron
Posts: 1395
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From: Los Angeles
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quote:
That of Martin Luther King. If you see injustice, you question it. If you get attacked for doing God's work, all the better.
How did he know there was 'injustice' going on..? Why was the congregant pulled over to begin with ~ perhaps a simple moving violation..? He was certainly not 'doing God's work,'
he was interfering in a police officers job. He then proceeds to stir up the congregation by getting them involved. He should be arrested for attempting to incite a riot.
Matthew
_____________________________
"As iron sharpens iron, so a man sharpens the countenance of his friend." Proverbs 27:17
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RE: Texas Police shoot Pentecostal pastor with taser; a... - 7/2/2009 1:16:37 PM
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SovereignIsHe
Posts: 6400
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From: Truth Project
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quote:
ORIGINAL: blessedinnyc
So you trust the police over 30 born-again conservative evangelical Christians? Hmmm... trust the crowd of bystanders or one police officer who has more motive to lie than they do... And what happened to the dash cam?
What is your basis for the cop having more motive to lie?
_____________________________
John
Proverbs 12:10 A righteous man regardeth the life of his beast: but the tender mercies of the wicked are cruel.
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RE: Texas Police shoot Pentecostal pastor with taser; a... - 7/2/2009 1:16:40 PM
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_jjp_
Posts: 1844
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quote:
ORIGINAL: blessedinnyc
If you see injustice, you question it.
Yeah getting pulled over is a HUGE injustice. Sad, really sad.
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RE: Texas Police shoot Pentecostal pastor with taser; a... - 7/2/2009 1:19:42 PM
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WesP
Posts: 1440
Joined: 11/28/2005
From: Where God needs me to be
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First, all the facts are not known. Supposing everyone is a Christian is amazing to me when we know that everyone that attends church is not necessarily a Christian. Supposing conservatism is another humorous bias. Which churches allow liberalism? At any rate, I do not see any proof presented to make either side the definite truth as yet. Did I miss something? Until that proof is provided, all this speculation is pointless and counterintuitive.
_____________________________
Peace,
Wes
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RE: Texas Police shoot Pentecostal pastor with taser; a... - 7/2/2009 1:20:03 PM
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SovereignIsHe
Posts: 6400
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From: Truth Project
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quote:
ORIGINAL: blessedinnyc
No, I simply trust the morals that conservative evangelicalism imbues in the populace.
Since when? You think anyone is buying in to this?
_____________________________
John
Proverbs 12:10 A righteous man regardeth the life of his beast: but the tender mercies of the wicked are cruel.
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RE: Texas Police shoot Pentecostal pastor with taser; a... - 7/2/2009 1:21:07 PM
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blessedinnyc
Posts: 2916
Joined: 10/12/2007
From: NYC by way of Chicago
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quote:
ORIGINAL: _jjp_
If the leaders are taught to respect authority under conservative evangelicanism then you have to assume that this "pastor" was not in line with conservative Christians and therefore you would have to assume that his congregation may have been being fed a false doctrine.
Respecting authority doesn't mean not questioning it. I simply can't believe that religious and moral conservativism is churning out authority-defying people like you allege this pastor is when it regularly produces great leaders like Mark Sanford, Larry Craig, Pat Robertson, Jimmy Swaggert, and Ted Haggard.
quote:
See you make assumptions about a policeman that very well could be a born again Christian, could very well be serving in many different kind of ministries because of your bias against authority, I choose not to act like i can judge the heart of the man.
The only reason he is in trouble is that the left-wing religion haters in the police force picked a fight with the church. Next time, he should learn better than to look outside to see what is going on and let the police activities happen in secret.
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RE: Texas Police shoot Pentecostal pastor with taser; a... - 7/2/2009 1:21:25 PM
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_jjp_
Posts: 1844
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Had this pastor witnessed a policeman beating a man merciliessly and went to shield the man with his own body then i would be singing his praises. Instead what he did was to interfere in the by all accounts legal traffic stop of a person.
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RE: Texas Police shoot Pentecostal pastor with taser; a... - 7/2/2009 1:22:25 PM
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blessedinnyc
Posts: 2916
Joined: 10/12/2007
From: NYC by way of Chicago
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quote:
ORIGINAL: SovereignIsHe
quote:
ORIGINAL: blessedinnyc
So you trust the police over 30 born-again conservative evangelical Christians? Hmmm... trust the crowd of bystanders or one police officer who has more motive to lie than they do... And what happened to the dash cam?
What is your basis for the cop having more motive to lie?
The fact that if he used a taser on someone, he'd better have had a very good reason for doing it if he wants to keep his job. Again, where is the dash cam when you need it?
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RE: Texas Police shoot Pentecostal pastor with taser; a... - 7/2/2009 1:23:08 PM
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buckifn
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The title of this thread is misleading. It sounded like the police officer went into a church and attacked a pastor. In truth the exact opposite happened. A police officer was conducting police business and a pastor interfered. He is lucky he and other's didn't get shot dead. If 30 people approached me and I were the officer I think there would have been a different outcome.
They should have stayed where they belonged.
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RE: Texas Police shoot Pentecostal pastor with taser; a... - 7/2/2009 1:24:02 PM
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_jjp_
Posts: 1844
Joined: 10/25/2007
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quote:
ORIGINAL: blessedinnyc
Respecting authority doesn't mean not questioning it. I simply can't believe that religious and moral conservativism is churning out authority-defying people like you allege this pastor is when it regularly produces great leaders like Mark Sanford, Larry Craig, Pat Robertson, Jimmy Swaggert, and Ted Haggard.
The pastor had no right to interfere in a lawful traffic stop. PERIOD
quote:
The only reason he is in trouble is that the left-wing religion haters in the police force picked a fight with the church. Next time, he should learn better than to look outside to see what is going on and let the police activities happen in secret.
What police ativity was happening in secret? It was in an open parking lot and being conducted LEGALLY and without harm to the person being stopped. Watching the stop would have been a perfectly respectable thing to do, interferring with a lawful stop is not.
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RE: Texas Police shoot Pentecostal pastor with taser; a... - 7/2/2009 1:24:11 PM
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ironsharpensiron
Posts: 1395
Joined: 4/21/2006
From: Los Angeles
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quote:
They are members of the AG. You'd think that with all the influence the AG wields over its churches, some sort of rogue church that advocated resisting authority would have been weeded out.
That's an amusing statement. Benny Hinn 'cleaned' up his act so he could become AG, then eventually went back to his old tricks, then left the AG.
The AG isn't 'all-knowing, all powerful.' They can, and do, have churches that don't adhere to all their rules & regs.
Matthew
_____________________________
"As iron sharpens iron, so a man sharpens the countenance of his friend." Proverbs 27:17
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RE: Texas Police shoot Pentecostal pastor with taser; a... - 7/2/2009 1:24:21 PM
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blessedinnyc
Posts: 2916
Joined: 10/12/2007
From: NYC by way of Chicago
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quote:
ORIGINAL: buckifn
The title of this thread is misleading. It sounded like the police officer went into a church and attacked a pastor. In truth the exact opposite happened. A police officer was conducting police business and a pastor interfered. He is lucky he and other's didn't get shot dead. If 30 people approached me and I were the officer I think there would have been a different outcome.
They should have stayed where they belonged.
Good thing you're not a police officer in Texas; if I were on the jury after your rampage, I'd try to stop the DP, but you know it would still happen; it's Texas.
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RE: Texas Police shoot Pentecostal pastor with taser; a... - 7/2/2009 1:25:04 PM
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SovereignIsHe
Posts: 6400
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From: Truth Project
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quote:
ORIGINAL: blessedinnyc
The fact that if he used a taser on someone, he'd better have had a very good reason for doing it if he wants to keep his job. Again, where is the dash cam when you need it?
He had 30-40 good reasons.... Not to mention he was in the act of doing his job...
_____________________________
John
Proverbs 12:10 A righteous man regardeth the life of his beast: but the tender mercies of the wicked are cruel.
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RE: Texas Police shoot Pentecostal pastor with taser; a... - 7/2/2009 1:25:25 PM
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blessedinnyc
Posts: 2916
Joined: 10/12/2007
From: NYC by way of Chicago
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quote:
ORIGINAL: ironsharpensiron
That's an amusing statement. Benny Hinn 'cleaned' up his act so he could become AG, then eventually went back to his old tricks, then left the AG.
The AG isn't 'all-knowing, all powerful.' They can, and do, have churches that don't adhere to all their rules & regs.
Yeah, but what are the odds of that in a small town in Texas? Maybe 1 in 100.
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RE: Texas Police shoot Pentecostal pastor with taser; a... - 7/2/2009 1:28:36 PM
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ironsharpensiron
Posts: 1395
Joined: 4/21/2006
From: Los Angeles
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quote:
Yeah, but what are the odds of that in a small town in Texas? Maybe 1 in 100.
Ahh, so now you're 'playing the odds' game...
Matthew
_____________________________
"As iron sharpens iron, so a man sharpens the countenance of his friend." Proverbs 27:17
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RE: Texas Police shoot Pentecostal pastor with taser; a... - 7/2/2009 1:29:02 PM
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_jjp_
Posts: 1844
Joined: 10/25/2007
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quote:
ORIGINAL: blessedinnyc
quote:
ORIGINAL: ironsharpensiron
That's an amusing statement. Benny Hinn 'cleaned' up his act so he could become AG, then eventually went back to his old tricks, then left the AG.
The AG isn't 'all-knowing, all powerful.' They can, and do, have churches that don't adhere to all their rules & regs.
Yeah, but what are the odds of that in a small town in Texas? Maybe 1 in 100.
Not exactly a small town in Texas, Webster is divide from Houston in name only, there is but a single pipeline right of way that is not fully developed between webster and downtown Houston.
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