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RE: can/should a Christian visit a mosque? - 7/26/2009 4:03:45 PM
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rcjames
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Eliana
quote:
ORIGINAL: rcjames
quote:
ORIGINAL: iluvatar
Would you visit a synagogue?
No.
I wouldn't have a problem participating in the service at a synagogue. At least they worship Yahweh. Muslims worship someone (or something) completely different.
That is certainly your perogative; as for me and mine we will woship God through the sacrifice of Jesus Christ.
(Joh 14:6) Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.
So to me and mine, anyway other than through Jesus is wrong, wrong, wrong; and I will not participate.
Thanks
RC
_____________________________
Just a country Preacher's humble opinion
Read the first chapter of my latest book here;
http://www.deliveranceofsara.com
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RE: can/should a Christian visit a mosque? - 7/26/2009 4:28:29 PM
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Eliana
Posts: 183
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From: Norway
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quote:
ORIGINAL: rcjames
quote:
ORIGINAL: Eliana
quote:
ORIGINAL: rcjames
quote:
ORIGINAL: iluvatar
Would you visit a synagogue?
No.
I wouldn't have a problem participating in the service at a synagogue. At least they worship Yahweh. Muslims worship someone (or something) completely different.
That is certainly your perogative; as for me and mine we will woship God through the sacrifice of Jesus Christ.
(Joh 14:6) Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.
So to me and mine, anyway other than through Jesus is wrong, wrong, wrong; and I will not participate.
Thanks
RC
This is probably a topic for another thread, which I think would be an interesting one.
IMO, attending service at a synagogue does not mean that you are not worshiping God through the sacrifice of Jesus. If that were the case, then all the apostles, and other members of the early church did something wrong by worshiping in the temple and at the synagogue. I know Jewish people who have come to faith in Jesus, but still attend worship now and then in their synagogue because they have a fuller understanding of how everything points to Messiah. But...I guess that belongs in another thread.
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RE: can/should a Christian visit a mosque? - 7/26/2009 5:22:26 PM
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rcjames
Posts: 6728
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From: Oklahoma
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Eliana
IMO, attending service at a synagogue does not mean that you are not worshiping God through the sacrifice of Jesus. If that were the case, then all the apostles, and other members of the early church did something wrong by worshiping in the temple and at the synagogue. I know Jewish people who have come to faith in Jesus, but still attend worship now and then in their synagogue because they have a fuller understanding of how everything points to Messiah. But...I guess that belongs in another thread.
Nice point well taken, but Christ and the diciples were there arguing the truth of the Gospel in the Jewish synagogs; and were mostly thrown out or were the object of potentioal death attempts; Christ in Nazareth, Paul in Corinth, etc.
Thanks
RC
_____________________________
Just a country Preacher's humble opinion
Read the first chapter of my latest book here;
http://www.deliveranceofsara.com
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RE: can/should a Christian visit a mosque? - 8/4/2009 3:20:11 PM
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djm1973
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quote:
ORIGINAL: rcjames
quote:
ORIGINAL: Eliana
IMO, attending service at a synagogue does not mean that you are not worshiping God through the sacrifice of Jesus. If that were the case, then all the apostles, and other members of the early church did something wrong by worshiping in the temple and at the synagogue. I know Jewish people who have come to faith in Jesus, but still attend worship now and then in their synagogue because they have a fuller understanding of how everything points to Messiah. But...I guess that belongs in another thread.
Nice point well taken, but Christ and the diciples were there arguing the truth of the Gospel in the Jewish synagogs; and were mostly thrown out or were the object of potentioal death attempts; Christ in Nazareth, Paul in Corinth, etc.
Thanks
RC
Interesting point here is that I found out in the world religions class I took, that some of the Jewish denominations (excluding the Messianic ones) do quote New Testament Scriptures. At the Service we attended for the class, the rabbi quoted from Mark, and then From Acts.
_____________________________
"For I know the plans I have for you...for a hope and a future." Jer 29:11
"He is no fool who gives what he cannot keep to gain what he cannot lose." (an entry in Jim Elliot's journal)
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RE: can/should a Christian visit a mosque? - 8/4/2009 5:02:45 PM
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Covaan_Meshuga
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I wasn't going to reply to this thread again, but I must.
Yes, my synagogue reads, respects, loves, and lives by the WHOLE Bible, including Matthew - Revelation. Most of all, it loves and reveres Messiah Yeshua, the one and only Son of the Almighty, who is and was and is to come.
And while Christians argue over whether or not Yeshua was even Jewish, over whether or not the church has replaced Israel, over the Torah being obsolete and done away with and abolished, more and more Jews are coming to faith and have no place to go. Why? Because the churches belittle those who love Messiah Yeshua within the context of His tradition! Because the churches demand that they eat a pork sandwich at their Easter and Christmas dinners and quit observing Yom Kipper and the other holy days, even though neither Easter nor Christmas are in the Bible, while the Holy Days are!
This is the latter times! More and more Jews are coming into the Kingdom all the time! They know what the Bible says to do, with regard to the Holy Days and eating kosher, and they want to serve Messiah fully, in the same way that He lived.
Please don't close them out through attitudes and words. Love them. They are the same blood as Yeshua -- your Jesus!
The churches' people have given no place for believing Jews to go to learn about Him!
_____________________________
While in prayer or praise, I am only as devoted to G-d as I am in my most private moments.
Abiyah, if you had known them as G-d knows them, you would have answered them differently.
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RE: can/should a Christian visit a mosque? - 8/4/2009 8:44:06 PM
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herestoresmysoul
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Eutychus
quote:
ORIGINAL: Covaan_Meshuga
Why hang around in the darkness when you can bask in the Light?
True, but in addition to visiting the mosque I mentioned, I also visited the wailing wall in Jerusalem. Both peoples were in darkness.
but at least the Jews are worshipping the same God as us
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RE: can/should a Christian visit a mosque? - 8/4/2009 8:50:58 PM
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herestoresmysoul
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I would never visit a mosque or EVER attend a service there. When you go into a mosque you have to remove your shoes as a mark of respect to their 'god' Allah, who is obviously a false God. I would never do anything as a mark of respect to a false god.
I visited one in Jerusalem as a 20 eyar old before I was a Christian, and many years later I felt led to repent, and now I would never go near one. A few years ago our Queen(I am fromthe UK) visited one so that she was seen as being 'politically correct' and she removed her shoes. I felt so sad when I heard that as she promised to be defender of the Faith and by doing that she wasnt. Prince Charles is apparently going to be defender of the FAITHS as he obviously isnt a christian.
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RE: can/should a Christian visit a mosque? - 8/5/2009 8:14:47 AM
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RJR_fan
Posts: 1168
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From: RTP, in sunny NC USA
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quote:
I visited one in Jerusalem as a 20 eyar old before I was a Christian, and many years later I felt led to repent, and now I would never go near one.
How can we show respect for Muslims even as we do our best to undermine their faith in Islam? It's a challenge. Is it a waste of time trying to evangelize Muslims? Can't say I have all the answers. We said goodbye to our Turkish friends yesterday, and they think differently about Christians now, after having spent a few years as our friends.
The next step is up to God. I pray that, when He discredits Islam, there will be a significant remnant among the Muslims who will be prepared to consider the Gospel.
_____________________________
Blogging my way through the Turkish New Testament
Meet my beloved mentor, RJR
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RE: can/should a Christian visit a mosque? - 8/5/2009 10:02:39 AM
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Eutychus
Posts: 6350
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From: Dothan, AL
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quote:
ORIGINAL: herestoresmysoul
...When you go into a mosque you have to remove your shoes as a mark of respect to their 'god' Allah, who is obviously a false God....
Not entirely true. I was not required to remove my shoes when I entered the mosque in Egypt, only put on shoe covers to not track in dirt from the outside.
_____________________________
Jesus answered and said to them, "This is the work of God, that you believe in Him whom He has sent." -John 6:29
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RE: can/should a Christian visit a mosque? - 8/5/2009 1:15:47 PM
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RJR_fan
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quote:
They worship the Triune God: Father, Son, & Holy Spirit?
Dat's gnus to me.
In fact, we take Scripture at face value, the identity of antichrist is really clear. According to John, in his three letters, the only places in the Bible where this word is used[1], "antichrist" = the myth (and those who preach it) that one can know the God of the Bible while denying Jesus Christ.
Last time I checked Muslims at least honor Jesus as a virgin-born prophet, rather than revile Him as the illegitimate son of a Roman soldier who now simmers in excrement!
[1] I just want to make it very clear that this discussion is not about prophecy!
< Message edited by RJR_fan -- 8/5/2009 1:52:29 PM >
_____________________________
Blogging my way through the Turkish New Testament
Meet my beloved mentor, RJR
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RE: can/should a Christian visit a mosque? - 8/5/2009 5:00:14 PM
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ladioffaith
Posts: 3172
Joined: 3/31/2005
From: NE Ohio (L.A. . . Lower Akron)
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I would not worship at a Mosque.
However, I would have no problem attending as an observer, or to promote understanding between Christians and Muslims, as long as people knew why I was there.
In my job, I had the opportunity to do just that in the wake of 9/11. I attended a reception where Muslims were chatting with Christians explaining why they do what they do. It was very interesting how they explained their "respect" for major figures in Christianity, and how confused many of them were. For instance, many of the women said they covered their head out of respect for Mary, the Mother of Jesus. Never mind that as a good Jewish girl, it is very unlikely that Mary covered her head.
_____________________________
~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*
The LORD your God is with you, he is mighty to save.
He will take great delight in you, he will quiet you with
his love, he will rejoice over you with singing." Zeph. 3:17
~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~
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RE: can/should a Christian visit a mosque? - 8/6/2009 6:58:44 AM
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seagullplayer
Posts: 332
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1 Corinthians 10:14 Wherefore, my dearly beloved, flee from idolatry.
1 Corinthians 10:15 I speak as to wise men; judge ye what I say.
1 Corinthians 10:16 The cup of blessing which we bless, is it not the communion of the blood of Christ? The bread which we break, is it not the communion of the body of Christ?
1 Corinthians 10:17 For we being many are one bread, and one body: for we are all partakers of that one bread.
1 Corinthians 10:18 Behold Israel after the flesh: are not they which eat of the sacrifices partakers of the altar?
1 Corinthians 10:19 What say I then? that the idol is any thing, or that which is offered in sacrifice to idols is any thing?
1 Corinthians 10:20 But I say, that the things which the Gentiles sacrifice, they sacrifice to devils, and not to God: and I would not that ye should have fellowship with devils.
1 Corinthians 10:21 Ye cannot drink the cup of the Lord, and the cup of devils: ye cannot be partakers of the Lord's table, and of the table of devils.
1 Corinthians 10:22 Do we provoke the Lord to jealousy? are we stronger than he?
1 Corinthians 10:23 All things are lawful for me, but all things are not expedient: all things are lawful for me, but all things edify not.
If someone in our congregation asked me the question I would advise against it.
I would not make a special trip to one myself.
Worship at one would be breaking the first commandment.
_____________________________
The world has only one problem, sin.
There is only one solution, Jesus.
Seems a lot of people watch evangelist on TV and call it going to church.
My kids use to play Mario Cart and think they where driving…
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RE: can/should a Christian visit a mosque? - 8/6/2009 7:15:29 AM
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herestoresmysoul
Posts: 1465
Joined: 3/13/2009
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Eutychus
quote:
ORIGINAL: herestoresmysoul
quote:
ORIGINAL: Eutychus
quote:
ORIGINAL: Covaan_Meshuga
Why hang around in the darkness when you can bask in the Light?
True, but in addition to visiting the mosque I mentioned, I also visited the wailing wall in Jerusalem. Both peoples were in darkness.
but at least the Jews are worshipping the same God as us
They worship the Triune God: Father, Son, & Holy Spirit?
Dat's gnus to me.
They worship the same God but dont believe that Jesus is the messiah.Thus their faith is incomplete as opposed to totally wrong.
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RE: can/should a Christian visit a mosque? - 8/6/2009 7:19:57 AM
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herestoresmysoul
Posts: 1465
Joined: 3/13/2009
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Eutychus
quote:
ORIGINAL: herestoresmysoul
...When you go into a mosque you have to remove your shoes as a mark of respect to their 'god' Allah, who is obviously a false God....
Not entirely true. I was not required to remove my shoes when I entered the mosque in Egypt, only put on shoe covers to not track in dirt from the outside.
maybe mosques differ then cos I definately had to remove my shoes at the one in Jerusalem.
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RE: can/should a Christian visit a mosque? - 8/6/2009 7:31:15 AM
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herestoresmysoul
Posts: 1465
Joined: 3/13/2009
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quote:
ORIGINAL: RJR_fan
quote:
I visited one in Jerusalem as a 20 eyar old before I was a Christian, and many years later I felt led to repent, and now I would never go near one.
How can we show respect for Muslims even as we do our best to undermine their faith in Islam? It's a challenge. Is it a waste of time trying to evangelize Muslims? Can't say I have all the answers. We said goodbye to our Turkish friends yesterday, and they think differently about Christians now, after having spent a few years as our friends.
The next step is up to God. I pray that, when He discredits Islam, there will be a significant remnant among the Muslims who will be prepared to consider the Gospel.
We can respect people without joning them in their worship places.We can be friends with them without feeling that we have to in anyway be part of the way they worship their god.
many many muslims are coming to Christ as a result of dreams and visions in the middle east.I know a man who goes there regularly and what is going on is amazing, so God is on their case.
God was frequently telling the Jews not to worship other Gods, go to their temples etc. To me it would be compromising my faith ot go with muslims to their temples, and I certainly wouldnt expect them to come to church unless they came to an understanding of Jesus and who he really is.
We dont have to compromose to reach others, that isnt the way. We need to lead those who are going to perish AWAY from their god and towards Jesus and not go with them towards their FALSE god.
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RE: can/should a Christian visit a mosque? - 8/6/2009 7:36:26 AM
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RJR_fan
Posts: 1168
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From: RTP, in sunny NC USA
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quote:
They worship the same God but dont believe that Jesus is the messiah.Thus their faith is incomplete as opposed to totally wrong.
Who was Jesus addressing in the following verse?
quote:
New International Version (©1984)
You belong to your father, the devil, and you want to carry out your father's desire. He was a murderer from the beginning, not holding to the truth, for there is no truth in him. When he lies, he speaks his native language, for he is a liar and the father of lies.
New American Standard Bible (©1995)
"You are of your father the devil, and you want to do the desires of your father. He was a murderer from the beginning, and does not stand in the truth because there is no truth in him. Whenever he speaks a lie, he speaks from his own nature, for he is a liar and the father of lies.
International Standard Version (©2008)
You belong to your father the devil, and you want to carry out the desires of your father. He was a murderer from the beginning and has never stood for truth, since there is no truth in him. Whenever he tells a lie he speaks in character, because he is a liar and the father of lies.
GOD'S WORD® Translation (©1995)
You come from your father, the devil, and you desire to do what your father wants you to do. The devil was a murderer from the beginning. He has never been truthful. He doesn't know what the truth is. Whenever he tells a lie, he's doing what comes naturally to him. He's a liar and the father of lies.
King James Bible
Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it.
American King James Version
You are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father you will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and stayed not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaks a lie, he speaks of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it.
American Standard Version
Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father it is your will to do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and standeth not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father thereof.
Bible in Basic English
You are the children of your father the Evil One and it is your pleasure to do his desires. From the first he was a taker of life; and he did not go in the true way because there is no true thing in him. When he says what is false, it is natural to him, for he is false and the father of what is false.
Douay-Rheims Bible
You are of your father the devil, and the desires of your father you will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and he stood not in the truth; because truth is not in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father thereof.
Darby Bible Translation
Ye are of the devil, as your father, and ye desire to do the lusts of your father. He was a murderer from the beginning, and has not stood in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaks falsehood, he speaks of what is his own; for he is a liar and its father:
English Revised Version
Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father it is your will to do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and stood not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father thereof.
Webster's Bible Translation
Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do: he was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it.
Weymouth New Testament
The father whose sons you are is the Devil; and you desire to do what gives him pleasure. *He* was a murderer from the beginning, and does not stand firm in the truth--for there is no truth in him. Whenever he utters his lie, he utters it out of his own store; for he is a liar, and the father of lies.
World English Bible
You are of your father, the devil, and you want to do the desires of your father. He was a murderer from the beginning, and doesn't stand in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaks a lie, he speaks on his own; for he is a liar, and its father.
Young's Literal Translation
'Ye are of a father -- the devil, and the desires of your father ye will to do; he was a man-slayer from the beginning, and in the truth he hath not stood, because there is no truth in him; when one may speak the falsehood, of his own he speaketh, because he is a liar -- also his father.
_____________________________
Blogging my way through the Turkish New Testament
Meet my beloved mentor, RJR
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RE: can/should a Christian visit a mosque? - 8/6/2009 9:16:55 AM
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Eutychus
Posts: 6350
Joined: 4/11/2005
From: Dothan, AL
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: herestoresmysoul
quote:
ORIGINAL: Eutychus
quote:
ORIGINAL: herestoresmysoul
quote:
ORIGINAL: Eutychus
quote:
ORIGINAL: Covaan_Meshuga
Why hang around in the darkness when you can bask in the Light?
True, but in addition to visiting the mosque I mentioned, I also visited the wailing wall in Jerusalem. Both peoples were in darkness.
but at least the Jews are worshipping the same God as us
They worship the Triune God: Father, Son, & Holy Spirit?
Dat's gnus to me.
They worship the same God but dont believe that Jesus is the messiah.Thus their faith is incomplete as opposed to totally wrong.
If they do not worship Father, Son, & Holy Spirit, they do not worship the same God as we do as revealed to faithful Jews that were saved after Christ's resurrection. You are confusing a superficial connection to God with those that are truly God's people.
_____________________________
Jesus answered and said to them, "This is the work of God, that you believe in Him whom He has sent." -John 6:29
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RE: can/should a Christian visit a mosque? - 8/6/2009 9:20:27 AM
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Eutychus
Posts: 6350
Joined: 4/11/2005
From: Dothan, AL
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: herestoresmysoul
quote:
ORIGINAL: Eutychus
quote:
ORIGINAL: herestoresmysoul
...When you go into a mosque you have to remove your shoes as a mark of respect to their 'god' Allah, who is obviously a false God....
Not entirely true. I was not required to remove my shoes when I entered the mosque in Egypt, only put on shoe covers to not track in dirt from the outside.
maybe mosques differ then cos I definately had to remove my shoes at the one in Jerusalem.
When I spent a week in Israel in the 70s there were so many places of biblical significance that I wanted to see that I had no time or interest in visiting a mosque. I only visited one when I was in Egypt.
_____________________________
Jesus answered and said to them, "This is the work of God, that you believe in Him whom He has sent." -John 6:29
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RE: can/should a Christian visit a mosque? - 8/6/2009 10:29:08 AM
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Liveloved
Posts: 1818
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We were in Jerusalem in February.
The mosque? We were only allowed to see it from the outside. But I can go anywhere with Jesus. 
< Message edited by Liveloved -- 8/6/2009 10:49:34 AM >
_____________________________
Liveloved
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Now may the God of hope fill you with all joy and peace in believing, that you may abound in hope by the power of the Holy Spirit. Romans 15:13
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RE: can/should a Christian visit a mosque? - 8/6/2009 6:29:58 PM
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Covaan_Meshuga
Posts: 3179
Joined: 6/8/2005
From: being knit together in my mother's womb
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quote:
ORIGINAL: RJR_fan
quote:
They worship the same God but dont believe that Jesus is the messiah.Thus their faith is incomplete as opposed to totally wrong.
Who was Jesus addressing in the following verse?
quote:
New International Version (©1984)
You belong to your father, the devil, and you want to carry out your father's desire. He was a murderer from the beginning, not holding to the truth, for there is no truth in him. When he lies, he speaks his native language, for he is a liar and the father of lies. . . .
You can read. Who do you say that He is talking to?
_____________________________
While in prayer or praise, I am only as devoted to G-d as I am in my most private moments.
Abiyah, if you had known them as G-d knows them, you would have answered them differently.
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RE: can/should a Christian visit a mosque? - 8/10/2009 5:34:43 PM
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TheoStudent
Posts: 34
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quote:
ORIGINAL: RJR_fan
...What do you all think?
- Can Christians visit mosques with a good conscience?
- Does it do any harm to silently "go through the motions?"
- When is such a visit justified?
I think that Christian leaders should visit other places of worship. The best practice is to call ahead and inquire about the behaviors and participation levels expected of (or forbidden to) visitors. I think it's even better when you can go with other Christians.
In seminary, many of the classes we had on "world religions" included field trips to other places of worship. One of our professors was a Christian convert from Islam; despite his having been imprisoned for some in his native (Islamic) land, he was not afraid to visit a Mosque here in the U.S.A.
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RE: can/should a Christian visit a mosque? - 8/10/2009 5:47:45 PM
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rawr.ben
Posts: 2729
Joined: 5/16/2005
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Eliana
I cannot answer for all Christians, but I would not participate in a Muslim worship ceremony.
There is a difference between participating and observing.
Ignorance gains us nothing.
_____________________________
rawr.ben
Facebook
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RE: can/should a Christian visit a mosque? - 8/10/2009 6:30:51 PM
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Covaan_Meshuga
Posts: 3179
Joined: 6/8/2005
From: being knit together in my mother's womb
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Covaan_Meshuga
quote:
ORIGINAL: RJR_fan
quote:
They worship the same God but dont believe that Jesus is the messiah.Thus their faith is incomplete as opposed to totally wrong.
Who was Jesus addressing in the following verse?
quote:
New International Version (©1984)
You belong to your father, the devil, and you want to carry out your father's desire. He was a murderer from the beginning, not holding to the truth, for there is no truth in him. When he lies, he speaks his native language, for he is a liar and the father of lies. . . .
You can read. Who do you say that He is talking to?
_____________________________
While in prayer or praise, I am only as devoted to G-d as I am in my most private moments.
Abiyah, if you had known them as G-d knows them, you would have answered them differently.
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RE: can/should a Christian visit a mosque? - 8/11/2009 8:41:04 AM
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RJR_fan
Posts: 1168
Joined: 4/12/2005
From: RTP, in sunny NC USA
Status: offline
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quote:
You can read. Who do you say that He is talking to?
The religious and political leaders of Israel, the Pharisees and Sadducees.
Luke + Acts is a fascinating historical work, that documents with scholarly precision the suicidal lunacy of a leadership class so obsessed with their own power and position that they did a "Jonestown" with a whole nation. The Epistle to the Hebrews is a poignant plea to the faithful Jews -- those who believed in Jesus -- to NOT "drink the kool-ade," to NOT go down with that badly piloted ship.
To tie this back to the OP -- cultural ties are powerful. Most Muslims who convert to Christianity return to the mosque within a few years. Family, community, and legal pressures are very hard to resist, especially in a "high-context" culture that places priority on the collective entities that gave us our lives and identities. Perhaps, some of those who give up on the gospel will create some equivalent of the "hidden matzoh" as a reminder of the salvation they surrendered ...
< Message edited by RJR_fan -- 8/11/2009 8:48:33 AM >
_____________________________
Blogging my way through the Turkish New Testament
Meet my beloved mentor, RJR
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