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RE: Questions about 9/11 - 8/5/2009 2:31:19 PM
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rlj
Posts: 3877
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quote:
ORIGINAL: cornergas
The official story is 19 arabs, (who could not even get private licenses to fly small cessnas because of their incompetence) directed from a guy in a cave in Afghanistan, were able to enter the country, go to flight school, board jumbo jet planes carrying box cutters, over power the flight crew, then change course and fly these huge aircraft into bldgs. Now that is a conspiracy THEORY! They would not have been able to find New York let alone the twin towers and hit them. The flight crew would not surrender their aircraft to three or four small motley arabs without a big struggle for sure, and yet through all this not one fighter plane came up to take a look? Strange..they have 63 intercepts that year up to Sept 11 where aircraft went off course, but yet on 9/11 you got four jumbo jetliners with transponders turned off and flying all over the sky off course, and not one intercept...hmmmm makes one think..google 9/11 Silverstein insurance claims, for lots of very good information Oh and also PILOTS FOR 9/11 TRUTH.
Know the truth and the truth will set you free
God bless us all
What is almost scary is I'm almost considering buying into that one.
_____________________________
Thbbbt!!!!
A video of our cat and kitten:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_ycCndVNctA
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RE: Questions about 9/11 - 8/6/2009 3:44:54 PM
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cornergas
Posts: 235
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The official conspiracy theory says the jet fuel weakened the steel frames in the building and a pancake collapse took place...hmmm where are all the pancaked floors? the massive central core column where is it? should be standing tall in the middle of the rubble? What reduced the concrete to powder/dust? No big chunks evident? If jet fuel/fire caused this then how did all the steel components get heated equally so the building came straight down? If beams and other steel components were weakened it would have not been uniform and there would have been sideways collapse. The force required to pulverize the concrete would have to be huge, as only provided by very high energy explosives..Google Engineers for 9/11 Truth to get the analysis and opinion of 900 or so leading Engineers and Architects! interesting reading.
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RE: Questions about 9/11 - 8/6/2009 4:21:48 PM
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cow451
Posts: 3755
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quote:
ORIGINAL: cornergas
The official conspiracy theory says the jet fuel weakened the steel frames in the building and a pancake collapse took place...hmmm where are all the pancaked floors? the massive central core column where is it? should be standing tall in the middle of the rubble? What reduced the concrete to powder/dust? No big chunks evident? If jet fuel/fire caused this then how did all the steel components get heated equally so the building came straight down? If beams and other steel components were weakened it would have not been uniform and there would have been sideways collapse. The force required to pulverize the concrete would have to be huge, as only provided by very high energy explosives..Google Engineers for 9/11 Truth to get the analysis and opinion of 900 or so leading Engineers and Architects! interesting reading.
You need to Google more. The pancake theory was discounted fairly early. The FIRE caused by the jet fuel weakened (not melted, BTW) the metal columns. Here's a basic summary from one study.
_____________________________
"As Putin rears his head and comes into the air space of the United States of America, where do they go? It's Alaska. It's just right over the border." Sarah Palin
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RE: Questions about 9/11 - 8/6/2009 7:28:37 PM
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cornergas
Posts: 235
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Cowboy..wrong cannot happen that way..building would fall ove sideways, not straight down..Oh I just see ex Gov. Ventura, is starting with a large documentary producer looking at things like this and producing big full time documentaries by investigative journalism..that is what we need!
God bless us all
Know the truth and the truth will be you free.
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RE: Questions about 9/11 - 8/6/2009 10:20:41 PM
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iluvatar
Posts: 3044
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quote:
ORIGINAL: cornergas
Cowboy..wrong cannot happen that way..building would fall ove sideways, not straight down..
Watch the video: on the first collapse, the part of the building above where the planes hit did tip.
But, let's do a little geometry here to figure out how much it would tip:
According to wikipedia, each floor of the WTC was ~207' square ans 12.4' high. If one wall on one end collapses, we want to find the angle between the now-crooked ceiling and the floor. Since this forms a right-triangle with the ceiling being the hypotenuse and the wall being the "opposite" leg, we can use the formula:
sin(theta) = o/h
sin(theta) = 12.4 / 207
sin(theta) = 0.06
asin(sin(theta)) = asin(0.06)
theta = 3.44 degrees
There you go, the building would tip, at most, a few degrees. If it were to completely topple rather than crumble, large portions of it would have to remain structurally sound, while other parts collapsed. Why should that happen?
quote:
Oh I just see ex Gov. Ventura, is starting with a large documentary producer looking at things like this and producing big full time documentaries by investigative journalism..that is what we need!
That's what we've had. The problem is that a bunch of nutters don't want to acknowledge it.
quote:
God bless us all
Know the truth and the truth will be you free.
Indeed.
-Dan.
_____________________________
Well, I've been to one world fair, a picnic, and a rodeo, and that's the stupidest thing I ever heard come over a set of earphones.
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RE: Questions about 9/11 - 8/7/2009 11:50:55 AM
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Bettawrekonize
Posts: 1157
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quote:
ORIGINAL: iluvatar
According to wikipedia, each floor of the WTC was ~207' square ans 12.4' high. If one wall on one end collapses, we want to find the angle between the now-crooked ceiling and the floor. Since this forms a right-triangle with the ceiling being the hypotenuse and the wall being the "opposite" leg, we can use the formula:
sin(theta) = o/h
sin(theta) = 12.4 / 207
sin(theta) = 0.06
asin(sin(theta)) = asin(0.06)
theta = 3.44 degrees
You merely solved for the angle between the ceiling and the hypotenuse that goes from one end of the ceiling to the other end of the floor of a specific story/floor before anything happened.
Now solving for how much it should tip is much more complicated. It would require knowing the force that hit the building (the mass times the acceleration) and then knowing the resistance that the building would provide (which includes knowing the mass of the part of the building that got hit, it's structural integrity, and how the force would be distributed throughout the building upon impact and knowing the structural integrity of those distribution channels and what resistance they would provide. In other words you can't treat the floor that got hit as one isolated unit). It also includes knowing how high the plane hit because the higher the plane hits, the more it should tip being that higher means more leverage against the resistance that the lower structures provide (well actually, this is an oversimplification and isn't exactly accurate, but knowing the height is important. Say you had a really high chiffonier and you wanted to move it. Would you push it from the top or from closer to the base. You push it from the top and you're likely to tip it over. You push it from the base and it's easier to move. Basically, when the airplane hits the building all the force that the plane provides is going to be distributed but one factor that influences how it's distributed is where the airplane hit).
< Message edited by Bettawrekonize -- 8/7/2009 12:33:19 PM >
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RE: Questions about 9/11 - 8/7/2009 9:19:25 PM
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iluvatar
Posts: 3044
Joined: 4/12/2005
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Bettawrekonize
You merely solved for the angle between the ceiling and the hypotenuse that goes from one end of the ceiling to the other end of the floor of a specific story/floor before anything happened.
Now solving for how much it should tip is much more complicated. It would require knowing the force that hit the building (the mass times the acceleration) and then knowing the resistance that the building would provide (which includes knowing the mass of the part of the building that got hit, it's structural integrity, and how the force would be distributed throughout the building upon impact and knowing the structural integrity of those distribution channels and what resistance they would provide. In other words you can't treat the floor that got hit as one isolated unit). It also includes knowing how high the plane hit because the higher the plane hits, the more it should tip being that higher means more leverage against the resistance that the lower structures provide (well actually, this is an oversimplification and isn't exactly accurate, but knowing the height is important. Say you had a really high chiffonier and you wanted to move it. Would you push it from the top or from closer to the base. You push it from the top and you're likely to tip it over. You push it from the base and it's easier to move. Basically, when the airplane hits the building all the force that the plane provides is going to be distributed but one factor that influences how it's distributed is where the airplane hit).
You're talking about the amount of energy transferred from the plane to the building. It's possible the impact caused the building to sway a bit, but we can watch the videos and see that the planes crashed quite some time before the buildings fell, so it's impossible that the force of the impact knocked over the towers. What happened was that the plane destroyed some of the building's structural support. A similar effect could be observed on your chiffonier by taking a shotgun to one of the legs - it'll fall towards you, not away from you.
-Dan.
_____________________________
Well, I've been to one world fair, a picnic, and a rodeo, and that's the stupidest thing I ever heard come over a set of earphones.
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RE: Questions about 9/11 - 8/8/2009 1:33:41 AM
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Bettawrekonize
Posts: 1157
Joined: 4/17/2005
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: iluvatar
You're talking about the amount of energy transferred from the plane to the building. It's possible the impact caused the building to sway a bit, but we can watch the videos and see that the planes crashed quite some time before the buildings fell, so it's impossible that the force of the impact knocked over the towers. What happened was that the plane destroyed some of the building's structural support. A similar effect could be observed on your chiffonier by taking a shotgun to one of the legs - it'll fall towards you, not away from you.
-Dan.
Point well taken, thanks again.
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RE: Questions about 9/11 - 8/9/2009 1:33:13 PM
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cornergas
Posts: 235
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I guess the residue of thermate found in the dust of the buildings, and on the pre cut steel ends, would be a clue, as to the physics of the collapses? The molten metal in the sub levels would also provide a clue I suppose?
God bless us all
Know the truth and the truth will set you free
Remember the Sabbath to keep it Holy.
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RE: Questions about 9/11 - 8/9/2009 6:20:12 PM
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cow451
Posts: 3755
Joined: 5/6/2005
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quote:
ORIGINAL: cornergas
I guess the residue of thermate found in the dust of the buildings, and on the pre cut steel ends, would be a clue, as to the physics of the collapses? The molten metal in the sub levels would also provide a clue I suppose?
God bless us all
Know the truth and the truth will set you free
Remember the Sabbath to keep it Holy.
Except that no beams were "Precut".
_____________________________
"As Putin rears his head and comes into the air space of the United States of America, where do they go? It's Alaska. It's just right over the border." Sarah Palin
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RE: Questions about 9/11 - 8/9/2009 8:59:50 PM
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cornergas
Posts: 235
Joined: 7/28/2009
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thirty five lengths..u can see them in the pictures flying out and some embedding in other building..very big force behind them..the torches on the ground did not have much work to do cutting them..
God bless us all
Remember the Sabbath to keep it Holy
Know the truth and the truth will set you free!
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RE: Questions about 9/11 - 8/11/2009 5:37:27 PM
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cornergas
Posts: 235
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You are wrong cowboy looking at wrong pics..see as building collapses. beams flying out in all directions..unform 35 ft lengths.. cutter charges are placed at diagonal angles not straight across so the beams do not stand on one another, but slide off or "walk" off the lower section..according to demolition experts ..and yes the steel was removed from the crime scene in a very big hurry, but some were salvaged and tell the whole story..
Know the truth and the truth will set you free
God bless us all.
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RE: Questions about 9/11 - 8/11/2009 7:01:10 PM
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cow451
Posts: 3755
Joined: 5/6/2005
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quote:
ORIGINAL: cornergas
You are wrong cowboy looking at wrong pics..see as building collapses. beams flying out in all directions..unform 35 ft lengths.. cutter charges are placed at diagonal angles not straight across so the beams do not stand on one another, but slide off or "walk" off the lower section..according to demolition experts ..and yes the steel was removed from the crime scene in a very big hurry, but some were salvaged and tell the whole story..
Know the truth and the truth will set you free
God bless us all.
Gosh. A building with steel beams of uniform lengths. What a suspicious development.
Of course the "cut with thermite" stuff has already been debunked, so you'll have to fall back on something else. Little people with torches sneaking in the night before, perhaps.
_____________________________
"As Putin rears his head and comes into the air space of the United States of America, where do they go? It's Alaska. It's just right over the border." Sarah Palin
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RE: Questions about 9/11 - 8/11/2009 8:07:39 PM
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cornergas
Posts: 235
Joined: 7/28/2009
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You believe in little people with torches..you need a vacation there cowboy..starting to get to you....have a good vacation
God bless us all
Know the truth and the truth will set you free
Remember the Sabbath to keep it holy.
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RE: Questions about 9/11 - 8/12/2009 10:00:29 AM
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cow451
Posts: 3755
Joined: 5/6/2005
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quote:
ORIGINAL: cornergas
You believe in little people with torches..you need a vacation there cowboy..starting to get to you....have a good vacation
God bless us all
Know the truth and the truth will set you free
Remember the Sabbath to keep it holy.
I'm just trying to figure out how your theory could possibly work.
_____________________________
"As Putin rears his head and comes into the air space of the United States of America, where do they go? It's Alaska. It's just right over the border." Sarah Palin
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RE: Questions about 9/11 - 8/13/2009 6:18:45 PM
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Bettawrekonize
Posts: 1157
Joined: 4/17/2005
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While people may not agree with wakingzombies they have some good points. For instance they were labeled potential terrorists. They maybe a bit extreme but they certainly aren't terrorists. The U.S. government pretends to spread freedom of speech yet they label those that disagree with them potential terrorists. Makes you wonder if the U.S. government is any better than those they suppress.
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RE: Questions about 9/11 - 8/14/2009 10:35:28 AM
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cow451
Posts: 3755
Joined: 5/6/2005
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Bettawrekonize
While people may not agree with wakingzombies they have some good points. For instance they were labeled potential terrorists. They maybe a bit extreme but they certainly aren't terrorists. The U.S. government pretends to spread freedom of speech yet they label those that disagree with them potential terrorists. Makes you wonder if the U.S. government is any better than those they suppress.
Zombies, government, zombies, government....... it's close, but I'll take government on this one.
_____________________________
"As Putin rears his head and comes into the air space of the United States of America, where do they go? It's Alaska. It's just right over the border." Sarah Palin
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RE: Questions about 9/11 - 8/14/2009 1:57:42 PM
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cornergas
Posts: 235
Joined: 7/28/2009
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Pilots for 9/11 truth, Engineers for 9/11 truth, Medical professionals for 9/11 truth, architects for 9/11 truth..these all provide so much professional information, which really question the government's conspiracy theory, and raises many, many questions which the government agencies cannot or will not answer, about their actions, or inactions on 9/11. But if anyone is happy with their blinders on and head in sand, good, "ignorance is bliss"
Know the truth and the truth will set you free
Remember the Sabbath to keep it Holy
God bless us all
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RE: Questions about 9/11 - 8/14/2009 2:11:21 PM
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cow451
Posts: 3755
Joined: 5/6/2005
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: cornergas
Pilots for 9/11 truth, Engineers for 9/11 truth, Medical professionals for 9/11 truth, architects for 9/11 truth..these all provide so much professional information, which really question the government's conspiracy theory, and raises many, many questions which the government agencies cannot or will not answer, about their actions, or inactions on 9/11. But if anyone is happy with their blinders on and head in sand, good, "ignorance is bliss"
Know the truth and the truth will set you free
Remember the Sabbath to keep it Holy
God bless us all
Here's a list of nine theories plus "I don't know". So, aside from copping to IDN, which theory or theories carry water?
_____________________________
"As Putin rears his head and comes into the air space of the United States of America, where do they go? It's Alaska. It's just right over the border." Sarah Palin
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Sorry, but icarly makes more sense.
