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RE: COULD Obama be THE or AN Antichrist? - 10/28/2009 3:55:20 PM
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Jrila1981
Posts: 22
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you guys need to stop we all know the antichrist is a white man that comes out of the european union not America you know obama's a christain lets not forget that ladies and gentlemen....)
_____________________________
FOR GOD SO LOVED THE WORLD, THAT HE GAVE HIS ONLY BEGOTTEN SON, THAT WHOSOEVER BELIEVETH IN HIM SHOULD NOT PARISH, BUT HAVE EVERLASTING LIFE
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RE: COULD Obama be THE or AN Antichrist? - 10/28/2009 7:44:20 PM
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tsnody2001
Posts: 324
Joined: 4/29/2008
From: Terre Haute, IN
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quote:
you guys need to stop we all know the antichrist is a white man that comes out of the european union not America you know obama's a christain lets not forget that ladies and gentlemen....)
Prove Obama is a Christian. How do you KNOW that? Also, prove (from Scripture) that the AC will be a white man from the European union.
_____________________________
Until He Returns (Rev. 2:17),
Travis
During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act. ~George Orwell
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RE: COULD Obama be THE or AN Antichrist? - 10/29/2009 12:03:37 AM
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B1inhim
Posts: 10
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“President Obama proves his dedication to the Global Illuminati as he "faces the obelisk" during his inauguration.
This is the "change" we can expect: no real change in direction, only a change in the Illuminati Plan for the final push into the New World Order.
...Ask not what your country can do for you; ask what you can do for your country".
http://endrtimes.blogspot.com/2009/01/faces-obelisk-during-his-inauguration.html
Lest you think I am changing my opinion of President Obama, let me refer you to the picture, above, of Obama faithfully facing the obelisk (Washington Monument) during his Inaugural speech. Dedicated Illuminati pagans -- Sun worshippers all -- "face the obelisk" as many times per day as possible, usually three times. For this reason, the 555-foot obelisk (Washington Monument) is placed in such a manner that people in the White House can easily turn toward the obelisk every single day, as well as people serving in the Congress. No pagan obelisk has ever been so precisely and correctly located!”
http://secretsun.blogspot.com/2008/07/obama-to-be-initiated-at-obelisk.html
Many people were convinced that President Reagan was a "good ol boy too..."
I for one know that he was the first president to take oath for the office of president on the side of the obelisk,
http://www.jesus-is-savior.com/False...d_satanism.htm
this was a sign to the Illuminati and the church in Rome that he was on their side. In his first state of the union address, a copy of his speech was delivered to one of Rome’s representatives... white collar, black robe... I remember seeing this and thinking to myself "WHY would the camera be following someone giving this speech being delivered, to this person?"...
Since then, all good Illuminati members have taken the oath of office on this side of the building.
WAKE UP!!!
We are in for a very rude awakening and it will be cloaked in the guise of peace, safety, recovery and democracy.
We are that generation that will see the thing to come that Lord Jesus spoke of.
WAKE UP!!!
Another reason for right living is that you know how late it is; time is running out.
Wake up, for the coming of our salvation is nearer now than when we first believed.
The night is almost gone; the day of harpazo will soon be here
Find out what is pleasing to the Lord. Take no part in the worthless deeds of evil and darkness; instead, rebuke and expose them. It is shameful even to talk about the things that ungodly people do in secret. But when the light shines on them, it becomes clear how evil these things are. And where your light shines, it will expose their evil deeds. This is why it is said,
“Awake, O sleeper,
Rise up from the dead,
And Christ will give you light.”
Try to find out what is pleasing to the Lord. Take no part in the worthless deeds of evil and darkness; instead, rebuke and expose them.
So, just when I thought I could say "amen," it happened. Warren said "I humbly ask this in the name of the one who changed my life, Yeshua, Isa, Jesus [Spanish pronunciation], Jesus, who taught us to pray, "Our father who art in Heaven..." Opppsss. Wait a minute. I should have known that it was too good to be true. Yeshua and Jesus - great! "Isa" - not so much.
I have researched Islam for many years. Last year I ministered concerning the history, theology and intentions of Islam over 40 times in churches and conferences so naturally, Warren's use of the name of Isa, the false Jesus of Islam, was a glaring slap in the face to all that he had already prayed. "Isa" in no way represents the Jesus of the Bible but is instead the false Jesus of the Qur'an (Koran) and the Muslim Hadith.
"Isa" (pronounced "eee-sa") is the Islamic Jesus who was but a prophet and who certainly did not experience a sacrificial death on a cross let alone resurrect from the dead. In fact, in Islam the prophet Isa is actually the destroyer of Christianity - not it's Savior. Obviously, this is simply NOT the same Jesus as is Yeshua. Thus far, only one person has written me to comment on Warren's statement. (Hats off to Diana in Ohio who did her homework.) She also noted a good page from a website we have linked to for quite some time (www.answering-islam.org) which highlights the differences between the Jesus of the Bible and the Isa of Islam. I have placed a link to this resource at the bottom of this article.
The Apostle Paul emphatically warned about those who would come presenting counterfeit Jesus'.
"But I fear, lest by any means, as the serpent beguiled Eve through his subtilty, so your minds should be corrupted from the simplicity that is in Christ. For if he that cometh preacheth another Jesus, whom we have not preached, or if ye receive another spirit, which ye have not received, or another gospel, which ye have not accepted, ye might well bear with him." (II Cor. 11:3-4)
20% is better than nothing and for the whole story… click below
http://www.worldviewtimes.com/article.php/articleid-4490/Brannon-Howse/Eric-Barger
Love,
Brother Jerry
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RE: COULD Obama be THE or AN Antichrist? - 10/29/2009 12:30:46 AM
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MrFribbles
Posts: 2341
Joined: 1/29/2007
From: Hawaii, but I've moved around since then
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quote:
“President Obama proves his dedication to the Global Illuminati as he "faces the obelisk" during his inauguration.
So, let me get this straight. Because Obama held his inauguration at a venue which would allow the largest group of attenders to take part in the event (unless you can think of a larger open space in DC?), he's a puppet of the Illuminati?
_____________________________
"To the humble man, and to the humble man alone, the sun is really a sun; to the humble man, and to the humble man alone, the sea is really a sea."
-G. K. Chesterton
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RE: COULD Obama be THE or AN Antichrist? - 10/29/2009 10:58:51 AM
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Eutychus
Posts: 6339
Joined: 4/11/2005
From: Dothan, AL
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quote:
ORIGINAL: dctalkgirl
Oh really Obama is a Christian eh? Gosh couldn't fool me considering his decisions making since he got into office...
Where did you get the idea that Christian Presidents can't make stupid decisions in office? Jimmy Carter very often said that he was a "born again Christian" but had some of the worst policies I can remember, bad enough to cause me to vote Republican at the national level ever since.
_____________________________
Jesus answered and said to them, "This is the work of God, that you believe in Him whom He has sent." -John 6:29
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RE: COULD Obama be THE or AN Antichrist? - 10/29/2009 12:31:52 PM
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B1inhim
Posts: 10
Joined: 7/31/2006
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quote:
So, let me get this straight. Because Obama held his inauguration at a venue which would allow the largest group of attenders to take part in the event (unless you can think of a larger open space in DC?), he's a puppet of the Illuminati?
Are saying this of your own or did somebody tell you this?
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RE: COULD Obama be THE or AN Antichrist? - 10/29/2009 12:58:03 PM
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MrFribbles
Posts: 2341
Joined: 1/29/2007
From: Hawaii, but I've moved around since then
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quote:
Are saying this of your own or did somebody tell you this?
I'm not sure I understand your question. If you're asking whether or not I got my response to your post from someone else, the answer is no, it was all from me.
I used to live very close to DC. I'm familiar with the city. Obama's people knew that they would have a huge turnout for the inauguration. There is, quite frankly, nowhere in DC except the National Mall to hold that many people. I contend that it is mere coincidence that he happened to be looking at the Washington Monument (aka The Toothpick, to the locals) during his inauguration. It was not to be "looking at the monolith."
_____________________________
"To the humble man, and to the humble man alone, the sun is really a sun; to the humble man, and to the humble man alone, the sea is really a sea."
-G. K. Chesterton
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RE: COULD Obama be THE or AN Antichrist? - 10/30/2009 4:45:30 AM
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malchediel
Posts: 12
Joined: 7/16/2009
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Obama Christian? I don't believe his "Christian Faith" ever came up until he ran for President. I believe he was classified as a Muslim, wasn't he (or maybe that was just his entire family)? I do seem to recall at some point during the election year him being corrected (what was it, twice?) on his "faith" ... "you mean Christian, don't you?", something along those lines.
Considering he was "taught" under Rev. Jeremiah Wright, I don't think Christian should be the word used to define his faith. Besides, with all those communist friends he had (and still has), I'm sure he never really had the time to "practice" his Christian faith (until it provided a sound bite for the religious right and conservative America).
Now, as to BHO being "the" or "an" anti-Christ, it doesn't really matter. I do think that he falls into the "an" category (look at his stance on abortion, Israel, homosexual marriage, etc...). His views are a blatant slap in the face of Christ. I think that what he is doing now, is opening the doorway for what is to come down the road and I can finally see how people could be (and will be) swayed and blinded by "the" anti-Christ. ... "right will be wrong and wrong will be right".
-me
_____________________________
Your closest relative is a monkey and your distant cousins are bananas and turnips - Richard Dawkins, PhD. (insert "laugh track" here) |
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RE: COULD Obama be THE or AN Antichrist? - 10/30/2009 11:05:50 AM
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MrFribbles
Posts: 2341
Joined: 1/29/2007
From: Hawaii, but I've moved around since then
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quote:
I don't believe his "Christian Faith" ever came up until he ran for President.
How much did you hear about Obama before he ran for president? I know I heard next to nothing, so is this really a good gauge?
quote:
I believe he was classified as a Muslim, wasn't he
Nope.
quote:
maybe that was just his entire family
None of his immediate family was Muslim. His mother was a Christian, his father was an atheist.
quote:
I do seem to recall at some point during the election year him being corrected (what was it, twice?) on his "faith" ... "you mean Christian, don't you?", something along those lines.
That was a situation taken entirely out of context. The interviewer was asking him about how people were saying he was a Muslim, so he began addressing the fact that he wasn't by saying, "My Muslim faith -" at which point he was cut off by the interviewer. He had said more than once before, and continued to say after, in that interview, that he is a Christian.
quote:
Besides, with all those communist friends he had (and still has), I'm sure he never really had the time to "practice" his Christian faith
So Communists can't be Christians? I didn't know Jesus was so small.
quote:
I do think that he falls into the "an" category (look at his stance on abortion, Israel, homosexual marriage, etc...). His views are a blatant slap in the face of Christ.
Name one president who didn't do anything that was a slap in Christ's face.
_____________________________
"To the humble man, and to the humble man alone, the sun is really a sun; to the humble man, and to the humble man alone, the sea is really a sea."
-G. K. Chesterton
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RE: COULD Obama be THE or AN Antichrist? - 10/30/2009 2:53:43 PM
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Jrila1981
Posts: 22
Joined: 6/29/2007
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: tsnody2001
quote:
you guys need to stop we all know the antichrist is a white man that comes out of the european union not America you know obama's a christain lets not forget that ladies and gentlemen....)
Prove Obama is a Christian. How do you KNOW that? Also, prove (from Scripture) that the AC will be a white man from the European union.
i dont have my bible with me because im in school so im just gonna use the internet.this is what it siad The Bible predicts that someday a world leader will emerge from a revived Roman Empire. quote:
The European Union is clearly the fulfillment of this prophetic event. At some point, ten leaders will come to rule the EU
history will repeat itself persia, babylon, and rome will be revived considering that the roman empire was the most brutal to the jews and will be revived. when i have possession of my bible i will provide verses that correlate with my belief not only that the jews are not and would not accept obama as there messiah which is the false messiah.the messisah is to be jewish but today jews are mixed with white so when you ask a jew what race is he they mostly say white...
obama,when under the gun about him being a muslim clearly said that he excepted jesus christ as his personal lord and savior i heard him. the only problem with obama is he's a democrat. he's doing what dems do.but he's done more in 9 months than bush did in eight years so there you have it...
_____________________________
FOR GOD SO LOVED THE WORLD, THAT HE GAVE HIS ONLY BEGOTTEN SON, THAT WHOSOEVER BELIEVETH IN HIM SHOULD NOT PARISH, BUT HAVE EVERLASTING LIFE
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RE: COULD Obama be THE or AN Antichrist? - 10/30/2009 3:29:28 PM
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tsnody2001
Posts: 324
Joined: 4/29/2008
From: Terre Haute, IN
Status: offline
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quote:
MrFribbles - His mother was a Christian, his father was an atheist.
And you can prove this how?
quote:
"I was not raised in a religious household... My mother's own experiences... only reinforced this inherited skepticism. Her memories of the Christians who populated her youth were not fond ones... And yet for all her professed secularism, my mother was in many ways the most spiritually awakened person that I've ever known."[48] "Religion for her was "just one of the many ways — and not necessarily the best way — that man attempted to control the unknowable and understand the deeper truths about our lives," Obama wrote.[49]
However, Dunham's daughter, Maya Soetoro-Ng, when asked later if her mother was an atheist, said, "I wouldn't have called her an atheist. She was an agnostic. She basically gave us all the good books — the Bible, the Hindu Upanishads and the Buddhist scripture, the Tao Te Ching, Sun Tzu — and wanted us to recognize that everyone has something beautiful to contribute."[28] "Jesus, she felt, was a wonderful example. But she felt that a lot of Christians behaved in un-Christian ways."[49] LINK
quote:
Obama also described his own beliefs in relation to the religious upbringing of his mother and father:
My father was from Kenya and a lot of people in his village were Muslim. He didn’t practice Islam. Truth is he wasn’t very religious. He met my mother. My mother was a Christian from Kansas, and they married and then divorced. I was raised by my mother. So, I’ve always been a Christian. The only connection I’ve had to Islam is that my grandfather on my father’s side came from that country. But I’ve never practiced Islam.[50] LINK
Seems like they can't make up their minds. Also, one has not "always been a Christian". And I have never heard or read about his conversion experience. One cannot be a Christian through ancestry, they must be born again.
_____________________________
Until He Returns (Rev. 2:17),
Travis
During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act. ~George Orwell
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RE: COULD Obama be THE or AN Antichrist? - 10/30/2009 3:32:27 PM
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malchediel
Posts: 12
Joined: 7/16/2009
Status: offline
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quote:
quote:
I don't believe his "Christian Faith" ever came up until he ran for President.
How much did you hear about Obama before he ran for president? I know I heard next to nothing, so is this really a good gauge?
Well, I heard nothing about him. But since, I have looked into and read what I could find. Based on the scraps of material one can locate, it was never brought up.
quote:
I believe he was classified as a Muslim, wasn't he
quote:
Nope.
Then, you should inform his sister.
quote:
maybe that was just his entire family
quote:
None of his immediate family was Muslim. His mother was a Christian, his father was an atheist.
I know you probably know the Obama folks better than anyone else on the planet. But, "Obama's sister Maya was quoted by the New York Times as saying, "My whole family was Muslim." I assume she considers Obama a member of her family. After all, she refers to him as "my brother."
I know, you probably know more about the man than his own sister. Then again, "Obama's father was a Muslim. Obama's grandfather was a Muslim. Obama's stepfather was a Muslim. Sarah, who Obama calls grandmother is a Muslim. Obama's half-brothers and sisters are Muslims."
quote:
I do seem to recall at some point during the election year him being corrected (what was it, twice?) on his "faith" ... "you mean Christian, don't you?", something along those lines.
quote:
That was a situation taken entirely out of context. The interviewer was asking him about how people were saying he was a Muslim, so he began addressing the fact that he wasn't by saying, "My Muslim faith -" at which point he was cut off by the interviewer. He had said more than once before, and continued to say after, in that interview, that he is a Christian.
Huh? Then why did he "correct" himself and then say "Christian"? Anywho, does the point you made up there make any sense to you? Lemmi explain. Let's say I ask you about.... hmmm.... let's say I am interviewing you, ok?
I ask, "how people are saying that you are a homosexual".
You are saying that your response would lead with, "My homosexual lifestyle..." ?? Or would you instead respond something along the lines of, "I am not a homosexual", "I am straight", "I'm heterosexual", etc... ??
Let me ask you, what do you think the next few words out of his mouth would have been after opening with "my Muslim faith..."??? "My Muslim faith ... does not exist", "My Muslim faith ... is not the question", "My Muslim faith ... has no bearing", "My Muslim faith ... what??
quote:
Besides, with all those communist friends he had (and still has), I'm sure he never really had the time to "practice" his Christian faith
quote:
So Communists can't be Christians? I didn't know Jesus was so small.
Jesus isn't, man is.
quote:
I do think that he falls into the "an" category (look at his stance on abortion, Israel, homosexual marriage, etc...). His views are a blatant slap in the face of Christ.
quote:
Name one president who didn't do anything that was a slap in Christ's face.
Oh, sorry, I thought you knew we were talking about Obama.
-me
_____________________________
Your closest relative is a monkey and your distant cousins are bananas and turnips - Richard Dawkins, PhD. (insert "laugh track" here) |
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RE: COULD Obama be THE or AN Antichrist? - 10/30/2009 3:37:38 PM
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tsnody2001
Posts: 324
Joined: 4/29/2008
From: Terre Haute, IN
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: tsnody2001
quote:
Jrila1981
you guys need to stop we all know the antichrist is a white man that comes out of the european union not America you know obama's a christain lets not forget that ladies and gentlemen....
Prove Obama is a Christian. How do you KNOW that? Also, prove (from Scripture) that the AC will be a white man from the European union.
quote:
Jrila1981
i dont have my bible with me because im in school so im just gonna use the internet.this is what it siad The Bible predicts that someday a world leader will emerge from a revived Roman Empire
The European Union is clearly the fulfillment of this prophetic event. At some point, ten leaders will come to rule the EU
history will repeat itself persia, babylon, and rome will be revived considering that the roman empire was the most brutal to the jews and will be revived. when i have possession of my bible i will provide verses
Please do that.
< Message edited by tsnody2001 -- 10/30/2009 3:45:51 PM >
_____________________________
Until He Returns (Rev. 2:17),
Travis
During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act. ~George Orwell
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RE: COULD Obama be THE or AN Antichrist? - 10/30/2009 4:56:42 PM
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MrFribbles
Posts: 2341
Joined: 1/29/2007
From: Hawaii, but I've moved around since then
Status: offline
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tsnody,
quote:
And you can prove this how?
I prefer not to put effort into responding to people whose arguments are based on Wikipedia.
malchediel,
First, I must say that I find your condescending tone un-Christ-like.
quote:
But since, I have looked into and read what I could find. Based on the scraps of material one can locate, it was never brought up.
Why would there be anything brought up? Do you know the religion of, say, the governor of Oregon? How about a member of congress from Minnesota? The religious beliefs of local politicians do not make national news.
quote:
But, "Obama's sister Maya was quoted by the New York Times as saying, "My whole family was Muslim." I assume she considers Obama a member of her family. After all, she refers to him as "my brother."
Would you mind sharing where you got the quote that claims to get a quote from the NYT?
quote:
let's say I am interviewing you, ok?
I ask, "how people are saying that you are a homosexual".
You are saying that your response would lead with, "My homosexual lifestyle..." ?? Or would you instead respond something along the lines of, "I am not a homosexual", "I am straight", "I'm heterosexual", etc... ??
I didn't properly explain the situation before, since it had been several months since I had watched the interview in question. Here's the significant snippet if you wish to watch it yourself.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nMhB-CwF4yc
Note that it's from someone who believes as you do, so I hope you trust it is not edited to make Obama look good.
Obama was responding to the fact that many conservative blogs and news outlets were making an issue out of his supposed Muslim faith, while the McCain campaign was not directly doing so. He said that John McCain had not brought up his Muslim faith. If I were in a similar situation, I can't say that I necessarily would respond the same way Obama did, but I wouldn't count it out. It makes sense. People who see this as a Freudian slip on Obama's part are ignoring context and reading what they want to into his words.
quote:
Jesus isn't, man is.
So anyone who is a member of the Communist party is not a Christian?
quote:
Oh, sorry, I thought you knew we were talking about Obama.
No, we're not. We're talking about whether or not Obama is the or an anti-Christ. Part of the evidence you brought against him was his policy decisions in office. I asked a question to validate whether or not this was substantial evidence. If many other presidents can be seen as adopting policies that are slaps in the face of Christ, then I suggest that it is not good evidence.
_____________________________
"To the humble man, and to the humble man alone, the sun is really a sun; to the humble man, and to the humble man alone, the sea is really a sea."
-G. K. Chesterton
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RE: COULD Obama be THE or AN Antichrist? - 10/30/2009 11:36:48 PM
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malchediel
Posts: 12
Joined: 7/16/2009
Status: offline
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quote:
malchediel,
First, I must say that I find your condescending tone un-Christ-like.
I'm sorry you feel that way, but I'm really not sure where you are getting this "tone" from. Maybe it's the inflection you are using while reading it. I can tell you that I am not writing with a "condescending tone", so please try not to read it with a "condescending tone". But, thanks for judging me on how you read.
quote:
But since, I have looked into and read what I could find. Based on the scraps of material one can locate, it was never brought up.
quote:
Why would there be anything brought up? Do you know the religion of, say, the governor of Oregon? How about a member of congress from Minnesota? The religious beliefs of local politicians do not make national news.
True. Anywho, as for Steve (governor of Oregon) - he's basically pantheistic : "I believe if there is a God, this is where he lives. He's on the river, he's in the mountains -- this is what it's all about." As for a member of congress from Minnesota, Keith Ellison, he's a Muslim. Er wait, I suppose religion of local politicians do make the news.
quote:
But, "Obama's sister Maya was quoted by the New York Times as saying, "My whole family was Muslim." I assume she considers Obama a member of her family. After all, she refers to him as "my brother."
quote:
Would you mind sharing where you got the quote that claims to get a quote from the NYT?
Hmm. It's not from Wikipedia. At any rate, Obama's staff has all but said he is Muslim (or was at one point - which if he was and isn't, shouldn't he put under a death threat from the Muslim nations for converting? Or does it not count when the conversion is false....
Think about this - "The Obama Exploratory Committee released the following statement, "To be clear, Senator Obama has never been a Muslim, was not raised a Muslim, and is a committed Christian who attends the United Church of Christ in Chicago." . They then flipped and said, "This statement is amended by the campaign on March 14th, to say, "Obama was never a practicing Muslim.".
However, people from early in his life - "According to Tine Hahiyary, one of Obama's teachers and the principal from 1971 through 1989, Barry actively took part in the Islamic religious lessons during his time at the school. "I remembered that he had studied "mengaji" (recitation of the Quran)" Tine said.
"Obama's classmate Rony Amiris describes young Barry as enjoying playing football and marbles and of being a very devout Muslim. Amir said, "Barry was previously quite religious in Islam. We previously often asked him to the prayer room close to the house. If he was wearing a sarong he looked funny."
"Another classmate, Emirsyah Satar, CEO of Garuda Indonesia, was quoted as saying, "He (Obama) was often in the prayer room wearing a 'sarong', at that time. He was quite religious in Islam but only after marrying Michelle, he changed his religion."
"In an interview with the New York Times, Maya Soetoro-Ng, Obama’s younger half sister, told the Times, "My whole family was Muslim, and most of the people I knew were Muslim."
I think this shows at the very LEAST that he has lied and is lying (if his website still claims he has never been Muslim) about being a Muslim. Since it has been established that he in fact did practice in the Muslim faith, you have to wonder why he would lie about it to mainstream America.
quote:
let's say I am interviewing you, ok?
I ask, "how people are saying that you are a homosexual".
You are saying that your response would lead with, "My homosexual lifestyle..." ?? Or would you instead respond something along the lines of, "I am not a homosexual", "I am straight", "I'm heterosexual", etc... ??
quote:
I didn't properly explain the situation before, since it had been several months since I had watched the interview in question. Here's the significant snippet if you wish to watch it yourself.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nMhB-CwF4yc
Note that it's from someone who believes as you do, so I hope you trust it is not edited to make Obama look good.
Obama was responding to the fact that many conservative blogs and news outlets were making an issue out of his supposed Muslim faith, while the McCain campaign was not directly doing so. He said that John McCain had not brought up his Muslim faith. If I were in a similar situation, I can't say that I necessarily would respond the same way Obama did, but I wouldn't count it out. It makes sense. People who see this as a Freudian slip on Obama's part are ignoring context and reading what they want to into his words.
Well, apparently people from all walks of life, if they want to admit to it or not, read what they want to into words ... for example, I've been told I have a condescending tone in my written word. Again, why say anything along the lines of, "had not brought up his Muslim faith", if there was not one to begin with? Anywho, it's been shown that he in fact (at least during a point in his life) did have a Muslim faith and that he practiced it. Now, he may want to cover that up and you may want to defend him on it, but it does not get rid of the people who knew him and say these things.
But to dig a bit deeper, which I touched on earlier... Since he was a practicing Muslim, and he converted to Christianity (becoming an apostate), why hasn't the Muslim world viewed him in that light? According to Islam, he should be shunned and killed for his sins against Allah. However, every Muslim nation has welcomed him with open arms. Could this be because he has only "claimed" to have converted to Chrisianity? The Koran does allow for "trickery" to fool your enemies.
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Jesus isn't, man is.
So anyone who is a member of the Communist party is not a Christian?
Oh, I'm sure there are communist Christians, but for the most part ... communism is not God fearing, it's God denying.
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Oh, sorry, I thought you knew we were talking about Obama.
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No, we're not. We're talking about whether or not Obama is the or an anti-Christ. Part of the evidence you brought against him was his policy decisions in office. I asked a question to validate whether or not this was substantial evidence. If many other presidents can be seen as adopting policies that are slaps in the face of Christ, then I suggest that it is not good evidence.
Wait, so then we are talking about Obama? Or aren't we? I'm not sure I follow you on that. At any rate, once we figure out if we are indeed talking about Obama, we'll go from there.
I would like to ask you though, do you think that any one who votes against providing medical attention to an aborted baby that lives is (a) a good person or (b) evil? I'm thinking, I'd have to say, the person who voted this way sure wasn't a nice God fearing Christian....
-me
< Message edited by malchediel -- 10/31/2009 12:01:37 AM >
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Your closest relative is a monkey and your distant cousins are bananas and turnips - Richard Dawkins, PhD. (insert "laugh track" here) |
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RE: COULD Obama be THE or AN Antichrist? - 10/30/2009 11:47:27 PM
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malchediel
Posts: 12
Joined: 7/16/2009
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quote:
But, "Obama's sister Maya was quoted by the New York Times as saying, "My whole family was Muslim." I assume she considers Obama a member of her family. After all, she refers to him as "my brother."
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Would you mind sharing where you got the quote that claims to get a quote from the NYT?
I almost forgot. Tsk.. tsk ... one could almost read an un-Christ-like condescending tone in that statement....
At any rate, I'll do you one better. This once, I'll look up the article for ya.... But please, in the future, could you do your own research from now on, my plate is pretty full from doing my own research. It's the NYT, it's not like some obscure blog from New Guinea that would take a week and a team of forty-two full time staff members to look up. (now THAT was sarcasm =)
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/04/30/us/politics/30obama.html?n=Top/News/Poltics/Series/The%20Long%20Run
< Message edited by malchediel -- 10/30/2009 11:59:33 PM >
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Your closest relative is a monkey and your distant cousins are bananas and turnips - Richard Dawkins, PhD. (insert "laugh track" here) |
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RE: COULD Obama be THE or AN Antichrist? - 10/30/2009 11:53:43 PM
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MrFribbles
Posts: 2341
Joined: 1/29/2007
From: Hawaii, but I've moved around since then
Status: offline
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quote:
Anywho, as for Steve (governor of Oregon) - he's basically pantheistic : "I believe if there is a God, this is where he lives. He's on the river, he's in the mountains -- this is what it's all about." As for a member of congress from Minnesota, Keith Ellison, he's a Muslim. Er wait, I suppose religion of local politicians do make the news.
Now, be honest - did you know that off the top of your head, or did you have to look it up? I never said the information wasn't out there.
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It's not from Wikipedia.
Then where is it from?
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Again, why say anything along the lines of, "had not brought up his Muslim faith", if there was not one to begin with?
Because people had accused him of having a Muslim faith. In there minds, there was a Muslim faith there, so Obama was addressing their beliefs.
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Since he was a practicing Muslim, and he converted to Christianity (becoming an apostate), why hasn't the Muslim world viewed him in that light? According to Islam, he should be shunned and killed for his sins against Allah.
Do you believe all Muslims are as violent as the extremist terrorists who act in Allah's name?
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The Koran does allow for "trickery" to fool your enemies.
But does that trickery include outright sinning against Allah's rules?
http://www.beerconspiracy.com/images/stories/Obama_Beer1.jpg
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Wait, so then we are talking about Obama?
We are talking about whether or not Obama fits the role of the or an anti-Christ. Since Obama is a US president, comparing him with other US presidents can be helpful in this discussion. Or do you believe we should only talk about Obama, and not mention any other people, period?
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do you think that any one who votes against providing medical attention to an aborted baby that lives is (a) a good person or (b) evil? I'm thinking, I'd have to say, the person who voted this way sure wasn't a nice God fearing Christian....
What about someone whose policies ended the lives of Iraqis who never heard the Gospel? And who, by the way, didn't make any significant strides in stopping abortion?
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I'll look up the article for ya..
I stand corrected, partially. Some members of his family were practicing Muslims. But this article also makes it clear that the people closest to Obama did not actively practice the Muslim faith, and that his schooling was not in an actively Muslim setting. It seems to contradict your school-age chum quotes from your 2nd most recent post.
< Message edited by MrFribbles -- 10/31/2009 12:03:02 AM >
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"To the humble man, and to the humble man alone, the sun is really a sun; to the humble man, and to the humble man alone, the sea is really a sea."
-G. K. Chesterton
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RE: COULD Obama be THE or AN Antichrist? - 10/31/2009 12:07:32 AM
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tsnody2001
Posts: 324
Joined: 4/29/2008
From: Terre Haute, IN
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MrFribbles,
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I prefer not to put effort into responding to people whose arguments are based on Wikipedia.
I mean no offense by saying this, you can come up with a better excuse than that. Anyway, what I have quoted in my above reference from Wikipedia are the very words of Barack Obama himself. I suppose if I were to quote Jesus using Wikipedia, you would render that irrelevant/not credible also?
Let me ask you a question: Have you never used Wikipedia in any of your many posts on this forum? Simple question.
< Message edited by tsnody2001 -- 10/31/2009 12:26:58 AM >
_____________________________
Until He Returns (Rev. 2:17),
Travis
During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act. ~George Orwell
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RE: COULD Obama be THE or AN Antichrist? - 10/31/2009 12:13:22 AM
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MrFribbles
Posts: 2341
Joined: 1/29/2007
From: Hawaii, but I've moved around since then
Status: offline
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quote:
Have you never used Wikipedia in any of your many posts on this forum? Simple question.
Used, or quoted? There's a difference. Wikipedia is a helpful resource for finding legitimate resources, or for a brief overview on an unfamiliar topic.
To answer your question - I've made almost 2,500 posts. I don't remember.
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what I have quoted in my above reference from Wikipedia are the very words of Barack Obama himself.
Absolutely anyone can go onto Wikipedia and edit it to say whatever they wish. With so many vehement Obama opponents out there, why should I listen to anything it says? How do I know it's Obama saying it, and not those opponents trying to put words in his mouth?
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I suppose if I were to quote Jesus using Wikipedia, you would render that irrelevant also?
I absolutely would. All the quotes from Jesus I need are in the Bible. I would render any other source irrelevant.
_____________________________
"To the humble man, and to the humble man alone, the sun is really a sun; to the humble man, and to the humble man alone, the sea is really a sea."
-G. K. Chesterton
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RE: COULD Obama be THE or AN Antichrist? - 10/31/2009 12:19:04 AM
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malchediel
Posts: 12
Joined: 7/16/2009
Status: offline
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quote:
Anywho, as for Steve (governor of Oregon) - he's basically pantheistic : "I believe if there is a God, this is where he lives. He's on the river, he's in the mountains -- this is what it's all about." As for a member of congress from Minnesota, Keith Ellison, he's a Muslim. Er wait, I suppose religion of local politicians do make the news.
quote:
Now, be honest - did you know that off the top of your head, or did you have to look it up? I never said the information wasn't out there.
I never said it either. But you are under the impression that not finding anything about Obama is normal, and I'm simply showing you that it is not the norm. I said "I looked into it and found nothing" concerning Obama's Christian faith until he ran for president. Just like, when brought up, I looked into what you asked and found something about their faith. But no, I didn't know Oregon... I had to look that one up.. =)
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Again, why say anything along the lines of, "had not brought up his Muslim faith", if there was not one to begin with?
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Because people had accused him of having a Muslim faith. In there minds, there was a Muslim faith there, so Obama was addressing their beliefs.
There is a Muslim faith there. I've shown that there is, or at the very least was.
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Since he was a practicing Muslim, and he converted to Christianity (becoming an apostate), why hasn't the Muslim world viewed him in that light? According to Islam, he should be shunned and killed for his sins against Allah.
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Do you believe all Muslims are as violent as the extremist terrorists who act in Allah's name?
Do you believe that you are the only one allowed to ask questions and not answer? I believe Islam is NOT a peaceful religion.
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The Koran does allow for "trickery" to fool your enemies.
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But does that trickery include outright sinning against Allah's rules?
http://www.beerconspiracy.com/images/stories/Obama_Beer1.jpg
Really? You're gonna bring this up as "proof"? It's been well documented what several 9/11 terrorists did during the last couple of weeks in America... hint.... it involved liquor and women. Yet, they are still deemed "good martyrs" by the Muslim nations. So, like anything else regarding Islam, it's ok for Muslims to do it, just not the infidels.
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Wait, so then we are talking about Obama?
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We are talking about whether or not Obama fits the role of the or an anti-Christ. Since Obama is a US president, comparing him with other US presidents can be helpful in this discussion. Or do you believe we should only talk about Obama, and not mention any other people, period?
I was under the impression this thread was about Obama. My mistake.
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do you think that any one who votes against providing medical attention to an aborted baby that lives is (a) a good person or (b) evil? I'm thinking, I'd have to say, the person who voted this way sure wasn't a nice God fearing Christian....
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What about someone whose policies ended the lives of Iraqis who never heard the Gospel? And who, by the way, didn't make any significant strides in stopping abortion?
I'm not sure how that answered my question.
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I'll look up the article for ya..
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I stand corrected, partially. Some members of his family were practicing Muslims. But this article also makes it clear that the people closest to Obama did not actively practice the Muslim faith, and that his schooling was not in an actively Muslim setting. It seems to contradict your school-age chum quotes from your 2nd most recent post.
Like I said, look at the dates. This is after .... not before. The school-age chums was before ... not after. As for your comment about his schooling not being in an active Muslim setting -
"In his autobiography, "Dreams From My Father," Obama mentions studying the Quran and describes the public school as "a Muslim school."
Also.. "In "Dreams...," Obama himself recalls, "In the Muslim school, the teacher wrote to tell mother I made faces during Koranic studies."
Also.. "During the time that he was in Indonesia, young Barry Soetoro, being a Muslim, would have been required to study Islam daily in school. He would have been taught to read and write Arabic, to recite his prayers properly, to read and recite from the Quran and to study the laws of Islam."
The fact that he took 'mengaji classes' says quite a bit about his Muslim faith and practices.
So, I'm not sure where you get "not in an actively Muslim setting" from.
< Message edited by malchediel -- 10/31/2009 12:33:57 AM >
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Your closest relative is a monkey and your distant cousins are bananas and turnips - Richard Dawkins, PhD. (insert "laugh track" here) |
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RE: COULD Obama be THE or AN Antichrist? - 10/31/2009 9:47:23 AM
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MrFribbles
Posts: 2341
Joined: 1/29/2007
From: Hawaii, but I've moved around since then
Status: offline
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quote:
I was under the impression this thread was about Obama. My mistake.
OK, then I feel safe throwing out most of your arguments. Since most of them come from what other people say about Obama (his school chums, news organizations, etc.) or comparing them to other people (9/11 terrorists), they obviously cannot apply.
Honestly, friend, I feel that continuing any discussion with you would prove fruitless. You have demonstrated a recurring pattern of only listening to the evidence that backs up your view, and shutting your ears to anything else. If you ever happen upon a more open mind about this topic, let me know; I'd love to discuss this issue further.
_____________________________
"To the humble man, and to the humble man alone, the sun is really a sun; to the humble man, and to the humble man alone, the sea is really a sea."
-G. K. Chesterton
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RE: COULD Obama be THE or AN Antichrist? - 10/31/2009 12:33:04 PM
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ta_mosquito
Posts: 10981
Joined: 3/31/2005
From: from MN, now in Ontario :D
Status: offline
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MODERATOR'S NOTE :: ATTENTION PLEASE
Please keep this thread on the topic of whether Obama could be an/the antichrist. His religion isn't the subject of this thread (while it may be a minor sub-point, but VERY minor), nor is the use of Wikipedia in posts.
Back to topic, please!
Tricia
Forums moderator
Please do not reply to this message within the forums or chat.
Please email Community@salemwebnetwork.com with questions, comments, or concerns.
Please do not send me PMs regarding this message.
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RE: COULD Obama be THE or AN Antichrist? - 11/1/2009 10:28:37 AM
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malchediel
Posts: 12
Joined: 7/16/2009
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: MrFribbles
quote:
I was under the impression this thread was about Obama. My mistake.
OK, then I feel safe throwing out most of your arguments. Since most of them come from what other people say about Obama (his school chums, news organizations, etc.) or comparing them to other people (9/11 terrorists), they obviously cannot apply.
Honestly, friend, I feel that continuing any discussion with you would prove fruitless. You have demonstrated a recurring pattern of only listening to the evidence that backs up your view, and shutting your ears to anything else. If you ever happen upon a more open mind about this topic, let me know; I'd love to discuss this issue further.
Really, you feel safe in throwing out what is said about the man? You feel safe in throwing out the people who knew/know him and can tell you about his beliefs? That seems to be petty and quite simply very close minded, don't you agree?
You see, what I am quoting is ABOUT Obama being Obama, not a comparison OF Obama with others. For instance, when discussing his policy (of withholding medical care for aborted babies who live), instead of you talking about his policy - you simply divert the conversation to another President. So, who is close minded and who is ignoring fact? Feel free to throw out anything you want to that doesn't fit with your line of thinking or that you refuse to discuss, it's pretty much the norm with folks who try to defend Obama and have no real answer for the questions.
Sir, you have repeatedly demonstrated that you will not address points brought up that refute your "view" on who this man is. You instead try to divert attention to comparing this man to others, while I continue to point out issues brought up about the man himself. So, in fact, instead of you talking about the man, you would rather talk about other people (which is why I continued to make the comment, "thought this was about Obama" .... food for thought).
As for an open mind, I can honestly say I have an open mind about this man and when I got to looking into who he is and what he is about - my mind (as well as my eyes) was opened even further. Try it.
With all due respect,
-me
ps. Not to argue with the mod, but I must point out that Islam believes in an anti-Christ of sorts, I think they call him the 12th Imam (sp?) or something. I think Obama's Muslim roots/faith plays an important part in this discussion since both Christians and Muslims are looking at the end of times in along the same way and his beliefs are basically a conflict of the two. But, I will honor the wishes of the mod. =)
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Your closest relative is a monkey and your distant cousins are bananas and turnips - Richard Dawkins, PhD. (insert "laugh track" here) |
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