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ORIGINAL: McFatty

I'll drink to that!

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ORIGINAL: cposey

Is it possible to say that we can fellowship with other Christians without saying you should or shouldn't do this?

Are we called to correct everyone on everything we personally see as a sin?

My true heart on this matter is that we each individually are given the Holy Spirit. This Holy Spirit will guide each and every one of us to draw closer to the Father. The more we submit our will to HIM, the more HE will reveal to us those things which hinder our relationship with the Father. I see absolutely no point in constantly teaching this philosophy that there is this huge list of do's and don'ts. People do this to feel better or superior in the "faith" than others. We hear all kinds of teaching on the standards of others, but rarely hear about how those same people can live by the Holy Spirit daily. If we truly walk by the Spirit daily than we will be able to speak Life to others. Rather than heaping guilt, shame, condemnation on others for what we think their "wrongdoings" are.

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ORIGINAL: McFatty

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ORIGINAL: cposey

Is it possible to say that we can fellowship with other Christians without saying you should or shouldn't do this?

Are we called to correct everyone on everything we personally see as a sin?

My true heart on this matter is that we each individually are given the Holy Spirit. This Holy Spirit will guide each and every one of us to draw closer to the Father. The more we submit our will to HIM, the more HE will reveal to us those things which hinder our relationship with the Father. I see absolutely no point in constantly teaching this philosophy that there is this huge list of do's and don'ts. People do this to feel better or superior in the "faith" than others. We hear all kinds of teaching on the standards of others, but rarely hear about how those same people can live by the Holy Spirit daily. If we truly walk by the Spirit daily than we will be able to speak Life to others. Rather than heaping guilt, shame, condemnation on others for what we think their "wrongdoings" are.

I've been trying to distinguish between what I'm personally convicted of and what is actually sin. We have to help show others when they are wrong, but only when they are wrong for them, and not just for us.

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Is it possible to say that we can fellowship with other Christians without saying you should or shouldn't do this?

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My true heart on this matter is that we each individually are given the Holy Spirit. This Holy Spirit will guide each and every one of us to draw closer to the Father. The more we submit our will to HIM, the more HE will reveal to us those things which hinder our relationship with the Father. I see absolutely no point in constantly teaching this philosophy that there is this huge list of do's and don'ts. People do this to feel better or superior in the "faith" than others. We hear all kinds of teaching on the standards of others, but rarely hear about how those same people can live by the Holy Spirit daily. If we truly walk by the Spirit daily than we will be able to speak Life to others. Rather than heaping guilt, shame, condemnation on others for what we think their "wrongdoings" are.

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ORIGINAL: McFatty

I've had many a great fellowship at bars! A couple times at tattoo parlors too!

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ORIGINAL: evry1needsgod

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Is it possible to say that we can fellowship with other Christians without saying you should or shouldn't do this?

Absolutely. But I would never walk in a bar, sit at a tattoo parlor, or breath in the smoke of someone's cigarette just to fellowship.

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My true heart on this matter is that we each individually are given the Holy Spirit. This Holy Spirit will guide each and every one of us to draw closer to the Father. The more we submit our will to HIM, the more HE will reveal to us those things which hinder our relationship with the Father. I see absolutely no point in constantly teaching this philosophy that there is this huge list of do's and don'ts. People do this to feel better or superior in the "faith" than others. We hear all kinds of teaching on the standards of others, but rarely hear about how those same people can live by the Holy Spirit daily. If we truly walk by the Spirit daily than we will be able to speak Life to others. Rather than heaping guilt, shame, condemnation on others for what we think their "wrongdoings" are.

Is there absolute truth, cposey? Can the Holy Spirit compromise absolute truth? Furthermore, can certain aspects of life that we deem as a "standard" actually be more than just a standard, and actually an absolute truth or absolute sin?

I'm not trying to defend legalistic preaching at all...however, I'm not a huge fan of this modern trend of using the Holy Spirit to defend sinful actions. The Holy Spirit's conviction has been abused. It's been an excuse to makes standards and separation relativistic. Christians use the Holy Spirit as their get-out-of-jail-free card, and it annoys me.

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ORIGINAL: cposey

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ORIGINAL: evry1needsgod

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Is it possible to say that we can fellowship with other Christians without saying you should or shouldn't do this?

Absolutely. But I would never walk in a bar, sit at a tattoo parlor, or breath in the smoke of someone's cigarette just to fellowship.

quote:

My true heart on this matter is that we each individually are given the Holy Spirit. This Holy Spirit will guide each and every one of us to draw closer to the Father. The more we submit our will to HIM, the more HE will reveal to us those things which hinder our relationship with the Father. I see absolutely no point in constantly teaching this philosophy that there is this huge list of do's and don'ts. People do this to feel better or superior in the "faith" than others. We hear all kinds of teaching on the standards of others, but rarely hear about how those same people can live by the Holy Spirit daily. If we truly walk by the Spirit daily than we will be able to speak Life to others. Rather than heaping guilt, shame, condemnation on others for what we think their "wrongdoings" are.

Is there absolute truth, cposey? Can the Holy Spirit compromise absolute truth? Furthermore, can certain aspects of life that we deem as a "standard" actually be more than just a standard, and actually an absolute truth or absolute sin?

I'm not trying to defend legalistic preaching at all...however, I'm not a huge fan of this modern trend of using the Holy Spirit to defend sinful actions. The Holy Spirit's conviction has been abused. It's been an excuse to makes standards and separation relativistic. Christians use the Holy Spirit as their get-out-of-jail-free card, and it annoys me.

I do agree with you about using the Holy Spirit to defend actions that are clearly stated as fruits of the flesh and not the Spirit. However, i'll throw this question out there to ya. How much good does it do to tell someone the error in their ways? How much of an impact will that have in their life?
Does God deal with us in that way? How much of an impact would it make in the life of that person to first love them, pray for them and trust that because we worship adn follow the same God, that His Holy Spirit will eventually guide them down the correct path or understanding. For me i see it as an issue of do we have enough faith that God knows the other person well enough to know when and how they will grow and cast off that hinderance between them and God. Can we put our trust in God without having to open our mouth and put our two cents in?

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ORIGINAL: evry1needsgod

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ORIGINAL: cposey

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ORIGINAL: evry1needsgod

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Is it possible to say that we can fellowship with other Christians without saying you should or shouldn't do this?

Absolutely. But I would never walk in a bar, sit at a tattoo parlor, or breath in the smoke of someone's cigarette just to fellowship.

quote:

My true heart on this matter is that we each individually are given the Holy Spirit. This Holy Spirit will guide each and every one of us to draw closer to the Father. The more we submit our will to HIM, the more HE will reveal to us those things which hinder our relationship with the Father. I see absolutely no point in constantly teaching this philosophy that there is this huge list of do's and don'ts. People do this to feel better or superior in the "faith" than others. We hear all kinds of teaching on the standards of others, but rarely hear about how those same people can live by the Holy Spirit daily. If we truly walk by the Spirit daily than we will be able to speak Life to others. Rather than heaping guilt, shame, condemnation on others for what we think their "wrongdoings" are.

Is there absolute truth, cposey? Can the Holy Spirit compromise absolute truth? Furthermore, can certain aspects of life that we deem as a "standard" actually be more than just a standard, and actually an absolute truth or absolute sin?

I'm not trying to defend legalistic preaching at all...however, I'm not a huge fan of this modern trend of using the Holy Spirit to defend sinful actions. The Holy Spirit's conviction has been abused. It's been an excuse to makes standards and separation relativistic. Christians use the Holy Spirit as their get-out-of-jail-free card, and it annoys me.

I do agree with you about using the Holy Spirit to defend actions that are clearly stated as fruits of the flesh and not the Spirit. However, i'll throw this question out there to ya. How much good does it do to tell someone the error in their ways? How much of an impact will that have in their life?
Does God deal with us in that way? How much of an impact would it make in the life of that person to first love them, pray for them and trust that because we worship adn follow the same God, that His Holy Spirit will eventually guide them down the correct path or understanding. For me i see it as an issue of do we have enough faith that God knows the other person well enough to know when and how they will grow and cast off that hinderance between them and God. Can we put our trust in God without having to open our mouth and put our two cents in?

Allow me to throw this question at ya: how do you know that the tool the Holy Spirit wants to use to "guide them down the correct path or understanding" is not your direct counseling and motivational realization for that person to see his/her sin?

This reminds me of an illustration that goes something like this: You're drowning and you ask God to save you. Seconds later a large piece of driftwood floats nearby. You consciously refuse to grab onto the piece of wood because you've placed your trust in God to save you and you believe He will. Moments later a lifeguard aboard a nearby boat tosses you a life vest, but you refuse and exclaim "I'm trusting that God will save me!". A few short minutes pass before a helicopter hovers overhead, letting down the safety ladder. Again you refuse proclaiming that God will save you. Eventually nature overcomes your frail body and you drown. In Heaven you ask God why He did not save you even though you had faith and trusted that He would. He shakes His head and tells you "Son, I tried to save you--3 times! I sent the piece of wood, I sent the boat, and I brought the helicopter to you. You were too consumed with your blind faith that you failed to see every attempt of rescue."

The Holy Spirit will indeed be the source of change in said individual's life. Without the Holy Spirit the person will never be convicted and will never change. And I know that we need to pray for said individual's and allow the Holy Spirit to work in the individual's life...but how do you know that you aren't the tool that the Holy Spirit wants to use? Maybe God wants you to be the direct and blunt voice of reason for that person?

I think we play a much bigger part in the workings of the Holy Spirit than we think.

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ORIGINAL: cposey

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ORIGINAL: evry1needsgod

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ORIGINAL: cposey

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ORIGINAL: evry1needsgod

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Is it possible to say that we can fellowship with other Christians without saying you should or shouldn't do this?

Absolutely. But I would never walk in a bar, sit at a tattoo parlor, or breath in the smoke of someone's cigarette just to fellowship.

quote:

My true heart on this matter is that we each individually are given the Holy Spirit. This Holy Spirit will guide each and every one of us to draw closer to the Father. The more we submit our will to HIM, the more HE will reveal to us those things which hinder our relationship with the Father. I see absolutely no point in constantly teaching this philosophy that there is this huge list of do's and don'ts. People do this to feel better or superior in the "faith" than others. We hear all kinds of teaching on the standards of others, but rarely hear about how those same people can live by the Holy Spirit daily. If we truly walk by the Spirit daily than we will be able to speak Life to others. Rather than heaping guilt, shame, condemnation on others for what we think their "wrongdoings" are.

Is there absolute truth, cposey? Can the Holy Spirit compromise absolute truth? Furthermore, can certain aspects of life that we deem as a "standard" actually be more than just a standard, and actually an absolute truth or absolute sin?

I'm not trying to defend legalistic preaching at all...however, I'm not a huge fan of this modern trend of using the Holy Spirit to defend sinful actions. The Holy Spirit's conviction has been abused. It's been an excuse to makes standards and separation relativistic. Christians use the Holy Spirit as their get-out-of-jail-free card, and it annoys me.

I do agree with you about using the Holy Spirit to defend actions that are clearly stated as fruits of the flesh and not the Spirit. However, i'll throw this question out there to ya. How much good does it do to tell someone the error in their ways? How much of an impact will that have in their life?
Does God deal with us in that way? How much of an impact would it make in the life of that person to first love them, pray for them and trust that because we worship adn follow the same God, that His Holy Spirit will eventually guide them down the correct path or understanding. For me i see it as an issue of do we have enough faith that God knows the other person well enough to know when and how they will grow and cast off that hinderance between them and God. Can we put our trust in God without having to open our mouth and put our two cents in?

Allow me to throw this question at ya: how do you know that the tool the Holy Spirit wants to use to "guide them down the correct path or understanding" is not your direct counseling and motivational realization for that person to see his/her sin?

This reminds me of an illustration that goes something like this: You're drowning and you ask God to save you. Seconds later a large piece of driftwood floats nearby. You consciously refuse to grab onto the piece of wood because you've placed your trust in God to save you and you believe He will. Moments later a lifeguard aboard a nearby boat tosses you a life vest, but you refuse and exclaim "I'm trusting that God will save me!". A few short minutes pass before a helicopter hovers overhead, letting down the safety ladder. Again you refuse proclaiming that God will save you. Eventually nature overcomes your frail body and you drown. In Heaven you ask God why He did not save you even though you had faith and trusted that He would. He shakes His head and tells you "Son, I tried to save you--3 times! I sent the piece of wood, I sent the boat, and I brought the helicopter to you. You were too consumed with your blind faith that you failed to see every attempt of rescue."

The Holy Spirit will indeed be the source of change in said individual's life. Without the Holy Spirit the person will never be convicted and will never change. And I know that we need to pray for said individual's and allow the Holy Spirit to work in the individual's life...but how do you know that you aren't the tool that the Holy Spirit wants to use? Maybe God wants you to be the direct and blunt voice of reason for that person?

I think we play a much bigger part in the workings of the Holy Spirit than we think.

I don't disagree with you that we are involved much more than we think in the workings of the Holy Spirit. However in dealing with other people, why shouldn't we do as the bible says and seek HIM first and then everything will be added to you. Before we open our mouths we should always seek HIM first. If HE then directs you to say something, than say it. If we walk in the Spirit as we are commanded to do, then we will not error. What i have experienced and seen way to often if people have these preset ideas of what others should and shouldn't do, with scriptures to go along. No matter the individual or the circumstance, they turn to memory and their human wisdom to try and counsel people. Each of us were created as unique human beings and God deals with each of us uniquely. Therefore, why would we think we can counsel people without first seeking HIS face for HIS desires for the other individual. It is not all about what we think the other person needs to hear, but rather about allowing God to speak life into that other person.

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ORIGINAL: Eutychus

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ORIGINAL: Eutychus

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ORIGINAL: Eutychus

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ORIGINAL: Eutychus

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ORIGINAL: Eutychus

Personally, I think it is a sin to nest more than 3 quotes.

Personally, I think it is a sin to nest more than 3 quotes.

Personally, I think it is a sin to nest more than 3 quotes.

Personally, I think it is a sin to nest more than 3 quotes.

Personally, I think it is a sin to nest more than 3 quotes.

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ORIGINAL: evry1needsgod

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ORIGINAL: Eutychus

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ORIGINAL: Eutychus

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ORIGINAL: Eutychus

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ORIGINAL: Eutychus

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ORIGINAL: Eutychus

Personally, I think it is a sin to nest more than 3 quotes.

Personally, I think it is a sin to nest more than 3 quotes.

Personally, I think it is a sin to nest more than 3 quotes.

Personally, I think it is a sin to nest more than 3 quotes.

Personally, I think it is a sin to nest more than 3 quotes.

Oops....

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ORIGINAL: cposey

It really blesses my heart to reach an agreement with you. And i know it blesses God's heart that we can become unified in one Spirit in seeking HIS heart.