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Abortion and the American Conscience - 10/12/2009 11:39:26 AM
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Fritzpw_Admin
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quote:
Abortion and the American Conscience
Albert Mohler - Author, Speaker, President of the Southern Baptist Theological Seminary
America has been at war over abortion for the last four decades. When the U.S. Supreme Court handed down its decision in Roe v. Wade, the court's majority attempted to put an end to the abortion question. To the contrary, that decision both enlarged and revealed the great moral divide that runs through the center of our culture.
<<SNIP>>
Tapes recently released by the Nixon Presidential Library reveal that President Richard M. Nixon, who had been considered generally opposed to abortion, told aides on January 23, 1973 (the day after the decision was handed down) that abortion was justified in certain cases, such as interracial pregnancies.
"There are times when abortion is necessary. I know that. When you have a black and a white," said Nixon. President Nixon's words, chilling as they are, are also a general reflection of the moral logic shared by millions of Americans in that day.
As a matter of fact, one of the dirty secrets of the abortion rights movement is that its earliest momentum was driven by a concern that was deeply racial. Leaders such as Margaret Sanger, the founder of Planned Parenthood, argued quite openly that abortion and other means of birth control were necessary in order to limit the number of undesirable children. As she made clear, the least desirable children were those born to certain ethnically and racially defined families. Sanger, along with so many other "progressive" figures of the day, promoted the agenda of the eugenics movement --- more children from the "fit" and less from the "unfit."
Read the rest of Abortion and the American Conscience
What do you think? Is the abortion movement still racially motivated?
_____________________________
Fred "Fritz" Alberti
Director of Social Media
fritz@salemwebnetwork.com
Read today's Bible verse from my favorite online Bible
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RE: Abortion and the American Conscience - 10/12/2009 1:27:39 PM
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tacitus
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I am sure there are some people who still believe this type of thing, but it's only a tiny handful of those who believe abortion should remain legal.
And I am certain that there are far more people who believe that "brown people" should not be allowed to immigrate into the US, at all.
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RE: Abortion and the American Conscience - 10/12/2009 5:24:05 PM
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allisonbrett
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I have never thought of abortion to be promoted these days in a racial or ethnic mode. I know Ms. Sanger who the liberal left applauds was a bigot and was convinced that children with certain skin color where more or less valuable then others. I've never heard the quote by Nixon on interracial children.
I think abortion today is promoted to ensure "I can live exactly the way I want and no pregnancy is going to stop me" ideal. Those proponents today have separated pregnancy which denotes a medical condition with baby with denotes a human life. I think the pro-choice movement is promoting selfishness rather than eliminating unwanted children regardless of race.
_____________________________
Allison
A work in progress so please be patient, God is still working on me. Ouch, it sure is painful!
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RE: Abortion and the American Conscience - 10/12/2009 9:17:39 PM
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ourgreatestSource
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quote:
What do you think? Is the abortion movement still racially motivated?
Well..nowdays I think the % of racially motivated that suports it is low, although the population majority still white and in the past it did controled birth rates among black populations by giving acess to birth control and sterelizations, clearly because racism eugenism (?) kind of nazy/kkk understading. Interesting that the control white majority had at some point in past history, wanting cheap labor they encourage black slaves growth by having babies and then when start to grow to much for their tastes here they go, to try to stop the bloom...I guess it was about race and profits, own interests gains as always humans are seduced by greed..and then the love of mammon the root of all evils and many people because of that will sell their souls.
I guess nowdays the ones supporting at least more vocal about the abortions are the white majority, the college educated ones, middle class up, men and women. Very strange this situation..because the ones doing most of the abortion are minorities women and poor. I would have thought majority were the white women working class because being white the majority.
Here in the US majority doing abortions are poor (?) and other societies where abortion is illegal, the rich and middle class are the ones doing abortion, while the poor women have kids and some become street kids.
If US groups are trying to export their racist ideas outside US, behind birth control facade, it will not stick much nowdays..because past bad experiences, giving to 3rd world women birth control rejected as bad, here, for exemple. Plus health care are improving in some nations and people becoming more educated as their Gov inject more $ to benefit the people, for real with education, health, jobs etc
I guess the racial motivation to control birth rates based on races was mostly a North American thing. By now countries have way pass their Colonies days, some with high steady miscegenation (that shows in their DNA's) as majority and in those societies the whites might be the minority with the power (for now), not the majority with the power like in the USA, today. 
Thanks, my oppinion (I do not have an American conscience, I just wanted to partipate in the thread.)
_____________________________
"Whoever has no rule over his own spirit Is like a city broken down, without walls." Prov. 25:28
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RE: Abortion and the American Conscience - 10/12/2009 9:58:21 PM
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manhattan42
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quote:
What do you think? Is the abortion movement still racially motivated?
I do not believe that the abortion movement has ever been racially motivated....unless you consider the fact that whites have consistently had twice as many abortions than blacks since 1972 'racist'....:
http://www.abortionfacts.com/statistics/us_stats_abortion.asp
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RE: Abortion and the American Conscience - 10/12/2009 10:16:44 PM
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ourgreatestSource
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"I do not believe that the abortion movement has ever been racially motivated....unless you consider the fact that whites have consistently had twice as many abortions than blacks since 1972 'racist'....:
http://www.abortionfacts.com/statistics/us_stats_abortion.asp "
White women do more abortions in numbers but I guess Black ended up doing more in proportion with their population numbers smaller .
74% (221.3 million) population white, 13.4% (40,9 million) Black, 14.8% (44.3 million) "Latino"/Hispanic.
.Ethinic groups US
_____________________________
"Whoever has no rule over his own spirit Is like a city broken down, without walls." Prov. 25:28
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RE: Abortion and the American Conscience - 10/12/2009 10:41:18 PM
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manhattan42
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quote:
ORIGINAL: tinydancer2
"I do not believe that the abortion movement has ever been racially motivated....unless you consider the fact that whites have consistently had twice as many abortions than blacks since 1972 'racist'....:
http://www.abortionfacts.com/statistics/us_stats_abortion.asp "
White women do more abortions in numbers but I guess Black ended up doing more in proportion with their population numbers smaller .
74% (221.3 million) population white, 13.4% (40,9 million) Black, 14.8% (44.3 million) "Latino"/Hispanic.
.Ethinic groups US
No matter how you slice it, WHITES have more abortions in the US than any other ethnic group more of the time.
If 2 of 3 Black pregnant women have abortions, one "might" try to wrongly argue, that Blacks were apt to have abortions 66% of the time while ignoring that (for argument sake), 37% of 75000 white women "might" have abortions.
The grand total of Black women abortions in the above scenario (at 66%) is 2 total abortions...
While the grand total of white abortions (at 37%) would total 27750 abortions.....albeit the percentage of white abortions is smaller-------------
The unmistakeable FACT from statistics kept since 1972 is that WHITES have had far more ACTUAL abortions than BLACKS ...making WHITES the single RACIAL group more prone to abortion than any other...
Is it racist to say that?
Only if one is non-white, I suppose...
But I'm white.
So it is simply a statement of fact:
Since 1972, more WHITE fetuses have been aborted than BLACK fetuses by a margin of at least 2:1.
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RE: Abortion and the American Conscience - 10/13/2009 12:11:30 AM
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manhattan42
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quote:
"Evangelicals -- representative of the larger American culture -- were largely out of the debate. At that time, a majority of evangelicals seemed to see abortion as a largely Catholic issue."
HUH?
There are nearly 2 Roman Catholics for every Baptist in the US.
Evangelicals at large do not come close to equaling Roman Catholic adherents in the US:
http://www.adherents.com/rel_USA.html#Pew_branches
So how can 'Evangelicals' in the US be "Representative of the larger American culture" when Evangelicals represent FEWER Christians in the US than ROMAN CATHOLICS and other non-evangleical Christians combined?
< Message edited by manhattan42 -- 10/13/2009 12:20:45 AM >
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RE: Abortion and the American Conscience - 10/13/2009 12:31:05 AM
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ourgreatestSource
Posts: 732
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quote:
ORIGINAL: manhattan42
quote:
ORIGINAL: tinydancer2
"I do not believe that the abortion movement has ever been racially motivated....unless you consider the fact that whites have consistently had twice as many abortions than blacks since 1972 'racist'....:
http://www.abortionfacts.com/statistics/us_stats_abortion.asp "
White women do more abortions in numbers but I guess Black ended up doing more in proportion with their population numbers smaller .
74% (221.3 million) population white, 13.4% (40,9 million) Black, 14.8% (44.3 million) "Latino"/Hispanic.
.Ethinic groups US
No matter how you slice it, WHITES have more abortions in the US than any other ethnic group more of the time.
If 2 of 3 Black pregnant women have abortions, one "might" try to wrongly argue, that Blacks were apt to have abortions 66% of the time while ignoring that (for argument sake), 37% of 75000 white women "might" have abortions.
The grand total of Black women abortions in the above scenario (at 66%) is 2 total abortions...
While the grand total of white abortions (at 37%) would total 27750 abortions.....albeit the percentage of white abortions is smaller-------------
The unmistakeable FACT from statistics kept since 1972 is that WHITES have had far more ACTUAL abortions than BLACKS ...making WHITES the single RACIAL group more prone to abortion than any other...
Is it racist to say that?
Only if one is non-white, I suppose...
But I'm white.
So it is simply a statement of fact:
Since 1972, more WHITE fetuses have been aborted than BLACK fetuses by a margin of at least 2:1.
I have to confess I'm not good in math and it is difficult for me sometimes understand etc I just compared the late numbers and their % to say what I did.
Hmmmm..why people keep repeating that minorities are the ones having more abortions then?
Are the minorities teens more promiscuos also..because it says there majority having abortion are all unmarried.
Another thing to observe is all about ethinicity and not social class at all ..why they only divided that among ethinicities? Or it is already known the minorities are poorer than no need to explain social status?
_____________________________
"Whoever has no rule over his own spirit Is like a city broken down, without walls." Prov. 25:28
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RE: Abortion and the American Conscience - 10/13/2009 3:36:26 AM
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huangshan
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I don't think abortion as an institution was ever particularly racially motivated. I do think it's something that's turned to when people perceive themselves as having made a terrible mistake, which may have racist undertones (like a white woman being impregnated by a non-white male). People had some pretty explicitly racist or scientifically incorrect ideas like phrenology that may have affected what they considered to be a terrible mistake back in the day as compared to today.
So it may have been seen as a solution that only exists in the minds of racists.
But if it's black people choosing to have abortions, no matter what you think about abortion, it's not racist.
If it's white people choosing to have abortions, it's not racist.
If we find that one particular racial ethnic group is choosing to have more abortions than another, even as a percentage of population, it's also not racist.
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RE: Abortion and the American Conscience - 10/13/2009 8:12:43 AM
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Born_Again
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I am a pro-life. Once upon a time I was active in pro-life movement, but as time passed I realize those who are leading this pro life moment they are nothing but hypocrites. And those who follow this moment they are sheep, they set aside every other moral issue and focus on only this issue. I realized it is not any more about saving unborn babies but branding others as enemy who disagree with us, it is about characterize others as evil because they don’t agree with us. I see nothing about Christ like attitude in this movement any more. Chris has left the pro-life camp long ago. I am still pro-life but I don’t go to rally and shout at those who disagree with me on this issue. I still share my belief but don’t tell others what to do.
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RE: Abortion and the American Conscience - 10/13/2009 1:48:05 PM
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lightbeamrider
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From 1998 to 2003 the illegitimacy rates among blacks range from 69.1% (1998) down to 68.2% (2003)
Whites 26.3% (1998) up to 29.4% (2003)
It is high in Native American Hispanic and Hawaiian cultures and low in Asian cultures.
For the purposes of this discussion, this means if the abortion rate is low then the illegitimacy rate is high.
Illegitimate children pose many problems for society according to Chapter 2 of Ann Coulter's book Guilty. Which should be required reading. Chapter 2 is worth the price of the book if one wants to get down to causes and condition of societal dysfunction. No matter what one thinks of Coulter one cannot argue with her facts.
Google; illegitimate birth rate by race for more info
80% of all teen births are out of wedlock in the United States. In 2005 a little more than 1/3 of all births are out of wedlock in the United States.
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RE: Abortion and the American Conscience - 10/13/2009 2:56:35 PM
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Sayen
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It might not be a justification now, but race and mixed race were, at least publicly, states reasons supporting abortion in the past. Sadly, I've heard the justification used by both Christians and non-Christians. Over dinner a woman once remarked at how ignorant and worldly many of 'them' are, referring to Mexican-Americans. Her stated solution was to outbreed them, and allow them to keep having abortions. This was a Christian dinner party, and no one else seemed put off by her suggestion.
I think today's movement is characterized more by the desire to never have to tell someone that their actions have consequences. It seems like the most common response to pro-life arguments is that a woman shouldn't have to have her entire life changed because of one mistake.
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RE: Abortion and the American Conscience - 10/13/2009 4:02:06 PM
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allisonbrett
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quote:
Since 1972, more WHITE fetuses have been aborted than BLACK fetuses by a margin of at least 2:1.
I assume this is a worldwide statistic and not merely one based on US numbers. In the US the only 12.3% are black so it would be tragic indeed if half of babies aborted were from this small percentage.
2000 Census
I still think its selfishness based although in some countries this may not be true as much as survival, lack of proper medical attention or ability to care for another child.
_____________________________
Allison
A work in progress so please be patient, God is still working on me. Ouch, it sure is painful!
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