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Notice the change in modern children's picture books? - 10/17/2009 6:57:46 PM
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Fritzpw_Admin
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quote:
Parents, Obey Your Children?
Albert Mohler - Author, Speaker, President of the Southern Baptist Theological Seminary
Literary critic Lionel Trilling once referred to "the dark and bloody crossroads where literature and politics meet." In reality, almost all literature is political in some sense. Oddly enough, the most explicitly subversive literature is often presented to the very youngest among us -- our children. Far too many parents seem not to notice.
In "The Defiant Ones," a recent essay published in the New Yorker, Daniel Zalewski argues that picture books for children now reflect a world turned upside down in terms of the relationship between parent and child. As he explains, in the newest picture books for children, the kids are solidly in charge.
In this sense, the books we read to our children reflect the cultural values of our age. Inescapably, these narratives for children reveal far more than a storyline. Indeed, the books tell us more than we may want to know about the tenor of our times.
Read the rest of Parents, Obey Your Children?
Anyone notice the change in modern children's picture books?
Thoughts?
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RE: Notice the change in modern children's picture books? - 10/17/2009 7:28:46 PM
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garsyt
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I am very fond of children's literature. I personally haven't noticed this BUT it could be because of the sort of children's books I choose to pick. I guess what I'm say is that for everything that is wrong with our society as well as everything right with the world as well - there is likely someone out there writing books about it.
Could it be the reason behind showing parents as bumbling baffoons and quote:
typical adult in a contemporary picture book is harried and befuddled , is simply because that is what most kids see already?
quote:
Similarly, the stern disciplinarians of the past—in Robert McCloskey books, parents instruct children not to cry—have largely vanished.
I'm still trying to figure out what book of McCloskey's this is and what the problem is with crying?
I guess it could also depend on what is considered "Modern" in the realm of children's literature considering from authors conception of a book til it gets to print, even for picture books takes a LONG time in many cases. For example - Patricia Polacco's latest book. She wrote it and had the final copy in the hands of her publishers almost two years ago. It came out a couple months ago. Sometimes it takes even longer.
Blessings,
Garsy
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RE: Notice the change in modern children's picture books? - 10/17/2009 7:33:08 PM
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APZR
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No haven't noticed, but we've tend to use the classics.
While I haven't seen the material in question, it doesn't surprise me though. Many said the same thing about Leave it to Beaver and Lassie with the boys always running off and getting into trouble. Now those are considered to be the golden classics.
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RE: Notice the change in modern children's picture books? - 10/17/2009 7:58:19 PM
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kohls356
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I don't have young children anymore so haven't see any of the new picture books, but I have noticed for several years that television shows and commercials show children being more in charge and the parents acting childish.
I remember a commercial where the child is pulling the mother out of a store kicking and screaming yelling that she wanted that dress. There is the commercial now for some cell phone company where the children are talking to the parents while they are twittering and texting. so it wouldn't suprise me if children's books are becoming that way as well.
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RE: Notice the change in modern children's picture books? - 10/17/2009 9:42:38 PM
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Consecrated2God
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I don't think it's anything new. Charlie Brown never had any parents around--he was very independent. Whenever there was an adult, they always talked with the "Wah wahwah" voice anyway.
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RE: Notice the change in modern children's picture books? - 10/17/2009 10:21:36 PM
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bolt.
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I've not noticed anything like this in children's books.
And I think perhaps the author might read some current parenting magazines if he things we are being encouraged by 'experts' to never discipline. There are always experts all along the continuum, and the extremes get the attention... but for the most part I get a steady diet of sound advice and insight. There are plenty of secular current books by experts that uphold that children need limit. The mainstream magazine I get has at least 2 articles on discipline each month -- encouraging parents to be consistent, know their children, pick their battles and plenty of tips on refining their technique.
With no examples or documentation, I consider this article to be plain fear mongering and a full of hyperbole.
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RE: Notice the change in modern children's picture books? - 10/18/2009 5:18:39 PM
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sen10tious
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The only thing surprising here is that the authors Mohler and Zalewski are being given credit for this being a "new" observation.
Parents are not protected because our nation, as a corporate body, has lost her knowledge of God—and because many people of the past two generations never obtained such knowledge to begin with.
Parenthood is one of the most God-like roles a human can fulfill. People who have not grown up with knowledge of God do not trust Him. They feel safer trusting government and the courts.
Already, the Church is allowing insurance companies with no knowledge of God tell them who they can and cannot have teaching their children. Everyone must have a background check. This will effectively assure that Moses, the murderer; Abraham, the blood-sacrificer; and Elisha, who sicced a couple of bears on forty-two young lads, will never get a chance to preach to your youth group!
It is only a matter of months until even this will be reversed— instead of telling us who cannot serve, they will be dictating who must serve. I predict that the church will be forced to hire according to ungodly "equal opportunity" mandates the first time a hedonistic judge gets a suitable case for review.
Parents have not been respected for a very long time. A quarter-century ago, I decided Sesame Street was unfit viewing for these same reasons. Twenty-two years ago, the Simpsons conglomerate started cashing in on this idea. Millions of dollars have been made belittling Homer's fatherhood.
Of course, it is in our children's literature! Doh!
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RE: Notice the change in modern children's picture books? - 10/18/2009 5:23:36 PM
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PinkCarnations
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Consecrated2God
I don't think it's anything new. Charlie Brown never had any parents around--he was very independent. Whenever there was an adult, they always talked with the "Wah wahwah" voice anyway.
I think that is why I always liked Peanuts. 
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RE: Notice the change in modern children's picture books? - 10/18/2009 7:10:39 PM
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bolt.
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quote:
Already, the Church is allowing insurance companies with no knowledge of God tell them who they can and cannot have teaching their children. Everyone must have a background check. This will effectively assure that Moses, the murderer; Abraham, the blood-sacrificer; and Elisha, who sicced a couple of bears on forty-two young lads, will never get a chance to preach to your youth group!
I'm pretty sure that you are still allowed to have ex-criminal preach to any age group, as long as you do not leave minors alone and unsupervised in their care.
quote:
It is only a matter of months until even this will be reversed— instead of telling us who cannot serve, they will be dictating who must serve. I predict that the church will be forced to hire according to ungodly "equal opportunity" mandates the first time a hedonistic judge gets a suitable case for review.
I think you are getting carried away here, not to mention off topic. I'm pretty sure no Church is 'forced' to hire any person to do anything if they'd rather not. If they do choose to hire people to serve, then maybe there will be some "equal opportunity" stuff that applies -- but seriously, if a person is right for the job, then that's easy to substantiate and not open to being an issue of prejudicial hiring, as I understand it. If a Church does reject a suitable candidate for ungodly (prejudicial) reasons, then I'm not gong to be letting them cry on my shoulder if they get sued for it.
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RE: Notice the change in modern children's picture books? - 10/18/2009 10:45:21 PM
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sen10tious
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quote:
ORIGINAL: bolt.
I'm pretty sure that you are still allowed ...
My point being that someone other than God is telling the church what it is and is not allowed to do. Someone with a higher authority, apparently.
Many, if not most children's books are supporting an agenda. Once a minor child can read for himself, he is often left alone and unsupervised in its care.
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RE: Notice the change in modern children's picture books? - 10/19/2009 12:06:01 AM
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garsyt
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quote:
Many, if not most children's books are supporting an agenda. Once a minor child can read for himself, he is often left alone and unsupervised in its care.
Unless of course parents take the time to interact with the child about what they are reading and perhaps read it themselves.
But this has been going on for YEARS - quite honestly since the idea to create books for children there has always been an "agenda" of some sort or another. In fact that's how it is with, I dare say, all books.
Blessings,
Garsy
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RE: Notice the change in modern children's picture books? - 10/19/2009 10:36:02 AM
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heremainsfaithful
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I have seen a shift - as a teacher - in the idea of respect for all authority, not just parents. Even "nice" shows have the kids smarting off to the parents these days.
That being said, I do not apologize for the fact that I don't want a pedophile teaching my small children. Once you rape a child, you lose your right to EVER be alone with them. Period. That particular line of thinking is ridiculous.
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RE: Notice the change in modern children's picture books? - 10/19/2009 11:49:52 AM
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heremainsfaithful
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In addition, just because the Bible speaks of forgiveness of sin, it does not necessarily promise to remove all of sin's consequences. Some things just change your life. When a woman has a child out of wedlock, God can completely forgive, but the baby is still there (not that a baby is a consequence). When I had an affair 3 years ago, God and my husband forgave me. But do you think I'll ever have another close male friend again other than my husband? No way. Sorry, some things just can't be undone.
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https://www2.xlibris.com/bookstore/bookdisplay.aspx?bookid=58896
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RE: Notice the change in modern children's picture books? - 10/21/2009 3:29:47 PM
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doinkdom
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Fritzpw_Admin
Anyone notice the change in modern children's picture books?
No, but I have noticed the change in moder children's behavior. 
...which might or might not be a result of referenced pictures or the ideas behind them.
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Thanksgiving dinners take eighteen hours to prepare.
They are consumed in twelve minutes.
Half-times take twelve minutes.
This is not coincidence.
~Erma Bombeck
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RE: Notice the change in modern children's picture books? - 10/22/2009 1:27:24 PM
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doinkdom
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quote:
ORIGINAL: garsyt
Now, now. I'm sure there were spoiled little snotty brats back in the day too.
A different thread I suppose...and a completely different era for realz...
_____________________________
Thanksgiving dinners take eighteen hours to prepare.
They are consumed in twelve minutes.
Half-times take twelve minutes.
This is not coincidence.
~Erma Bombeck
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RE: Notice the change in modern children's picture books? - 10/23/2009 3:32:03 PM
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Auben
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This is hardly a modern thing, although perhaps there's more ability now to admit parents don't always know what to do and make bad choices.
I find that children's picture books have realized tantrums are funny. Its part reality and part exaggeration. Children think what would happen if I screamed that loud?? Or were that naughty and got away with it? Its a tantalizing thing for children and its funny partially because it isn't realistic. There were several of these when I was a child so its not new, but they are funnier which I think is part of the appeal.
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RE: Notice the change in modern children's picture books? - 10/25/2009 8:28:25 AM
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JonahsDive
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I have noticed many children's movies that show the trend -- of the children in charge, not the parents. Even if the parent is the authority figure, the child usually has the moral high ground and is shown to be "right" while the well-meaning parent is wrong.
A few examples I've seen recently are Chicken Little and also Tuck Everlasting. In chicken Little, the father apologizes to his son for not trusting his judgment and disbelieving him. Several of us parents were complaining after the film: what kind of message is that? What was the moral anyway? The kid had made several mistakes already, basically the father was right to question him. The message seemed to be, kids are always right, parents should always support them or they dont love them.
Tuck had a similar theme: the teenage girl needed to get away from her strict parents to really learn how to live. They were well-meaning but she defied all their authority to do anything good in the movie.
A Good example recently was "Meet the Robinsons" where the boy is given chores and he has to try to fix the mess when he is irresponsible. Ultimately his parents discipline him and help him fix the problem. "Incredibles" is another; the children had independent personalities, but were firmly under their parents' authority. It was refreshing to see that, it's so rare.
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RE: Notice the change in modern children's picture books? - 10/26/2009 11:15:02 AM
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doinkdom
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In our local Sunday paper, the funnies, For Better Or Worse had a very appropriate strip for this thread.
Mom and kids are shopping and kids are nagging mom for this and for that, Mom's yelling "NO"...when finally Mom hands them all a dollar to buy something. The last frame reads something about consistency being overrun by keeping your sanity. IWO...giving in so the kids will stop hollering.
_____________________________
Thanksgiving dinners take eighteen hours to prepare.
They are consumed in twelve minutes.
Half-times take twelve minutes.
This is not coincidence.
~Erma Bombeck
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RE: Notice the change in modern children's picture books? - 10/26/2009 12:12:01 PM
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Auben
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That strip was first run in the '80s. And Tuck Everlasting (the novel) was published in 1975. I just don't see these as new concerns.
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RE: Notice the change in modern children's picture books? - 10/26/2009 12:44:09 PM
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garsyt
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Auben
That strip was first run in the '80s. And Tuck Everlasting (the novel) was published in 1975. I just don't see these as new concerns.
Exactly.
It's evident in books from even the late 60's like Maurice Sendek's book Where the Wild Things Are, or Ludwig Bemelmans's stories of Madeline which were written in the 30's and 40's. She was always very defiant of adult authority.
quote:
A few examples I've seen recently are Chicken Little and also Tuck Everlasting. In chicken Little, the father apologizes to his son for not trusting his judgment and disbelieving him. Several of us parents were complaining after the film: what kind of message is that? What was the moral anyway? The kid had made several mistakes already, basically the father was right to question him. The message seemed to be, kids are always right, parents should always support them or they dont love them.
I've not seen Tuck but I did read the book back in the 80's when I was a teen and I believe my own daughter has read it as well (she reads so much it's hard to keep up anymore).
AS for Chicken Little - so the kid made several mistakes - Don't all kids? And yes parents are right to question as well. But I believe we should also, if our children are adamant about something, as Chicken Little was, we should at least take the time to look into it, and give our kids the benefit of the doubt and yes apologize to them if we find out they were telling the truth all along. I guess I didn't come away with the feeling that the message was that the kids were always right.
Blessings,
Garsy
< Message edited by garsyt -- 10/26/2009 12:56:01 PM >
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