Mental Health Encouragement - One Stop Thread (Full Version)

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Fritzpw_Admin -> Mental Health Encouragement - One Stop Thread (10/21/2005 9:17:18 AM)

This thread is created in order to provide an area for users to encourage those who suffer from mental health related issues such as the following:

ADD, ADHD, Bi-Polar, Depression, etc.

Online Community should not be viewed as a replacement for the development of relationships with local people. Nor should it be considered an alternative to one getting medical or spiritual counseling.

Please do not start new discussions on topics that are mental health related.

Because of the nature of the topics that may take place in this thread and because certain individuals may not be equipped to discuss them in an appropriate manner we reserve the right to edit, restrict, or ban any individual for any reason at our sole discretion. We reserve the right to take that action without giving any reason for the decision.

Users who engage in this thread do so at their own risk and Salem Web Network can not be held liable for any consequences or responses made within the Community.

Members who use this thread in order to avoid obtaining professional help will be blocked from further participation until his/her counselor convinces Administration that his/her participation is beneficial to the overall treatment plan.



salos -> RE: Mental Health Issues - One Stop Thread (10/21/2005 4:26:08 PM)

This is a follow up to a thread on depression that was closed.

I'm becoming more and more convinced that depression has to do with feeling (or being) overwhelmed, rejected and/or intimidated. (This can in time create chemical imbalances which also need to be treated.) Being overwhelmed can come from lack of support or protection, from heavy duty life situations, and from lack of skill with dealing with problems. It can be exacerbated by lack of strengthening activities such as recreation, activities with friends, and community connections.

Recovery can be hard because many aspect of the person's life needs to be shored up or reestablished. It takes time, and it's frustrating, but it should not be embarrasing. Trust needs to be established in the person's life, for they often do not know if they can trust themselves or anyone else.



Giulia -> RE: Mental Health Issues - One Stop Thread (10/21/2005 7:41:22 PM)

I once suffered from depression and the best i have heard it defined is suppressed anger,for me it was a whole bunch of anger I didnt feel justified in releasing, anger which was selfish and unrighteous. I turned this anger inward and became indifferent ,complacent and full of apathy and feelings of indifference.Time in prayer screaming out loud in a field and involving myself in different activities has really helped me snap out of it heaps. I agree lack of support or protection can have some to do with it and lack of friends and activities also give one more time to dwell under this dark cloud,mostly for me I had to deal with my anger issues and spend lots of time seeking the Lord in prayer,He is able to dispell even the darkest clouds and lift you from the lowest of lows. When you are unable to trust yourself or trust anyone else He is there to trust and cling to and in His wings there is healing. Praise Jesus for He is able to heal wounds and clear the mind and bring wholeness to brokeness.



wiringlunatic -> RE: Mental Health Issues - One Stop Thread (10/22/2005 12:04:49 AM)

I went back to see how things were going on the ADD med thread and lo and behold it's gone (sob) Anyway for those who didn't read my post on that one, I'm the one who got things stirred up by saying that caffeine was a safe alternative to meds for ADD. I did say that it was virtually side effect free. I was severely upbraided for this statement, so I will retract it and just say far fewer and milder side effects than "the meds" (I was on Ritalin for a while -- nasty stuff) However, the mentioned side effects do not all apply to an ADD/ADHD person. At least in my situation, I doubt if insomnia or heart palpitations will ever be a problem. It not only focuses me, it relaxes me. The only possible danger I've encountered is when I use coffee instead of sugar-loaded soda (Mountain Dew is my "med" of choice) Without the sugar to temper it's effects, if I drink coffee at night and drive I do pose a danger to myself and other drivers as it can make me drowsy. ("No coffee for me, thanks. I'm driving!" lol) But that is the absolute truth! As for the osteoporosis, I don't know, I'm only 31. I don't consume large quantities unless it's a bad day (1-2 cans of MD per day usually) so I doubt I will have any long term effects from it. Beats being suicidal on Ritalin!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I'm thankful that God made me this way, I think very differently, and He gave me a way to cope when it gets out of hand.

Soli Deo Gloria



f860th -> RE: Mental Health Issues - One Stop Thread (10/22/2005 4:46:49 AM)

I've been trying Neurofeedback. I've been on Effexor for a couple years and it seems to help.

So far the Neurofeedback seems to be helping as well.



reptar -> RE: Mental Health Issues - One Stop Thread (10/22/2005 5:52:33 AM)

depression: built up anger or feelings of rejection..

i don't know, i just feel different from the way i used to be. sometimes i think i need to grow up and just deal. for whatever reason i'm resisting. i feel kind've dull and sad. when i'm by myself i'm ok, but when i'm around people who love me i feel very down and cry easily.
for me, i think it all boils down to trusting people. i have a cat that is constantly scared. i've had him 2 weeks and whenever i try to pet him he scurries away. he is scared of so many things and i wonder how people have treated him in the past. i think eventually he will come out of his shell and be a happier cat, but it will take time to build that trust with him.

i am not sure how to trust people again.. the last person i loved.. i think i was in shock for a long time over that and it is just hitting me. sometimes i think, well you can't put trust in people, it's all about God anyway. but i know by closing myself off to people i am missing out on everything.
given time, i think i'll come out of this ok. for me it isn't about medication. my heart has been kind've, broken.



stateofgrace -> RE: Mental Health Issues - One Stop Thread (10/22/2005 11:39:54 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: wiringlunatic

I went back to see how things were going on the ADD med thread and lo and behold it's gone (sob) Anyway for those who didn't read my post on that one, I'm the one who got things stirred up by saying that caffeine was a safe alternative to meds for ADD. I did say that it was virtually side effect free. I was severely upbraided for this statement, so I will retract it and just say far fewer and milder side effects than "the meds" (I was on Ritalin for a while -- nasty stuff)


well, since I was likely the one you referred to as "severely upbraiding" you...I'm glad you have at least clarified.

I have had insomnia from caffiene overconsumption and it is not pleasant. Insomnia can be a very serious thing to deal with over time. Not to mention...sleep disorders (including insomnia) can mimic some of the same symptoms as ADD, even causing kids with sleep disorders to be misdiagnosed as ADD.

Ritalin may have been nasty stuff for you, but others have been helped by using it. In my brother's case, some of his problems were likely caused by not monitoring the dosage closely enough.



sen10tious -> RE: Mental Health Issues - One Stop Thread (10/23/2005 7:22:29 PM)

For your thought and consideration...

On a closed thread, someone had said, "You cannot separate the mind/body as THEY are intertwined."
To support this, they quoted James F. Jones, M.D., a chronic fatigue expert with the U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention. "You really can't separate the brain and the body, because psychology is biology -- everything that takes place in the brain is chemical or electrical. You can't have the one without the other."

Hebrews 4:12 (KJV) For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any two-edged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart.

The careful reader will take note that in Dr. Jones' world of chemicals and electricity, the essential elements of humanity cannot be individually distilled; however, God's word is capable of achieving division of soul and spirit.



wiringlunatic -> RE: Mental Health Issues - One Stop Thread (10/23/2005 9:01:33 PM)

StateOfGrace- There was poor dosage monitoring in my case as well due to the school district telling the Dr to raise the dosage -- he doubled it w/o reexamining me or monitoring me.

I've seen misuse of these meds far too often. Also, people (Drs and parents) not following the prescribing info and taking them off it every so often to reobserve. Many parents and schools are far too eager to medicate kids so they don't disrupt things. I know not all parentd feel this way but I've seen too many laughing and saying "I couldn't stand them without the Ritalin" and similar things. These kids still have feelings. They may be groggy and disoriented depending on the dosage, but they still hear and feel. Many of them have poor self-image to start with and this makes it worse. Sorry to unload like this (my parents didn't say those things by the way, they didn't like me on it either -- it was the school) but this is a sensitive subject for me.

Soli Deo Gloria



Giulia -> RE: Mental Health Issues - One Stop Thread (10/23/2005 9:03:07 PM)

Much of the food we eat affects our mental state,I've lived through bipolar, depression ,delusions of all sorts and just like spiritual food affects our spiritual body so the physical food affects the physical body.These days we are exposed to all kinds of toxins and other quick fix poisons that may help the finances but do nothing for our physical and mental well being.Much of ADD is caused by overloads of sugar or not enouigh,bipolar I am coming to understand is very similar and I believe depression has also something to do with our food consumption. I am drug free and my spiritual walk is getting stronger and stronger and I have experienced healing in the mind and the spiritual overtakes the physical therefore healing starts to happen all over. I think definitiions of reality is something which is learned and impressed on us and sometimes works against our faith and spiritual reality.That is why it is good to surround yourself with faithfull people(if you can find them).



happydays -> RE: Mental Health Issues - One Stop Thread (10/23/2005 9:07:43 PM)

so conversations about depression, ADD, eating disorders, OCD, etc, are all supposed to go on in one thread? This could get confusing.[sm=icon_smile_boggled.gif]



evegirl22 -> RE: Mental Health Issues - One Stop Thread (10/24/2005 12:04:49 AM)

I know for myself that i suffer from Borderline Personality Disorder... which is a form of depression. Ive been there... done that.. you name it. Ive been on mediacations.... in the hospital and locked up for it... counseling... for myself... it doesnt really work. For others... it might be a solution What works for me.... is God. I do see a doctor and am on medication... but God is my true medication.

I could answer millions of questions... give a testimony on it. Just let me tell ya... If you love God... just know that He is on the dark and narrow path with ya... heling you along when you feel like you cant go on anymore.

In Christ
Jamie



stateofgrace -> RE: Mental Health Issues - One Stop Thread (10/24/2005 8:27:10 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: wiringlunatic

StateOfGrace- There was poor dosage monitoring in my case as well due to the school district telling the Dr to raise the dosage -- he doubled it w/o reexamining me or monitoring me.

I've seen misuse of these meds far too often. Also, people (Drs and parents) not following the prescribing info and taking them off it every so often to reobserve. Many parents and schools are far too eager to medicate kids so they don't disrupt things. I know not all parentd feel this way but I've seen too many laughing and saying "I couldn't stand them without the Ritalin" and similar things. These kids still have feelings. They may be groggy and disoriented depending on the dosage, but they still hear and feel. Many of them have poor self-image to start with and this makes it worse. Sorry to unload like this (my parents didn't say those things by the way, they didn't like me on it either -- it was the school) but this is a sensitive subject for me.

Soli Deo Gloria


Well, it's a sensitive subject for me too. As I stated earlier, I have a number of people with mental health conditions in my extended family, including several with ADD.

You have one perspective...one you share with my brother, and one that was exasperated by the fact that only one medication was likely available at the time you were being treated (which was the case with my brother), and in both cases, your medication dosage and side effects were not monitored closely enough. But there are other pespectives on this situation, and people who have been helped by the medication that is now available...like my husband.

Go to parenting and look at the thread there on natural alternatives for ADD...you'll find two posts from parents who state that the so-called natural alternatives didn't work for them, and in one case made their son's symptoms worse. Those natural alternatives are not carefully monitored by any governmental agency (even in an incomplete flawed manner), and therefore their advertised claims can be totally bogus....which is why I suggested to the parent looking that she go investigate sources like Daniel Amen, who have worked with both medication and supplements, and measured the ressults, and use different holistic combinations of treatment depending on the patient's specific symptoms and brain functioning.

I agree that kids who have ADD and other disorders may have self-image problems. Of course they do! They're "different' and they are often having problems at school, in their families and socially. I agree that it's important to not hurt these kids in how we behave towards them. What I don't agree with (and not saying this is coming from you) is the trend towards "sugar coating" the problem or only looking at the positives and not the challenges. I just don't believe its a realistic perspective on the challenges people with ADD face, and tends to be more of a self focus (as in, the world should adapt to ME instead of me adapting to the world).

We all have physical and/or mental challneges in our lives, it's a result of the fall. My younger daughter has Asthma, for example. As someone who has several people in my family dealing with mental health problems, I don't want to see these people ostracised but I believe it's acutally a disservice to them to be in denial about the impact of their challenges.



stateofgrace -> RE: Mental Health Issues - One Stop Thread (10/24/2005 8:36:10 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Julia55

Much of the food we eat affects our mental state,I've lived through bipolar, depression ,delusions of all sorts and just like spiritual food affects our spiritual body so the physical food affects the physical body.These days we are exposed to all kinds of toxins and other quick fix poisons that may help the finances but do nothing for our physical and mental well being.Much of ADD is caused by overloads of sugar or not enouigh,bipolar I am coming to understand is very similar and I believe depression has also something to do with our food consumption.



Julia, I'd like to see your sources to back up the idea that ADD is caused by overloads of sugar, and Bipolar as well.

It might be more accurate to say it could have an impact...and that blood sugar fluctuations along the lines of Diabetes does have an impact on mood and energy levels. But I know of no scientific evidence that overloads of sugar cause ADD or Bipolar.

In fact, the National Institute of Mental Health (part of NIH), states the following, citing several different research studies:

It has been suggested that attention disorders are caused by refined sugar or food additives, or that symptoms of ADHD are exacerbated by sugar or food additives. In 1982, the National Institutes of Health held a scientific consensus conference to discuss this issue. It was found that diet restrictions helped about 5 percent of children with ADHD, mostly young children who had food allergies.3 A more recent study on the effect of sugar on children, using sugar one day and a sugar substitute on alternate days, without parents, staff, or children knowing which substance was being used, showed no significant effects of the sugar on behavior or learning.4

In another study, children whose mothers felt they were sugar-sensitive were given aspartame as a substitute for sugar. Half the mothers were told their children were given sugar, half that their children were given aspartame. The mothers who thought their children had received sugar rated them as more hyperactive than the other children and were more critical of their behavior.5

Here's the link to the complete article, including the footnotes with the references to the studies cited.



agapetos -> RE: Mental Health Issues - One Stop Thread (10/24/2005 9:01:19 AM)

quote:

Much of ADD is caused by overloads of sugar or not enouigh,bipolar I am coming to understand is very similar and I believe depression has also something to do with our food consumption.
Many mental health problems can be aggrivated by what we eat/don't eat. But then so can other health issues.

Eliminated or greatly reducing carbs can cause depression or trigger manic episodes for one. High carb diets can aggrivate PCOS.

While the majority of people are aware that sugar and refined food is not good for us ~ many are unwilling to make the change citing cost or lack of time to prepare something from scratch.



stateofgrace -> RE: Mental Health Issues - One Stop Thread (10/24/2005 10:04:35 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: agapetos

Many mental health problems can be aggrivated by what we eat/don't eat. But then so can other health issues.

Eliminated or greatly reducing carbs can cause depression or trigger manic episodes for one. High carb diets can aggrivate PCOS.

While the majority of people are aware that sugar and refined food is not good for us ~ many are unwilling to make the change citing cost or lack of time to prepare something from scratch.


A lot of folks with Bipolar crave carbs (like my 16 yo daugther!). She craved carbs from the time she started solid foods in fact (not surprising in hindsight since she does appear to be one of the Early-Onset kids).

I think the key in what you posted is "trigger" -- sometimes what we eat can have an impact on "triggering" symptoms. That's different from being the cause of having a condition in the first place. And as far as ADD itself, it appears that sugar directly having the triggering effect is only in a small percentage of cases. It would be interesting to track these kids (both those for whom diet appears to be a trigger and those who it doesn't) in the long term to see which ones of them end up with problems concerning blood sugar/insulin, though...because of the physical effects of insulin resistance and diabetes.



Giulia -> RE: Mental Health Issues - One Stop Thread (10/24/2005 10:03:44 PM)

The only great studies i have is my own life experiences.Many studies have been exausted in the mental health field and by no means do they have all the answers. I know adults who have add and I had it myself and sugar consumption certainly affected my concentration span and focusing ability. I have also had bipolar and food has also affected some of my highs and lows. So I have no links for you stateofgrace but I do have a lifetime experience and I do have a perception and I perceive that for me the only medication that has ever worked for me is the Grace of god and His goodness. The more His light shines on me the more i get healed,I'm not that big on keeping up with the reaserch about mental health because it always changes and they are all learning too just like me. What we need is more people of faith and more miracles!



desert_rose -> RE: Mental Health Issues - One Stop Thread (10/24/2005 11:00:51 PM)

I'd love to see the research that says a bipolar can control their illness by reducing sugar and carbs. I've done all sorts of research into alternative treatments, all I ever find is that we should get high amounts of Omega 3, Omega 6, the B vitamins and perhaps magnesium. I can't find anything that tells me to eat less carbs or less sugar, other than stuff telling me how to (hopefully) not gain weight while on many of the common medications.

That said, I do know that one theory for the mechanism behind bipolar is that it may have something to do with an irregularity of a particular part of energy control/metabolism. However, there's not much research to prove or disprove the theory as far as I've found and there's at least a half dozen or so other theories that are also rather popular.

And just for the record, I cook from scratch, buy mostly organic food and strictly limit carbs and sugars. Guess what? It didn't cure my bipolar. But I lost weight and my husband has better diabetes control.



agapetos -> RE: Mental Health Issues - One Stop Thread (10/25/2005 5:41:37 AM)

womaninchrist ~ I will look for a link about carbs and bipolar ~ but if I didn't make it clear in my previous post a low carb diet may trigger manic episodes ~ and low carb diets may also cause depression ~ I know that I've become more stable since increasing my carb intake (though improving my diet) ~ and also, from improving my diet I've lost weight.

I eat whatever fruit and veg I like (I aim for at least 5 portions a day) and have carbs (potatoes, wholewheat bread, pasta, rice etc) a couple of times a day most days.



desert_rose -> RE: Mental Health Issues - One Stop Thread (10/25/2005 10:16:30 AM)

agapetos, I apologize if my post seemed harsh. I've just learned over time to hold out for research before placing any large bets on alternative treatments. I'm not saying alternative treatment doesn't work - I know it's worked better than meds for my metabolic things.

I will admit I've been burned a few times. I've somehow attracted a follower who thinks it's their duty in life to follow me from forum to forum for forum figuring out my names and shoving their preferred alternative treatments down my throat under the guise that "no one with half a brain would do anything else". Oddly enough, there's no research to back up the treatment they beyond a few personal testimonies - and you can't even get real info on how to practice the "cures" pushed without buying some very expensive books. I doubt this person would show up here though, or at least I'm hoping.

Then there are those that insist things like lithium cures bipolar, but only if you take Serenity(TM) or lithium orotate because the "natural verson" doesn't go toxic. Um, yeah, whatever. Or that if you'll just do the right version of prayer/meditation (which always varies based on the religion of the poster) you'll be cured of bipolar - or at the very least never see another episode as long as you continue the practices of prayer & meditation. Tried that and went way off the deep end. Trust me, it didn't work....I did learn a lot, but it didn't touch my bipolar.

Eating healthily DOES however, improve overall health and I can't imagine that's a bad thing for bipolar, depression or ADD/ADHD. Besides, in all honesty, we all should be eating correctly even if you're speaking of someone who doesn't have a health condition of any sort.



stateofgrace -> RE: Mental Health Issues - One Stop Thread (10/25/2005 12:23:59 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Julia55

The only great studies i have is my own life experiences.


As long as you understand that makes you a research study of *one* and not a study utilizing objective standards.



demolitionman -> RE: Mental Health Issues - One Stop Thread (10/25/2005 12:59:20 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: salos

This is a follow up to a thread on depression that was closed.

I'm becoming more and more convinced that depression has to do with feeling (or being) overwhelmed, rejected and/or intimidated. (This can in time create chemical imbalances which also need to be treated.) Being overwhelmed can come from lack of support or protection, from heavy duty life situations, and from lack of skill with dealing with problems. It can be exacerbated by lack of strengthening activities such as recreation, activities with friends, and community connections.

Recovery can be hard because many aspect of the person's life needs to be shored up or reestablished. It takes time, and it's frustrating, but it should not be embarrasing. Trust needs to be established in the person's life, for they often do not know if they can trust themselves or anyone else.

Salos,

I have to commend you for your insight into the problems of depression. I could not help but think of my mother's struggle was how much life had left her with an uneasiness. Thank you.



wiringlunatic -> RE: Mental Health Issues - One Stop Thread (10/25/2005 7:05:40 PM)

StaeOfGrace- I know that when I was younger sugar drastically affected my ADD/ADHD. HOWEVER, I am also hypoglycemic (low blood sugar.) I processed sugar so fast that consuming it would cause hyperactivity. I don't notice that much anymore, but if my sugar goes low, I can get dioriented and/or depressed. Also, I've known children that had food allergies such as red food dye that were much worse when they consumed it. Certain high starch/sugar foods such as corn, grapes, orange juice, etc. also effected me. Again, I've grown out of that. I also believe that many cases of ADD/ADHD are actually misdiagnosed food allergies, hypoglycemia, or other learning disorders. That's not research, just observation. My son is not a true ADD/ADHD, but he does have some learning disabilities, and they are much worse if he drinks milk from the store. We buy milk from a dairy that is hormone-free. That makes a huge difference. He has a lot of trouble focusing and concentrating if he is on the other milk. It's like he can't understand what you are saying.
Julia55- I would be interested in what you have found to be the foods that may affect depression. My wife suffers from this, and anything that may help and won't hurt (such as diet changes) is worth a try. The meds she is on help a lot, but at times it is beyond that.
Thanks for listening folks -- I guess I'm not as wierd as I thought -- I just had never met anyone else like me.

Soli Deo Gloria



Giulia -> RE: Mental Health Issues - One Stop Thread (10/26/2005 2:44:22 AM)

stteofgrace I'm glad Im no reaserch study,that would be tough! We are called to bear witness to our walk and healing and that is what I'm doing,if through my past experiences I am able to help someone then I'm glad and God would also be glad.
With depression there is a site for liver cleansing and it is recomended we do this twice a year and there are all types of symptoms that go along with a blocked up liver,it involves olive oil epsoms salts and grapefruit,its pretty yuk but it works well only you need to stay at home whilst doing it because it goes right through you. Just do a google search for liver cleans and they can tell you more. I found that with changing my diet(I eat organic, rye bread, no dairy,goats milk) and doing more activities and spending time in prayer,a dark cloud was lifted from me and I now feel quite good. When I train and get into the "zone" I just get these fits of laughter,which also is a great cure for depression and altogether i am totally cured! Halleluya!Glory to God! And if you still have a hard time have you tried somebody else lay hands on you? The bible says to lay hands on the sick and anoint them with oil,I was troubled and tortured mentally for a while and was sety free through someones prayer.



agapetos -> RE: Mental Health Issues - One Stop Thread (10/26/2005 11:32:52 AM)

quote:

Then there are those that insist things like lithium cures bipolar
To date there is no cure for bipolar (short of God's healing), only treatment. As you mentioned, a healthy diet will help no end with the treatment. I have a lot of reservations about controlled carb diets.

quote:

With depression there is a site for liver cleansing and it is recomended we do this twice a year and there are all types of symptoms that go along with a blocked up liver,it involves olive oil epsoms salts and grapefruit,its pretty yuk but it works well only you need to stay at home whilst doing it because it goes right through you.
Probably not a good idea for people who are on medication ~ if the stuff used to 'cleanse' your liver goes straight through you then chances are it will take your meds with it too ~ whatever they are ~ could be a bad thing some.



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