I’m trying to understand what you think you’ve said that might be controversial, or a reason for your post to be flagged or in some way offensive or unacceptable?
Mr.E
Me too, but this is just me trying to walk in, and not war against, “The Spirit of Truth”. There is a thin boundry line in the forum arena that I am just now learning how to not cross. I am not very good at it yet, so I am trying to submit to authority, to be both honest and frank, and to speak the truth in love. Sometimes in my blindness I still step on others toes. That is not my intent.
I feel like the proverbial old lady who, when learning to drive, was told a STOP sign meant the driver had to come to a complete stop. After driving a while she found out that others do not think of that sign in the same way. Once she crossed the line and suggested to another driver that he look up the traffic regulations pertaining to stop signs. The other driver called the police and the police told the lady she could be cited for causing a public disturbance. She wasn’t cited, but now she just blows her horn at every stop sign to avoid a colission with other drivers who have a difference of opinion on traffic rules.
I’m not a legalist, but I do try to walk in God’s spirit, speak the truth in Love (i.e. in the best interest of others as I percieve it), and insofar as is in me, to “…be subject to rulers and authorities, to obey, to be ready for every good work, to speak evil of no one, to be peaceable, gentle, showing all humility to all men.” Titus 3:1-2 (NKJV)
i.e. Not waring against The Spirit of Truth.
I’m still curious about your actual intent. Saying that it’s not your intent to step on toes, doesn’t quite explain what it was you felt the need to include a preemptive apology for. Can you just answer the question honestly? You obviously felt that you were saying something likely to offend-- was it this, below?
Mr.E
You said:
I hope you really meant, "Can you help me understand why you wrote that more directly”, or “can you offer any more information to clarify what you were thinking”. I say that because of two things. (1) You didn’t really ask a question (even though you provided a question mark at the end), and (2) I did answer honestly; I will always speak to you honestly.
“Honestly” I don’t always know what will offend someone. If you want to PM me, I will offer more to you personally. I am walking in The Spirit of Truth by taking James’s advice to be “quick to hear and slow to speak”. Likewise, Solomon reminds me “In the multitude of words sin is not lacking, but he who restrains his lips is wise.” Proverbs 10:19, AND “Even a fool is counted wise when he holds his peace; When he shuts his lips, he is considered perceptive. Proverbs 17:28. There are other similar admonishments in The Bible but I’m trying to say less. I have no gift for concision.
What precipitated my comment is not really important. I think what is important that I learned my lesson.
The question mark might have been a clue. I guess I could have been more clear and wrote:
I’m trying to understand what you think you’ve said that might be controversial, or (is there) a reason for your post to be flagged or in some way offensive or unacceptable?
Is the framing of the question, really the problem? Or is this mere and more deflection and obfuscation in an avoidance of what was clearly a question? Since there can be no question in that you are always honest. I didn’t ask anything about what might have precipitated your comment. I was inquiring specifically about your comment. I’ll tell you how it reads to me>>>
‘God, I thank you that I am not like other people: extortionists, unrighteous people, adulterers—or even like this tax collector.’
Mr.E.
Wow, those are some interesting observations. I’m going to have to think about this a while.
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You lay out a bit of a false dichotomy---- “If one accepts”… as opposed to “If one does not accept” --as if a person must choose “which boat to get in.” Then you proceed to denigrate those folks you claim to “understand” and advise them to ignore the rest of your post-- as if then, the words of scripture have no meaning or purpose in their lives beyond your attempted chastisement.
But rather than ignoring your post, I chose to address it.
Do you then claim as innerrent, every word, and promise and premise of “inspired” scripture-- without filters— unassailable, unreproachable offerings–? …as you understand them, of course.
Because that’s what you are saying. That you understand them and present them as “the final authority” -and not merely your flawed opinion.
Mr.E
I’ll try to respond in The Spirit of Truth.
No, sorry, I was just being playful. Sorry you didn’t understand that way. I did understand what you were “asking”, and I did try to respond politely.
Asked and anwered. As you can see, I was correct that my previous comments COULD be offensive, demonstrated in the observation that you WERE obviously offended. For that I am sorry; that was not my intention.
I was trying to avert that very possibility by suggesting that any who do not recieve the Bible as authoratative will only read my comments as my “flawed opinion”. I agree with you, my “flawed opinion” should be ignored. However, God’s opinion should not. If one can recieve The Bible as God’s opinion, then the Bbile references that I was sharing would be beneficial to them. If they are in the other boat, than my flawed opinion would probably not be beneficial. You yourself have said as much.
The Apostle John, (the disciple who Jesus loved) boldly said:
We are of God. He who knows God hears us; he who is not of God does not hear us. By this we know the spirit of truth and the spirit of error.
1 John 4:6 (NKJV)
Again, I apologize for offending you. I am trying (in my flawed way) to walk in God’s Spirit; I am trying to "Be of the same mind toward one another. Do not set your mind on high things, but associate with the humble. To not be wise in my own opinion. To repay no one evil for evil. To have regard for good things in the sight of all men. And, If it is possible, as much as depends on me, to live peaceably with all men. Romans 12:16-18
Peace be with you
KP
I’m not offended in the least. I’m glad you recognize the possibility of flawed opinion. And God’s word is His word. You should also recognize that you might have a flawed opinion about His word. No?
And that’s the point. Christians have varied opinions about all kinds of understandings of God’s word. It’s why there are hundreds, or thousands of denominations. You might humbly consider that. Your opinion is just one of many. You don’t get to dictate to others. You can argue and press your points, but you are not an arbiter of truth.
In your “If you agree/If you don’t agree” post, you set yourself up on some sort of DIY pedestal and represent yourself as a better caliber of Christian- if agreed with, versus those that would dare not. I don’t see God’s word as His opinion, but I do see your words as your opinion about God’s word. You should see that too. It doesn’t make me less of a Christian because I disagree with you. And you don’t get a merit badge for your stance.
Amen and amen.
Moving on.
Too many statements to respond to them individually, but just let me say I hear you and I agree with most of what you said. I likewise appreciate your last statement “Moving On”. Sounds like a wise decision. Thanks for your input, I’ll continue to think about what you said.
KP
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@Tillman, how do you view the clear teachings and commands of Scripture as well as Joseph’s example:
Mat 15:19 For out of the heart come evil thoughts, murder, adultery, sexual immorality, theft, false witness, slander.
Mat 15:20 These are what defile a person. But to eat with unwashed hands does not defile anyone.”
Rom_13:13 Let us walk properly as in the daytime, not in orgies and drunkenness, not in sexual immorality and sensuality, not in quarreling and jealousy.
1Co_6:18 Flee from sexual immorality. Every other sin a person commits is outside the body, but the sexually immoral person sins against his own body.
Gen 39:7 And after a time his master’s wife cast her eyes on Joseph and said, “Lie with me.”
Gen 39:8 But he refused and said to his master’s wife, “Behold, because of me my master has no concern about anything in the house, and he has put everything that he has in my charge.
Gen 39:9 He is not greater in this house than I am, nor has he kept back anything from me except you, because you are his wife. How then can I do this great wickedness and sin against God?”
Gen 39:10 And as she spoke to Joseph day after day, he would not listen to her, to lie beside her or to be with her.
Gen 39:11 But one day, when he went into the house to do his work and none of the men of the house was there in the house,
Gen 39:12 she caught him by his garment, saying, “Lie with me.” But he left his garment in her hand and fled and got out of the house.
Isn’t it biblical for parents to recommend abstinence from sex for their children and the need to pray for God to give them the quality of self-control?
For argument sake, can you explain to me what makes a sin a sin? That list in Mathew- slander, false witness, murder, theft, adultery. Bare with me, but can you explain how each one of these is specifically a sin? And take a second to do so?
I just started a new thread. Let’s move this discussion there.
Maybe I already answered this question, @Tillman, but those sins and their inner desires all emanate from our self-centered sinful natures, over which we can gain victory through Jesus’ power released from his death and resurrection.
God has given me that triumph from the lust and anger that can produce adultery and murder, though God kept me from such actions, thankfully. He used his Word and my persistent prayers to accomplish those changes. All the credit goes to him.
Lets keep it in the sin discussion as not to take over this one
What new thread did you start, @Tillman?