Do we have to support the state of Israel?

General Faith
1

Should Christians support Zionism and the State of Israel ?

2

Christians should make decisions based upon how they see the truth and justice in that situation.

The state of Israel is a man made state that is anti God.

It is a secular state and the Israel of the bible is a state that actively promotes the worship of God.

So you may support Israel based upon your political views, you may even support it because of how you interpret scripture.

But there are only two types of people. Christian or non Christian.

Salvation is based upon ones faith, not ones ethnic group. Even Jews Must believe in Jesus if they are to be saved.

2 Likes
3

They aren’t anti God. They have always served the true living God-YHVH(Jehovah) Just not always the way he requires. He requires one accept Jesus as the Messiah and obey him. They have outright refused since Jesus’ days on Earth down to this day. But they still know 100% God is a single being, not a trinity.

4

This would be the only thing I disagree with. The Jews are now, and always will be God’s chosen people. Israel was formed in one day, as a fulfillment of prophecy. As we know it today? The exact location and construction sequence of Jerusalem’s nine suburbs were predicted by Jeremiah about 2600 years ago.

"Behold, the days are coming, declares the Lord, when the city shall be rebuilt for the Lord from the Tower of Hananel to the Corner Gate. And the measuring line shall go out farther, straight to the hill Gareb, and shall then turn to Goah. The whole valley of the dead bodies and the ashes, and all the fields as far as the brook Kidron, to the corner of the Horse Gate toward the east, shall be sacred to the Lord. It shall not be plucked up or overthrown anymore forever.” Jeremiah 31:38-40

Ezekiel 37:21-22 declares this

“Then say to them, Thus says the Lord God: Behold, I will take the people of Israel from the nations among which they have gone, and will gather them from all around, and bring them to their own land. And I will make them one nation in the land, on the mountains of Israel. And one king shall be king over them all, and they shall be no longer two nations, and no longer divided into two kingdoms.”

Isaiah 66:7-8 describes this taking place in one day.

“Before she was in labor, she gave birth; before her pain came upon her, she delivered a son. Who has heard such a thing? Who has seen such things? Shall a land be born in one day? Shall a nation be brought forth in one moment? For as soon as Zion was in labor, she brought forth her children.”

This rebirth became history in 1948, in one day, and the construction of the nine suburbs proceeded precisely at the locations and in the sequence predicted.

However, is it true that they would still, as individuals, accept Jesus to be saved? Of course, that is God’s plan. Then, of course, you do have this.

“I will bless those who bless you, and him who dishonors you I will curse, and in you all the families of the earth shall be blessed.” Genesis 12:3

Peter

1 Like
5

Jesus says the opposite-Matt 23:38-39) guess who is correct? 38)Your house is abandoned to you= Israel religion is cut off of being Gods chosen.

6

Read Romans 9. Thanks brother.

J.

2 Likes
7

I think you may have misinterpreted this. Let’s talk about it.

"O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, the city that kills the prophets and stones those who are sent to it! How often would I have gathered your children together as a hen gathers her brood under her wings, and you were not willing!” Mat 23:37

Jesus is not saying that they are no longer God’s chosen people. God is not finished with Israel. God’s promises to Abraham and David were “unconditional,” meaning they don’t depend on Israel’s behavior, but on God’s word.

“I ask, then, has God rejected his people? By no means! For I myself am an Israelite, a descendant of Abraham, a member of the tribe of Benjamin. God has not rejected his people whom he foreknew.

Do you not know what the Scripture says of Elijah, how he appeals to God against Israel? “Lord, they have killed your prophets, they have demolished your altars, and I alone am left, and they seek my life.” But what is God’s reply to him? “I have kept for myself seven thousand men who have not bowed the knee to Baal.” Romans 11:1-4

You also have the fact that Jesus did not come for us. But the Jews only. It was only through their rejection that we were allowed to be grafted in. God didn’t “forsake” his people, but rather expanded the definition of who they are.

“Lord, they have killed your prophets, they have demolished your altars, and I alone am left, and they seek my life.” But what is God’s reply to him? “I have kept for myself seven thousand men who have not bowed the knee to Baal.” Romans 11:3-4

We benefited where they failed.

“So I ask, did they stumble so that they might fall? By no means! Rather, through their trespass, salvation has come to the Gentiles, so as to make Israel jealous. Now if their trespass means riches for the world, and if their failure means riches for the Gentiles, how much more will their full inclusion mean!” Romans 11:11-12

Remember, we still have the Tribulation, where 144,000 Jews will be saved. No, my friend. Israel is still God’s chosen; we are just fortunate to be adopted with them.

Peter

2 Likes
8

This is an anecdotal observation, but Prez Bush Sr. had a 93% approval rating coming into election year; he turned his back on Israel and epically lost. Trump has faced half of the US and an entire corrupt deep state onslaught of epic proportions against him, yet he kept a 30-year-old promise to Israel and still has his finger on the ‘Diet Coke’ button.

9

Spiritual Israel is now Gods chosen, it includes gentiles.

2 Likes
10

the stats show that Israel is a secular non religious state see:-

May I also suggest you read what God said about an idolitorous Israel and Judah in the OT.

13Bring your worthless offerings no more; your incense is detestable to Me—your New Moons, Sabbaths, and convocations. I cannot endure iniquity in a solemn assembly. 14I hate your New Moons and your appointed feasts. They have become a burden to Me; I am weary of bearing them. 15When you spread out your hands in prayer, I will hide My eyes from you; even though you multiply your prayers, I will not listen. Your hands are covered with blood.


Berean Standard Bible · Download

Cross References

Amos 5:21
“I hate, I despise your feasts! I cannot stand the stench of your solemn assemblies.

Hosea 2:11
I will put an end to all her exultation: her feasts, New Moons, and Sabbaths—all her appointed feasts.

Malachi 1:10
“Oh, that one of you would shut the temple doors, so that you would no longer kindle useless fires on My altar! I take no pleasure in you,” says the LORD of Hosts, “and I will accept no offering from your hands.

Jeremiah 6:20
What use to Me is frankincense from Sheba or sweet cane from a distant land? Your burnt offerings are not acceptable; your sacrifices do not please Me.”

Micah 6:6-8
With what shall I come before the LORD when I bow before the God on high? Should I come to Him with burnt offerings, with year-old calves? / Would the LORD be pleased with thousands of rams, with ten thousand rivers of oil? Shall I present my firstborn for my transgression, the fruit of my body for the sin of my soul? / He has shown you, O man, what is good. And what does the LORD require of you but to act justly, to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God?

Psalm 50:7-14
“Hear, O My people, and I will speak, O Israel, and I will testify against you: I am God, your God. / I do not rebuke you for your sacrifices, and your burnt offerings are ever before Me. / I have no need for a bull from your stall or goats from your pens, 


Proverbs 21:27
The sacrifice of the wicked is detestable—how much more so when brought with ill intent!

Isaiah 66:3
Whoever slaughters an ox is like one who slays a man; whoever sacrifices a lamb is like one who breaks a dog’s neck; whoever presents a grain offering is like one who offers pig’s blood; whoever offers frankincense is like one who blesses an idol. Indeed, they have chosen their own ways and delighted in their abominations.

Isaiah 29:13
Therefore the Lord said: “These people draw near to Me with their mouths and honor Me with their lips, but their hearts are far from Me. Their worship of Me is but rules taught by men.

Isaiah 58:3-5
“Why have we fasted, and You have not seen? Why have we humbled ourselves, and You have not noticed?” “Behold, on the day of your fast, you do as you please, and you oppress all your workers. / You fast with contention and strife to strike viciously with your fist. You cannot fast as you do today and have your voice be heard on high. / Is this the fast I have chosen: a day for a man to deny himself, to bow his head like a reed, and to spread out sackcloth and ashes? Will you call this a fast and a day acceptable to the LORD?

Matthew 15:8-9
‘These people honor Me with their lips, but their hearts are far from Me. / They worship Me in vain; they teach as doctrine the precepts of men.’”

God wants people who will serve him, not their traditions etc.

11

Sadly, you are correct. The are a stiff neck and rebellious people. Have been for a very long time. When Moses was on the mountain following God, saving them and bringing them out of Egypt, they forsake God and made a Golden Calf.

God gave them the Law, but they ignored or forgot it time and time again. The Prophets. They killed them. Finnally Jesus came to save them. They rejected and killed them. Remember this story that Jesus told?

"Hear another parable. There was a master of a house who planted a vineyard and put a fence around it, and dug a winepress in it and built a tower and leased it to tenants, and went into another country. When the season for fruit drew near, he sent his servants to the tenants to get his fruit. And the tenants took his servants and beat one, killed another, and stoned another. Again, he sent other servants, more than the first. And they did the same to them.

Finally, he sent his son to them, saying, ‘They will respect my son.’ But when the tenants saw the son, they said to themselves, ‘This is the heir. Come, let us kill him and have his inheritance.’ And they took him and threw him out of the vineyard and killed him. Matthew 21:33-39

Jesus tried to tell them this was going to happen. It did, of course. Israel has been enslaved, invaded, destroyed, and scattered. Yet God never left them. He never forsaken them. He is always there to forgive them and bring them back.

Yes, we now have that authority and that grace to be grafted in. Now there is no difference between them and us. This does not mean that God gave up on them, just that He allowed us in. Israel still has a large part to play in the end times. Remember, this will be where the New Jerusalem comes, and God will live with us there.

Peter

12

Here are a couple of articles on that topic:

13

Note God’s forgiveness is always conditional on repentance.see

2 Cronicles7:**12 **the Lord appeared to him at night and said:

“I have heard your prayer and have chosen this place for myself as a temple for sacrifices.

13 “When I shut up the heavens so that there is no rain, or command locusts to devour the land or send a plague among my people, **14 **if my people, who are called by my name, will humble themselves and pray and seek my face and turn from their wicked ways, then I will hear from heaven, and I will forgive their sin and will heal their land.

Actually there is an enormous difference.

We are his adopted sons with the privilege of immediate access to our Heavenly Father.

They are a chosen people who reject his offer of forgiveness an admission into his family.

Even Paul, a Hebrew of the Hebrews called himself in 1 Tim1:**13 **Even though I was once a blasphemer and a persecutor and a violent man, I was shown mercy because I acted in ignorance and unbelief. **14 **The grace of our Lord was poured out on me abundantly, along with the faith and love that are in Christ Jesus..

There is grace and mercy for Israel, but they have to accept Jesus.

14

Jesus told the Israelite spiritual leaders off at Matthew 23. He said they were misleading all listening to them to not enter Gods kingdom. He assured them the religion was cut off of being Gods chosen( Matt 23:38)– He said they must bless him ( Matt 23:39) in order to be restored–to this day they outright refuse. Spiritual Israel is now Gods chosen= any Israelite who joins Jesus’ 1 religion and gentiles. Jesus does not have hundreds of religions he has 1=1Cor 1:10)= Unity of thought( all of Gods truth) no division. He as well told those spiritual leaders-your Father is the devil, thus remains true to this day.

15

Are you A JW? Just wondering :thinking:

16

I am studying to be a JW. I have studied both sides carefully. The teachings of Jesus in every translation on Earth back the JW teachers.

17

Absolutely not. There are so many things that JW gets wrong. Nature of Jesus: They believe Jesus is not God incarnate, but rather a created being, specifically Michael the Archangel, being the biggest one. Rejection of the Trinity: Jehovah’s Witnesses believe only the Father (Jehovah) is God, viewing the Holy Spirit as an impersonal force rather than a person.

Rejection of the Cross: They consider the cross a pagan symbol, not a Christian one.
Salvation by Works: They believe salvation is not by grace alone, but requires obedience to the Watchtower organization and missionary work.

Hell and Soul: They do not believe in an eternal, conscious hell or an immortal soul, teaching that the dead are “asleep” and the wicked are destroyed.

Identity of True Worship: They teach that mainstream Christianity is a false religion (often referred to as “Babylon the Great”).

Literal 144,000: They believe only 144,000 people go to heaven, while others deemed faithful will live on a restored Earth.

I could go one. But most understand that it is NOT a Christian religion. That is why they must use their own translation, the New World Translation of the Holy Scriptures, which has been altered to support their specific doctrines.

Never confuse Religion with Salvation. They are two totally different things.

Peter