The country has changed ideologically and that is a threat to Christianity

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For a long time since the founding of the U.S., this country has been ideologically liberal. Then there were liberals who wanted to conserve older liberal things and they became conservative. Most of them were Christian or got their morality from Christianity. The country is no longer liberal like the founders. It has progressed. Unfortunately it has progressed in many bad ways. Now there are people who are called progressives. They are not liberal like the founders. They are not classical liberal like majority of the country for a lot of its existence. They are extreme in their liberalism to the point feelings, desires, wants, autonomy, collective autonomy and power, trump reality. To point that these things trump truth, real science and morality.

Many liberals believe some of the same things rhe progressives believe so they follow them or agree with them. But progressives are different. Its many of the progressives that have changed the country. Now many of them are becoming like Marxist, Communist, and Socialist. All of this is opening a door for some Muslims to become Jihadist. Many Muslims become Jihadist once the have enough power.

This is the problem. The public in general sees this but doesnt know what they are seeing. Right now they are coming after some groups of people they deem oppressors. But it is possible based on Christianity being one of their oppressors that they will come after Christianity soon. A few do it now. In other western world countries, they already have started coming after Christianity more like in Canada with Bill C-9.

As Christians we still have the ability to vote. We still have the ability to tell other people what is going on. We still have the ability to try keep things the way they are for the sake of avoiding unnecessary persecution.

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Your post reminded me that most of the world is mired in powerless religion one way or another. Here in the UK, and in the Republic of Ireland, what passes for Christianity has been around for a very, very long time. It bears little resemblance to the pattern of sound teaching we should hold on to and the faith we should contend for.

Ecclesiastical religion, and Christianised lip service from those in public life, are a far cry from the transforming faith that produces godly people who will suffer persecution. Those who walk with Christ are called to be a marginalised minority. Makes you think, doesn’t it…

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Jas 4:4 Ye adulterers and adulteresses, know ye not that the friendship of the world is enmity with God? whosoever therefore will be a friend of the world is the enemy of God.

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Could it be that there is persecution that Christians cannot avoid and there is persecution that Christians can avoid?

The one Christians can avoid is the one they bring on themselves and the one they have the ability to avoid by taking action. Even it just means telling other people things and voting.
(Some people might say the one brought on themselves is not persecution)

Ultimately Jesus is our Savior but there are things we can do sometimes.

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Paul repeatedly teaches that suffering and persecution are not exceptions to the Christian life but are normal aspects of union with Christ.

  1. Romans 5:3–5

“Not only that, but we rejoice in our sufferings, knowing that suffering produces endurance…” (ESV)

Greek words:

θλῖψις (thlipsis) = affliction, tribulation, pressure, distress.
θλίψεσιν (thlipsesin) = “sufferings/tribulations” (dative plural).

Paul teaches that tribulation is used by God to produce Christian maturity.

  1. Romans 8:17

“Provided we suffer with him in order that we may also be glorified with him.”

Greek word:

συμπάσχομεν (sympaschomen) = “we suffer together with.”
σύν (syn) = with
πάσχω (paschō) = suffer

The believer’s suffering is participation in Christ’s sufferings.

2 Timothy 3:12:

2Ti 3:10 But thou hast fully known my doctrine, manner of life, purpose, faith, longsuffering, charity, patience,
2Ti 3:11 Persecutions, afflictions, which came unto me at Antioch, at Iconium, at Lystra; what persecutions I endured: but out of them all the Lord delivered me.
2Ti 3:12 Yea, and all that will live godly in Christ Jesus shall suffer persecution.
2Ti 3:13 But evil men and seducers shall wax worse and worse, deceiving, and being deceived.

Paul does not say:

“Some believers will be persecuted.”
“Only apostles will be persecuted.”
“Only believers in certain countries will be persecuted.”

He says πάντες (all) who desire to live εὐσεβῶς (godly lives) in Christ Jesus will be persecuted (διωχθήσονται).

The future indicative makes this an expectation rather than a mere possibility. The form of persecution may vary, ridicule, exclusion, slander, discrimination, opposition, or physical suffering, but Paul presents opposition from the world as a normal consequence of faithful Christian living.

This aligns with other Pauline texts:

Philippians 1:29 — “For it has been granted to you that for the sake of Christ you should not only believe in him but also suffer for his sake.”

1 Thessalonians 3:3–4 — “For you yourselves know that we are destined for this.”

Romans 8:17 — “provided we suffer with him in order that we may also be glorified with him.”

2 Thessalonians 1:4 — Paul commends believers for their endurance “in all your persecutions and in the afflictions that you are enduring.”

Paul’s point is not that every Christian will experience the same intensity of persecution, but that genuine godliness in union with Christ inevitably brings some form of opposition from a world that is hostile to God. As our Lord taught:

“If the world hates you, know that it has hated me before it hated you.” — John 15:18 (ESV)

J.

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Wow. I just posted this Here “God is the same yesterday, today, and forevermore. If you find yourself offended by the Word of God, it is YOU that you need to reexamine. Not God. Remember, when you remove God, something ALWAYS takes His place.”
Peter

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It is certainly a possibility that some Christian speech could be criminalized in the not-so-distant future, here in the United States. Many call it “hate speech” when you quote what God said about homosexuality.

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@timf

People try to build a Godly nation but all they do is yoke themselves to the world and make the church more ungodly. As God said, come out from among them and be separate.

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Very good thread. In secular terms I see 3 factions battling it out for control, progressives, Islam and patriots. The progressives are reminicent of Isaiah, calling good evil and sweet sour. Islam is a direct denial of Jesus Christ God the Son, risen and ascended. Patriots are mostly traditional British culture with nominal Christianity alluded to.

Scripturally I see it all as increasing lawlessness.

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I think the patriots are the good guys.

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Dont forget us in the UK, we now have no go areas where it is illegal to pray silently in one’s head.

We have laws where what happens is determined by whether someone gets offended or not… hence the most disaffected get to dictate.

I am reminded that in Romans we as Christians are told to obey the authorities in civil matters, but in Acts the believers were told not to preach the gospel but they went out and preached it even more bodly.

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Undoubtedly the Patriots in the UK are the good guys of the three, but more about British history than Christ, and indeed the progressives and Islam, whose ideologies couldnt be more apart are currently joining forces… a spritual warning there.

Also in secular terms many are now seeing George Orwell’s 1984 coming true, especially with so many of the government being Fabian members it seems.

So many gods.

Christians must ask themselves once again, could this be end times?

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The sad truth is, it is coming here. Like him or hate him, the only reason it slowed down- the only reason Pride Month, Transgender nonsense, and all the attacks on Christianity have slowed down- is President Trump.

Factions representing progressivism, traditionalism/nationalism, and religious systems are actively competing for cultural dominance in Western nations. Scripture consistently warns Christians against mistaking political or nationalistic movements for the Kingdom of God. While a Christian may prefer laws that align with traditional morals, patriots are not inherently synonymous with the Body of Christ.

National identity and nominal Christianity can preserve order, but they cannot save souls. As Jesus stated in John 18:36,

“Jesus answered, ‘My kingdom is not of this world. If my kingdom were of this world, my servants would have been fighting, that I might not be delivered over to the Jews. But my kingdom is not from the world."

I find your reference to “silent prayer” restrictions in designated zones around UK healthcare facilities disturbing. However, this illustrates where civic law and religious freedom collide, creating a clear boundary line where believers defer to divine authority over secular decrees.

Scripture indicates that near the end of the age, seemingly opposing worldly forces will unite in their shared opposition to divine truth (Psalm 2:2; Revelation 17:13). Lawlessness (Anomia):

In 2 Thessalonians 2:7, Paul speaks of the “mystery of lawlessness” already at work, characterized by truth being inverted (calling good evil and evil good, per Isaiah 5:20).

“Could This Be the End Times?” Jesus encouraged us to discern the “signs of the times” (Matthew 16:3) while simultaneously remaining vigilant without falling into date-setting hysteria (Matthew 24:42). Worldly political collapse, ideological totalitarianism, and the erosion of freedom serve as reminder calls for the Church to maintain its witness as “salt and light” (Matthew 5:13–14), prioritizing gospel proclamation over cultural warfare.

My 2 cents. Be blessed.
Peter

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I haven’t been studying the UK but I do hear some distressing things, like the things you mentioned. God and Jesus are our bosses. We have to obey them before we obey the authorities.

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We need to keep Republicans in the White House, and it certainly would help if the Republicans could control the House and Senate.

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