In John 5:19 Jesus says,
“Very truly I tell you, the Son can do nothing by himself; he can do only what he sees his Father doing, because whatever the Father does the Son also does.” NIV
What is your understanding of this verse? Was it Jesus who did the miracles and healings or was it the Father who did the miracles and healings? Perhaps you have a different answer.
I’m afraid that this may take us back to a previous debate; however, I will do my best to share what I think on this matter. I do see God the Father, Jesus the Son, and the Holy Spirit, being one in the same. I understand some see this differently, so I guess I can give two perspectives.
First, if they are separate, God first, then Jesus was created, then we read this.
“And it came to pass in those days, that Jesus came from Nazareth of Galilee, and was baptized of John in Jordan. And straightway coming up out of the water, he saw the heavens opened, and the Spirit like a dove descending upon him: And there came a voice from heaven, [saying], Thou art my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased.” Mark 1:9-11
Jesus’s first recorded miracle, turning water into wine at the wedding in Cana, happened after his baptism by John the Baptist, signifying the start of his public ministry and the revelation of his divine glory to his disciples.
This perspective would indicate that it was the Holy Spirit working all the miracles. As when Jesus anointed the Disciples to work miracles, He imparted to them the Holy Spirit, so again?
Yet I see all as one, with differing roles and or times to operate, but they are all one. Therefore, to answer the question you posed, I would say yes. It was God, Jesus, and the Holy Spirit, and still is, doing the will of God here on earth.
Peter
I’m new to the site and to chat in general. I’m having a few problems navigating the site and thanks for letting me know this topic has already been discussed. I do have thoughts on the subject. Just thoughts and I could be wrong.
I know that Jesus is called the second Adam and that makes me think of the first Adam. Before he sinned, the relationship between God and Adam was something beautiful that doesn’t exist today. Adam is called a son of God in Luke because he is a direct creation of God. They conversed together and walked together. This is how it was meant to be. This closeness in relationship. God working through Adam and Adam living through God. I think Jesus came to restore that by becoming the second Adam.
As a man, everything Jesus did was done by God working through Him. He said the Father was in Him and He was in the Father, and He who’s seen me, has seen the Father. It was a relationship that was in the beginning when God created Adam and Jesus came to make it so again. And it will be so. Right now we have the Holy Spirit as a deposit guaranteeing what will come.
It’s hard to understand and to explain. There was a separation between Father and Son and yet there wasn’t. They were one and the same, and yet they weren’t. We don’t have anything like that in our experience today to compare it to. John says that we will be like Jesus when He returns. 1 John 3:2 We’ll be in Him as He is in us which is true today but then, more so. Quite the mystery!
Are you implying Jesus didn’t exist before He was born?
No, not at all. Not sure how you saw that in my post. I’ll try to be more careful with my words.
I am new to this website. I tried to respond to Peter. He said, “when Jesus was created”.
lol. I’m new too. We’ll both get the hang of it.
If the Lord wills. James 4:15
I too have seeked the answer to this question. And I found a good answer that satisfied it in my mind. the great lord of hosts. Our bodies are hosts for the spirit. God our father is spirit. In the old testament it seemed to be a very delicate situation to carry the spirit of God! there was strict orders given. If any man would be able to carry the spirit of God our father it would surely be his son Jesus. coming from heaven and knowing him. So the theory came Jesus was the host in flesh for God’s spirit. our God with us making them both one spirit. God! and you also read the holy spirit rested on him along with others. So my thought on it was they all were united as one working as one.
The Holy Spirit functions as the third person in the divine economy, and in the context of miracles, healings, and works of Jesus, Scripture shows that the Spirit is the power behind the Son’s activity, the source of life-giving energy, and the one who applies the Father’s will through the Son. The Son acts, but always empowered by the Spirit, because nothing is done in history apart from the triune cooperation.
In Luke 4:18 KJV, Jesus reads Isaiah 61 in the synagogue, “The Spirit of the Lord is upon me, because he hath anointed me to preach the gospel to the poor; he hath sent me to heal the brokenhearted, to preach deliverance to the captives, and recovering of sight to the blind, to set at liberty them that are bruised,” where “the Spirit of the Lord is upon me” (רוּחַ יְהוָה עָלַי, ruach Yahweh alay) indicates the anointing source. The verb עָלַי (alāy) shows the Spirit resting on Jesus to empower Him, not merely symbolically but instrumentally.
Acts 10:38 KJV states, “How God anointed Jesus of Nazareth with the Holy Ghost and with power, who went about doing good, and healing all that were oppressed of the devil; for God was with him.” Here ἐν πνεύματι ἁγίῳ (en pneumati hagiō) shows that the Spirit is the medium by which the Father anoints the Son for miracles. The participle ἀλείφω (aleiphō, anointed) in the aorist conveys a completed act of empowerment that continues to bear fruit in His ministry.
Hebrews 9:14 also links the Spirit to life-giving action, describing Christ as offering Himself through the eternal Spirit (διὰ πνεύματος αἰωνίου, dia pneumatos aiōniou) as the agent effecting purification, again showing the Spirit as the operative power without diminishing the Son’s personal agency.
So in John 5:19, when Jesus says the Son does what the Father does, we understand that:
The Father is the ultimate source and authority.
The Son is the acting agent, the one who performs the works historically.
The Holy Spirit is the energizing power, the enabling presence that makes the works possible and brings them to fruition.
The triune cooperation is perfect: the Father wills, the Son acts, the Spirit empowers. Miracles, healings, and all divine works are thus fully divine operations, simultaneously the works of Father, Son, and Spirit, revealing the unity and distinct roles of the Trinity.
J.
Yes @ChristIsTruth I most definitely misspoke. What I should have said was when God became flesh. I was talking about Jesus operating in this realm fully as a man. Jesus was in the beginning with God, and He was God. He was the Word that created everything.
“For by him all things were created, in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities—all things were created through him and for him.” Colossians 1:16
Very sorry for the misunderstanding. I blame my sickness (Flu) that has crept into my house again.
Sorry for the misunderstanding.
Peter
How gracious of you Peter. I would do well to follow your example when needed.
i’d like to point out that Jesus is an agent, sent by God to speak and do things for God
There is one undivided Divine Will. The Son doesn’t have a separate Divine Will from the Father’s Will. Jesus does have a human will in addition to the Divine Will, and so in His human will submits freely to the Divine Will–and thus places Himself in submission to the Father “Not My will, but Your will be done” as we read in the episode at Gethsemane.
So who did the miracles? Jesus did he miracles, as the Eternal Son of the Father, as the undivided God-Man, and yes it is the Father at work through Him who also does the miracles; and it is the Spirit who does the miracles. There is one Divine Will, and one Divine purpose, and one Divine agency and activity. When God acts it is always a Trinitarian act. The Son alone became flesh, who suffered and died and rose again; but the Son, in the Incarnation, does not act apart from the Father and the Spirit–it is always the indivisible work of the one Holy Trinity.
Jesus is the Incarnate God-Man. The Eternal Son and Divine Logos who is of the same Being as His Father, and who with the Father and the Holy Spirit is worshiped and adored: One God, Holy Trinity.
After discussing and studying the Scriptures for decades, @Bestill, I have come to the conclusion that the three Persons of the Trinity are distinct Persons with different roles, with which God as the one God does things. The Father is the eternal Source of creation, salvation, and sanctification; Jesus is the Agent through whom he accomplishes every action; the Holy Spirit is the direct Doer of them. All blessings come FROM the Father THROUGH Jesus BY the Spirit’s power. He is one God with three Persons in different functions but working together. What do you think about my understanding?
The whole Gospel of John speaks of the three Persons, while the rest of the Bible emphasizes his oneness:
Deut. 6:4 “Hear, O Israel: The LORD our God, the LORD is one.
Deut. 6:5 You shall love the LORD your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your might.
Deut. 6:6 And these words that I command you today shall be on your heart.
I think your understanding is right and I too believe that He is One God, three persons. I was thinking more along the lines that Jesus was fully human. He identified Himself with man by becoming a man in order to save man. He was also fully God, but I think by His statement ‘I can do nothing by myself’, Jesus had put aside His deity when He became a man.
As such, He became the second Adam. He became what man was intended to be and was lost by our first parents. As a people indwelt by God’s Spirit, as Adam was indwelt, we were to rule and live in partnership with God over this earth. We would do it, but it would be God in us actually doing it. I wonder if this is what Jesus meant when He talked about the Father doing the work.
Jesus came to restore what had been lost and it wasn’t just about a ticket to heaven. I’ve been thinking about this for a while and may not be expressing it well. He is our kinsman Redeemer. He is what we will become. Not Him, but like Him because we’ll see Him as He is. 1 John 3:2
Thank you for sharing.
No, @Bestill, he didn’t put aside his deity when he became man, or he wouldn’t have claimed 7 times in the Gospel of John that he is the great I AM, who spoke to Moses in the burning bush:
Exo 3:14 God said to Moses, “I AM WHO I AM.” And he said, “Say this to the people of Israel: ‘I AM has sent me to you.’”
Exo 3:15 God also said to Moses, “Say this to the people of Israel: ‘The LORD, the God of your fathers, the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob, has sent me to you.’ This is my name forever, and thus I am to be remembered throughout all generations.
Jhn_6:35 Jesus said to them, “I am the bread of life; whoever comes to me shall not hunger, and whoever believes in me shall never thirst.
Jhn_6:51 I am the living bread that came down from heaven. If anyone eats of this bread, he will live forever. And the bread that I will give for the life of the world is my flesh.”
Jhn_8:12 Again Jesus spoke to them, saying, “I am the light of the world. Whoever follows me will not walk in darkness, but will have the light of life.”
Jhn_8:58 Jesus said to them, “Truly, truly, I say to you, before Abraham was, I am.”
Jhn_9:5 As long as I am in the world, I am the light of the world.”
Jhn_10:7 So Jesus again said to them, “Truly, truly, I say to you, I am the door of the sheep.
Jhn_10:9 I am the door. If anyone enters by me, he will be saved and will go in and out and find pasture.
Jhn_10:11 I am the good shepherd. The good shepherd lays down his life for the sheep.
Psa 23:1 A Psalm of David. The LORD is my shepherd; I shall not want.
Jhn_11:25 Jesus said to her, “I am the resurrection and the life. Whoever believes in me, though he die, yet shall he live,
Jhn_14:6 Jesus said to him, “I am the way, and the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me.
Jhn_15:1 “I am the true vine, and my Father is the vinedresser.
Jesus is God in order to rise from the dead to give us new life, just as he is fully human in order to die for our forgiveness. What an amazing miracle is Jesus, the God-man!!
He didn’t. He was fully, truly, completely God even while He was fully, truly, completely human.
God bled on the cross.