I believe so. I also consider him a brother. Like all here. Well, and sisters. Unless they state otherwise.
Peter
Sharing the gospel isn’t hateful. Trying to alter the gospel is. The tone of our voice doesn’t determine truth. Neither does how nice it makes people feel. Truth is fidelity to what God has said. Scripture tells us that people will distort sound doctrine, turn away from the truth, and label those who won’t water it down as “hateful.”
Jesus faced hateful for speaking truth. Paul was accused of being troublesome for preaching Christ. That didn’t make them incorrect. It showed the message was working.
If biblical correction is called “hate,” the issue is not tone but resistance to truth. God’s Word reproves, rebukes, and corrects, and that is mercy. What matters is not who is offended, but whether what is said lines up with Scripture.
If you believe I have been in error, then please show it from Scripture. Quote something I said and show me from the text why it isn’t Biblical. If I’m wrong, show me with the Word of God.
If no Scripture exists to refute what I said, then we aren’t discussing biblical accuracy we are disagreeing with application. The Bible doesn’t call for silence or tone policing when someone is teaching falsely. It calls for testing, correcting and refute.
I am open to biblical correction. I am not open to being rebuked without Scriptural proof. And by saying we are trying, I guess you have grouped yourself with the false teachers?
You talk much about love and mercy, but Scripture judges love by truth and conduct, not tone or sentiment. You embrace Tillman as brother though he twists, distorts, and adds to the Word of God because you yourself do likewise. Scripture does not measure brotherhood by common posture or affirmation of another. It measures brotherhood by submission to the truth. Those who change God’s Word will not be validated by love. They will be confronted by it.
You have not answered one doctrinal point brought up. Instead you deflect to hurt feelings, perception, stages of sanctification, and moderation. Scripture does not shield false teachers by psychoanalyzing them. Paul didn’t appeal to feelings when the gospel was being twisted. He dealt with the error.
You warn against judging hearts, yet you speculate freely about motives, wounds, and spiritual maturity. At the same time, you and others misrepresent my words and accuse me of slander for doing exactly what Scripture commands: testing doctrine and correcting error. That is hypocrisy.
If you are preaching love where is it? Biblical love does not rejoice when truth is deflected. Biblical love does not slander those who hold Scripture dear and simultaneously excuse those who abuse it. Biblical love corrects, rebukes and shines light on error for the sake of souls.
If I quoted anyone incorrectly, prove it. If I have taught incorrectly, prove it from Scripture. Attacking my character when I will not shy away from doctrine proves my point. This issue is not about love at all. It is about rejecting truth.
We are not called to wrap somebody’s feelings in Scripture. We are called to contend for the faith once delivered and to rebuke those who speak against it. That, is not harshness. That is obedience.
I’m sorry. You misunderstood this part of my post. You said in reply to Tillman
I was agreeing with you. Not calling you out on anything.
Peter
Your post is long on word studies and short on obedience to what those words actually require.
You say judgment must aim at affirmation, not exposure. Scripture says otherwise. Paul names false teachers and says their teaching overthrows the faith of some ~2 Timothy 2:17–18. Jesus publicly exposed the Pharisees as blind guides ~Matthew 23. Ezekiel was commanded to expose covenant violation, not affirm intent. Exposure is not optional when error is present.
You appeal to δοκιμάζω and πειράζω as if testing is primarily about approval. Scripture uses those words to prove what is genuine by rejecting what is false. When Paul says “prove all things,” he immediately adds “hold fast that which is good” ~1 Thessalonians 5:21. That assumes some things fail the test and must be rejected. Testing that never rejects anything is not biblical testing at all.
You warn against condemning motives, yet your post repeatedly assigns motives. You speak of anger, dislike, hurt, wounds, sanctification stages, and smugness. That is judging hearts while claiming to forbid it. Scripture forbids that hypocrisy.
You also draw a false boundary by limiting judgment primarily to leaders. Paul says plainly that we are to judge those within the church ~1 Corinthians 5:12. Doctrine is not exempt because someone lacks a title. Error is error no matter who speaks it.
Most telling is this: you never once address the actual doctrines being challenged. Not one. Instead, you redirect the conversation to tone, posture, and psychology. Scripture does not shield false teachers by psychoanalyzing them. It corrects them by the Word.
And let’s be clear about “love.” Biblical love rejoices in the truth ~1 Corinthians 13:6. Love does not slander the one applying Scripture while excusing those who twist it. Love does not rally around false teachers and then accuse the corrector of what it is doing itself.
You call Tillman a brother. Scripture defines brotherhood by abiding in the doctrine of Christ ~2 John 9. Those who add to, distort, or reframe God’s Word are not affirmed by love. They are warned by it.
So no, the problem here is not judgment. The problem is selective judgment. Judgment redirected away from false teaching and aimed instead at those who expose it.
If the teaching is sound, let it stand up to Scripture. If it is not, then no amount of Greek, Hebrew, or pastoral framing will change what God has said.
That is not harshness. That is fidelity to the Word.
I will say this once, brother @Peterc. Our brother @bdavidc still has much to learn about communicating with real people in online spaces. At times his approach reminds me of certain academic apologists, very strong in the intellect, but disconnected from what Scripture calls the lēb, the heart.
At present, he does not seem able to distinguish between dokimazō and peirazō, and that is concerning, not as an insult, but because it reflects a kind of theological confidence without corresponding depth or pastoral awareness.
This is not how Jesus Christ engaged people, nor how the apostles modeled correction. Rapid-fire citation of verses and rigid theological assertions, when detached from discernment and mercy, do not reflect the character of Christ, even when the verses themselves are true.
Each time I read his now four responses to me, the contrast Jesus draws between the tax collector and the self-righteous Pharisee comes to mind, not as a final judgment on his heart, but as a warning about posture.
Scripture calls us not only to handle truth accurately, but to handle it rightly, in a way that reaches people where it actually counts.
Have a blessed Tuesday, how time flies!
Shalom achi.
J.
Johann, because this is a public forum that claims to be Christian, this must be addressed publicly and plainly. Scripture warns against speaking as though one represents God while substituting personal judgment, impressions, or pastoral framing for what God has actually said. God Himself says He is against those who speak from their own hearts and not from His mouth, and against those who claim divine authority for words He did not speak ~Jeremiah 23:16, 21, 31. That is not a light matter, especially where others may be led astray.
You have presented your assessments as spiritually authoritative while refusing to answer Scripture with Scripture. Instead of correcting doctrine, you have judged posture, motives, and heart, and then framed those judgments as what Christ would approve. Scripture forbids that. We are commanded to judge teaching by the Word of God, not to assume God’s role by weighing hearts while doctrine goes unanswered.
The apostles handled this differently. Paul commanded that those who teach error be silenced because they subvert souls ~Titus 1:10–11. He charged that no other doctrine be taught ~1 Timothy 1:3. John said plainly that whoever does not abide in the doctrine of Christ does not have God ~2 John 9. None of them protected error by appealing to tone, mercy language, or psychological explanation.
This is not personal, and it is not a debate about style. It is about fidelity to the Word of God and responsibility before Christ. Scripture says we will all give account for every word we speak ~Romans 14:12, and Jesus warned that careless words will be brought into judgment ~Matthew 12:36. That applies to all of us, especially when teaching publicly.
So hear this clearly. Stop presenting personal judgment as though it carries divine approval. Stop deflecting from doctrine to character. Repent, and submit to the Word of God as it is written. If what I have said is wrong, correct it from Scripture. If what you have said goes beyond Scripture, then Scripture requires you to stop.
This is how Christ’s name is honored in His church. Scripture warns that persisting in public false teaching and presenting personal judgment as divine authority places a person under God’s opposition now and under stricter judgment if there is no repentance.
You say this is “error,” but you did not show any error from Scripture. “Do some studying” is not a rebuttal, and offering help is not proof.
The Bible’s own context defines the test. Paul says, “prove all things; hold fast that which is good” ~1 Thessalonians 5:21. That necessarily includes rejecting what is not good. John says to try the spirits because many false prophets are gone out into the world ~1 John 4:1. That test is not primarily affirmation. It is discernment that separates truth from error.
So if you claim my statement is wrong, then correct it the biblical way: quote the text and demonstrate from Scripture that “prove all things” does not include rejecting what fails. Otherwise, readers should recognize this as assertion without Scripture.
I’m not glued to my computer all the time brother but I’ll leave you with this, right?
Total Occurrences: 23
δεδοκιμάσμεθα dedokimásmetha (1) V-RPI-1P
we were allowed 1Th_2:4
δοκιμάζει dokimázei (1) V-PAI-3S
he alloweth Rom_14:22
δοκιμάζειν dokimázein (3) V-PAN
discern Luk_12:56
may approve Php_1:10
may prove Rom_12:2
δοκιμάζεις dokimázeis (1) V-PAI-2S
approvest Rom_2:18
δοκιμαζέσθωσαν dokimazésthôsan (1) V-PPM-3P
be proved 1Ti_3:10
δοκιμάζετε dokimázete (1) V-PAI-2P
discern Luk_12:56
δοκιμάζετε dokimázete (3) V-PAM-2P
prove 2Co_13:5, 1Th_5:21,
try 1Jn_4:1
δοκιμαζέτω dokimazétô (2) V-PAM-3S
examine 1Co_11:28
prove Gal_6:4
δοκιμαζομένου dokimazoménou (1) V-PPP-GSN
it be tried 1Pe_1:7
δοκιμάζοντες dokimázontes (1) V-PAP-NPM
Proving Eph_5:10
δοκιμάζοντι dokimázonti (1) V-PAP-DSM
which trieth 1Th_2:4
δοκιμάζων dokimázôn (1) V-PAP-NSM
proved 2Co_8:8
δοκιμάσαι dokimásai (1) V-AAN
to prove Luk_14:19
δοκιμάσει dokimásei (1) V-FAI-3S
shall try 1Co_3:13
δοκιμάσητε dokimásçte (1) V-AAS-2P
ye shall approve 1Co_16:3
ἐδοκιμάσαμεν edokimásamen (1) V-AAI-1P
to prove 2Co_8:22
ἐδοκιμασάν edokimasán (1) V-AAI-3P
proved Heb_3:9
ἐδοκίμασαν edokímasan (1) V-AAI-3P
like Rom_1:28
English to Strong’s
allowed G1381
alloweth G1381
approve G1381
approvest G1381
discern G1252, G1253, G1381
examine G350, G1381, G3985
like G407, G499, G846+2596+3588, G871, G1381, G1503, G2470, G2472, G2532+3779, G2504, G2596+3665, G3663, G3664, G3666, G3667, G3739, G3945, G3946, G4832, G5024, G5108, G5613, G5615, G5616, G5618
prove G584, G1381, G3936, G3985
proved G1381, G4256
Proving G1381, G4822
tried G448, G1381, G1384, G3985
trieth G1381
try G1381, G3985, G4314+G3986
Now, rightly divide the Scriptures, cutting straight that wich is crooked.
Some wonderful passages here. Now study peiradzo, you can do it, and the Hebrew words.
I’ll gladly share this module to anyone who needs it, just ask.
J.
Listing Greek occurrences is not interpretation, Johann. It only proves you can copy a concordance.
I have two words for you brother, you are dishonest and hypocritical, and the readers can discern for themselves.
This IS comparing Scripture with Scripture, not isolated proof-texts.
You don’t even know what “interpretation” of Scripture means brother.
Reading the words is the starting point, not the finish line, because interpretation answers a different question: what did the author intend to communicate to the original audience, and how does that meaning rightly carry forward.
At the most basic level, interpretation begins with lexical meaning, asking what the words meant in their original language, not what a modern reader feels they should mean, because Hebrew and Greek words carry ranges of meaning, idioms, and cultural assumptions that English translations flatten.
Next comes grammar and syntax, which determines how words function together, since tense, aspect, voice, mood, and clause structure often carry the theological weight, as in the difference between a present possession and a future hope, or between command and description.
Then there is immediate literary context, meaning sentences belong to paragraphs, paragraphs to arguments, and arguments to books, and extracting a verse from its flow is not interpretation but fragmentation.
Beyond that is historical and covenantal context, because Scripture was written into real situations involving law, exile, temple worship, persecution, or church order, and ignoring that context is how readers turn situational instruction into universal slogans.
Interpretation also requires attention to genre, since poetry, narrative, prophecy, wisdom, gospel, and epistle communicate truth differently, and reading apocalyptic imagery as if it were a legal code is not faithfulness, it is category confusion.
Crucially, interpretation distinguishes between description and prescription, because not everything recorded is commanded, and not everything commanded applies identically across covenants without qualification.
Finally, Christian interpretation is Christ-centered and canonical, meaning individual texts are read in light of the whole story that culminates in the cross and resurrection, rather than being treated as standalone moral aphorisms.
So verbatim reading without interpretation is not neutral or humble; it is an illusion, because every reader is already interpreting the moment they decide what a word, sentence, or command “means.”
The real question is not whether one interprets Scripture, but whether one interprets it carefully, honestly, and responsibly, or pretends not to while doing it badly.
That said, I’m still willing to share this module with you, just ask.
Shalom, have a good day.
J.
Name-calling is not an argument. If people will just read what I’ve written and then READ and STUDY Scripture for themselves Truth will take care of itself. God says His WORD gives knowledge to the simple~ Psalm 119: 130 and the Bereans got a slap on the back for comparing teaching with the Scriptures ~Acts 17:11.
“Comparing scripture with Scripture” means letting clear BIBLE VERSES explain the ones that are hard to understand, not substituting what is written with some theory about what it “must” say.
God never gave us His Word so that only theologians could understand it. “The entrance of thy words giveth light; it giveth understanding unto the simple.” ~ Psalm 119:130
If you can’t show what you claim directly from the text itself, then you aren’t interpreting it, you are inserting what you want it to say. The Bereans didn’t compare teachings with a method. They checked THE MESSAGE against the Scriptures. ~Acts 17:11
So stop with the name calling and post the passage that plainly teaches your point. Otherwise the accusation stands.
Exo 24:8 ¶ Moses took the blood, sprinkled it on the people, and said, “This is the blood of the covenant which the Lord made with you based on all these words.”
Exo 24:8 And he took the book of the covenant, and read in the audience of the people: and they said, All that the LORD hath said will we do, and be obedient.
Exo 24:9 And Moses took the blood, and sprinkled [it] on the people, and said, Behold the blood of the covenant, which the LORD hath made with you concerning all these words.
Exo 24:10 Then went up Moses, and Aaron, Nadab, and Abihu, Elazar and Ithamar and seventy of the elders of Israel:
Exo 24:11 And they saw the God of Israel: and [there was] under his feet as it were a paved work of a sapphire stone, and as it were the body of heaven in [his] clearness.
Exo 24:12 And upon the nobles of the children of Israel he laid not his hand: also they saw God, and did eat and drink.
Exo 24:13 And the LORD said unto Moses, Come up to me into the mount, and be there: and I will give thee tables of stone, the law, and commandments which I have written; that thou mayest teach them.
Exo 24:14 And Moses rose up, and his minister Joshua: and Moses went up into the mount of God.
Exo 24:15 And he said unto the elders, Tarry ye here for us, until we come again unto you: behold, Aaron and Hur [are] with you: if any man have any matters to do, let him come unto them.
Exo 24:16 And Moses went up into the mount, and a cloud covered the mount.
Exo 24:17 And the glory of the LORD abode upon mount Sinai, and the cloud covered it six days: and the seventh day he called unto Moses out of the midst of the cloud.
Exo 24:18 And the sight of the glory of the LORD [was] like devouring fire on the top of the mount in the eyes of the children of Israel.
Who made the covenant here @bdavidc
Jesus?
My pastor.
J.
Hey Brother. @Johann Not sure what happened here.
Exodus 24
8 Moses then took the blood, sprinkled it on the people, and said, “This is the blood of the covenant that the Lord has made with you in accordance with all these words.”
9 Moses and Aaron, Nadab and Abihu, and the seventy elders of Israel went up
10 and saw the God of Israel. Under his feet was something like a pavement made of lapis lazuli, as bright blue as the sky.
11 But God did not raise his hand against these leaders of the Israelites; they saw God, and they ate and drank.
12 The Lord said to Moses, “Come up to me on the mountain and stay here, and I will give you the tablets of stone with the law and commandments I have written for their instruction.”
13 Then Moses set out with Joshua his aide, and Moses went up on the mountain of God.
14 He said to the elders, “Wait here for us until we come back to you. Aaron and Hur are with you, and anyone involved in a dispute can go to them.”
15 When Moses went up on the mountain, the cloud covered it,
16 and the glory of the Lord settled on Mount Sinai. For six days the cloud covered the mountain, and on the seventh day, the Lord called to Moses from within the cloud.
17 To the Israelites, the glory of the Lord looked like a consuming fire on top of the mountain.
18 Then Moses entered the cloud as he went up the mountain. And he stayed on the mountain forty days and forty nights.
Do you see the error? Sorry, it just bothered me.
With love.
Peter
What is it that is bothering you @PeterC ?
J.
Read verse by verse. What you posted and what I posed from the KJV. They do not seem to be the same. I do not know why.
Peter
Oh, I see, here I quoted the Samaritan Pentateuch in English @PeterC
Exo 24:8 And he took the book of the covenant, and read in the audience of the people: and they said, All that the LORD hath said will we do, and be obedient.
Exo 24:9 And Moses took the blood, and sprinkled [it] on the people, and said, Behold the blood of the covenant, which the LORD hath made with you concerning all these words.
And here is the KJV, all you had to do is read on…
Exo 24:7 And he took the book of the covenant, and read in the audience of the people: and they said, All that the LORD hath said will we do, and be obedient.
Exo 24:8 And Moses took the blood, and sprinkled it on the people, and said, Behold the blood of the covenant, which the LORD hath made with you concerning all these words.
Problem solved?
J.
Yup. Just throw me off. I use multiple translations as well.