At a recent rally, two Christian students were mocked after boldly shouting, “Jesus is Lord!” in response to Vice President Kamala Harris. JD Vance, Republican VP nominee, criticized Harris for what he called anti-Christian rhetoric, pointing to a deeper tension between faith and politics. The students warned that hostility toward Christians will only grow, framing their experience as part of the spiritual battle unfolding in the 2024 election.
How should Christians respond when their faith is mocked at public events like the Kamala Harris rally? Do moments like these call for boldness, patience, or a different approach altogether?
Completely faux outrage. If you go out of your way to invite being mocked, don’t whine to us when you’re mocked. Duh. I suppose an atheist who stands up at a revival meeting and screams “There ain’t no God!” can likewise expect to be “mocked.” These characters were hoping to provoke the reaction they provoked, and now they can revel in their status a martyrs for the faith. I’m no fan of Kamala, but I thought she handled the interruption with more wit than I’m accustomed to seeing from her.
Christian’s are not being mocked. Acting like an idiot at a public event invites ridicule. The hubris leading to the self imposed persecution complex is astounding.
What does movk. the faith? Christians flocking to kiss the ring on the hand of Trump.
I think you got the story completely wrong. There was no outrage whatsoever on the part of the Pro-Life protesters who attended the event. The outrage was entirely on the part of the attendees in the crowd, and the mockery came only from Kamala Harris at the podium, who was promoting abortion.
It’s entirely appropriate to protest the barbaric and in response to be verbally and physically assaulted in the process, they didn’t lash out or respond in kind. They left. On the way out they were heckled, pushed and cursed at, while cackling Kamala chuckled up front and in response to their shout of “Jesus is King” -she snapped back-- “You are at the wrong rally.” She’s devotedly anti-Christian.
I don’t know what your game is, but this is twice you have attempted to have me saying exactly the opposite of what I said. I know EXACTLY what happened and meant EXACTLY what I said. The Christian twits invited EXACTLY what they got, and Kamala’s response was ENTIRELY appropriate. Whether or not the crowd’s response was entirely appropriate, it was entirely predictable and entirely what the twits wanted. Now they’re on FOX News just like they wanted. The “outrage” of the right-wing FOX News / Christian community is entirely faux outrage.
You accused two young gentlemen of going out of their way to being mocked and trying to provoke a reaction-- in your words— “duh.” I would agree that they were trying to provoke a reaction-- that’s the nature of protesting isn’t it? The are self-professed Pro-Life activists, and abortion protesters. While she was praising abortion at her dying campaign revival event, what they did was entirely appropriate for protesters protesting.
Kamala’s reaction was very telling. She was proclaiming that there is no room for radical ideas like- “Christ is Lord,” or “Jesus is King” at Democrat events-- “You must be at the wrong rally” -she snipped at them. No, they were exactly at the right rally, to be protesting abortion, because the Democrats are all about it. It’s a place where “Christ is Lord” is radical, but abortion on demand, anytime for any reason is a stated goal. Opposing late term abortions is a radical idea to those who say-- never too late… after all, abortion is healthcare. Not for the babies it isn’t.
Maybe you got out of your lane? Who’s in charge of lanes around here?
Might be one of those “Christian twits” you are raging about.
I think you’re the one that’s confused. They show up at a Kamala rally at an exceedingly liberal university and, while the subject of the rally is addressing abortion rights, screech “JESUS IS LORD!” Oh, hey, that was productive - NOT. Oh, hey, that was likely to result in meaningful dialogue - NOT. Oh, hey, that was a sterling example of Christian witnessing - NOT. It was silly, teenage, look-at-me exhibitionism. I, who am neither a Kamala nor abortion rights supporter (quite the opposite), thought Kamala handled it perfectly.
Those who think there is only one Christian response to the abortion issue are committing the “No True Scotsman” (in this case, “No True Christian”) fallacy. Those caught up in this fallacy should really do some historical research. The following is from The Religious Right and the Abortion Myth - POLITICO. What has been occurring for 50+ years is that the political right wing has played Christians like a cheap violin, convincing far too many that the right-wing positions are the ONLY possible Christian ones (yeah, baby, God opposes gun control!).
In 1968, Christianity Today organized a conference with the Christian Medical Society to discuss the morality of abortion. The gathering attracted 26 heavyweight theologians from throughout the evangelical world, who debated the matter over several days and then issued a statement acknowledging the ambiguities surrounding the issue, which, they said, allowed for many different approaches.
Two successive editors of Christianity Today took equivocal stands on abortion. Carl F. H. Henry, the magazine’s founder, affirmed that “a woman’s body is not the domain and property of others,” and his successor, Harold Lindsell, allowed that, “if there are compelling psychiatric reasons from a Christian point of view, mercy and prudence may favor a therapeutic abortion.”
Meeting in St. Louis in 1971, the delegates to the Southern Baptist Convention passed a resolution calling for the legalization of abortion, a position they reaffirmed in 1974 — a year after Roe — and again in 1976.
When the Roe decision was handed down, W. A. Criswell, pastor of First Baptist Church in Dallas and president of the Southern Baptist Convention, issued a statement praising the ruling. “I have always felt that it was only after a child was born and had a life separate from its mother that it became an individual person,” Criswell declared, “and it has always, therefore, seemed to me that what is best for the mother and for the future should be allowed.”
When Francis Schaeffer, the intellectual godfather of the Religious Right, tried to enlist Billy Graham in his antiabortion crusade in the late 1970s, Graham turned him down. Even James Dobson, founder of Focus on the Family who later became an implacable foe of abortion, acknowledged in 1973 that the Bible was silent on the matter and therefore it was plausible for an evangelical to believe that “a developing embryo or fetus was not regarded as a full human being.”
ummm… they were students at that same university and had every right to be there. What you would do is try to silence them and take away their right to have a voice in an important and much-disputed social concern.
I don’t know if you intentionally miss the point - consistently - or your reading comprehension skills are lacking, but you consistently do indeed miss the point. OF COURSE, the twits had a right to be there. OF COURSE, they had a right to voice their opinions (although screeching “JESUS IS LORD!” is not substantively different from an atheist screeching “THERE AIN’T NO GOD!” at a revival). The point you miss is, they were merely attempting to provoke, did provoke, and have now had their 15 minutes of fame before they enter the real world of flipping burgers. Kamala recognized exactly what they were trying to do and responded with gentle humor that had precisely nothing to do with them being Christians.
Kamala made it clear that Christians (that you call “twits”) were not welcome at their own college event. That’s good humor?
It would be like a Moderator telling you to take your ball and go home. That you are a Christian twit and that you are on the wrong forum, because you see things differently than most of the folks here.
It’s like a Democrat standing up in a Christian forum and shouting Abortion is awesome! Is it your intent just to be provocative? Is this your 2 minutes of rage? The TDS is strong here.
I voted for Trump twice and am not voting at all this time, so any TDS is an exceedingly mild case. I have something more akin to Trump Cultist / Phony Christian Outrage Derangement Syndrome.
Kamala’s response had nothing to do with the rude lads being Christians. She simply saw through their act and waved them away. I thought she did so with grace and humor. Was she supposed to halt her presentation at a pro-abortion rally and engage in discussion of how “JESUS IS LORD!” relates to the issue? This is just silly. Is that what would occur at a revival meeting if an atheist heckler interjected “THERE AIN’T NO GOD!” - really?
A DEMOCRAT standing up at a CHRISTIAN forum and shouting “Abortion is awesome”??? Eek, you are neck-deep in the No True Christian fallacy. Apparently in your vision, there is a distinction between Democrats and Christians - and, moreover, it never occurs to you that a sincere, Trump-voting Christian might see more nuance to the issue than you do. Wow. Even TRUMP sees nuance to the issue!
As a fairly rational, intelligent, educated individual who isn’t a political junkie, I’ve long recognized that TDS has its own counterpart in Trump Cultist Syndrome. If the shoe fits, as the saying goes. I just happen to believe that in this instance the lads had no purpose other than to make a scene, Kamala handled the interruption with grace and humor, and the outrage of the TCS segment of the Christian community is entirely - ENTIRELY - faux.
You’ve dismissed yourself from the national dialogue. Planning on not voting is the weakest of inactions. You’ve removed yourself from the conversation, and taken away your only voice-- your vote.
At this point it’s become static on the line… annoying and meaningless-- but we still hear it. Make a difference by voting.
Secondly-- If you want to start a thread defending the Democratic position and platform that supports abortion go ahead. But this thread is about how Christians should respond. You responded with angry name calling and a dishonest review of what actually happened. You are operating in a space where Kamala is graceful, witty and full of humor-- enjoy your own perspective-- it isn’t shared by me.
The students in question have had their response to the abuse and mockery recorded for posterity, notwithstanding your personal animus toward them.
Again, you miss the point. The topic of this thread is a legitimate one worthy of discussion. Unfortunately, the author of the article in the original post did not pick an example where ANYONE’s faith was mocked. Kamala simply responded to an interruption in a good-natured way. I have watched the clip at least ten times, as has my devout Baptist wife, and I see NOTHING that would even vaguely qualify as anyone’s “faith” being “mocked.” Screeching “Christ is king!” and “Jesus is Lord!” while a presidential candidate is speaking is (1) rude; (2) irrelevant to the subject; (3) clearly intended to provoke; and (4) not even vaguely a Christian witness. This was a stunt, pure and simple, and Kamala handled it well.
As I said elsewhere, or possibly here, the political hatred has reached the point of irrationality. Christians are allowed to have diverse views, even on issues like abortion and even when those views don’t mesh with the right-wing political “gospel.” Not surprisingly, no one responded to my point that Roe v. Wade was widely PRAISED by the evangelical community when the decision came down, and there was widespread agreement that abortion is a theologically difficult issue.
@MrE apparently thinks the abortion issue is entirely one-dimensional - which is his right to think, but he doens’t get to decide the issue for everyone else. He also apparently thinks he gets to decide who is worthy to participate in discussions - which I’m pretty sure he doesn’t.
I get it. You don’t want to see what you don’t believe. (Some people call that pretending).
The young students were shouted at, cursed at, pushed, and yes-- mocked- both from the podium and as they were being ushered out of the venue-- where as you admit-- they had every right to be as tuition-paying students of that college, and where they have every right to speak, as guaranteed by the Constitution. But you see nothing.
I understand the Christian students’ wish to express themselves, but it was not a Christian rally. Not everybody shared their point of view and they were all gathered together for something entirely different. They were gathered to support Kamala Harris’ bid for presidency and maybe Kamala is not Christian enough for some people although she is indeed a Baptist Christian. We ought to consider who will really save our faith in the true God, a man who forces women, yes rapes them, and forcibly divides parents from their babies aborting them after birth, puts children in cages, and threatens us with authoritarianism. Even if you would like a very Christian President, maybe Trump is not the right one. He never reads the Bible and does not ask forgiveness of God. He does not repent. He does not believe the Kingdom of Heaven belongs to the poor and poor in spirit. He sells Bibles but he does not follow them. I think it is highly misguided to connect Christian feeling for our True GOD Jesus Christ with Donald Trump in ANY way. I strongly believe we WILL get Christian compassion and Christian feeling out of Kamala. But I think yelling Christ is Lord everywhere and anywhere means nothing to Christ least of all. He doesn’t need them interrupting Kamala. He needs their HONESTY about who has the brains and real compassion to walk in God, through KINDNESS and LOVE. Raping women is not that.
FWIW, I looked into this incident on fact-checking sites such as Scopes, VerifyThis, etc. There is considerable doubt as to what occurred and to whom Kamala was responding. Someone saying “Lies, lies” was heard more clearly by people near the podium than were the Christian kids. There were journalists there, as well as other videos, and there seems to be remarkably little confirmation (i.e., none) of the kids’ claims of being pushed, shoved, flogged and verbally crucified. I noticed even FOX was careful to say “allegedly” when the kids described their treatment. Every straight news story on the incident simply says the crowd cheered as the kids were escorted out.
A stunt, pure and simple. Precisely the sort of stunt that confirms what many people unfortunatelty already think about this sort of Christianity. But, hey, Trump Cultists don’t allow facts to get in the way of their faux outrage.
Christians must not acquiesce to supporting candidates who mock the essence of life and who support abortion for any reason at any stage of fetal development.
