You still shouldn’t judge all churches based on the experiences of one. I can guarantee that the church I belong to would never treat anyone like that, and I’ve been going there for over 20 years.
It was not based on one but three different churches. The first time my family was severely hurt by a church was 20 years ago. We left that church and found another one. My wife was asked to be the children’s director. She did that for fourteen years and then through gossip and false accusations, the pastor fires her. That pastor eventually repented years later but the damage had been done. We found another church and this time they went after my son. I am done. This was the straw that broke the camel’s back. The American church is too corrupt and I think is too far gone.
Sorry to hear about your situation. There are some decent churches left.
We need to be careful what church or shepherds we study with.
Hosea chapter 4
Through thou, Israel, play the harlot, yet let not Judah offebd. Do not come to gilgal, nor go up to Beth aven, nor swear an oath, saying, as the Lord lives
Beth aven means House of nothing. Because Gods word isn’t taught there. Its more of social gatherings or the pastor or Minister teaches traditions of men. The congregations are spiritually dead, bibillcy illiterate. There not nourished Gods word.
Hosea chapter 5
Hear this, you priests, pay, attention, you Israel, listen royal house, this judgement is against you. You have been snare at mizpah, a net spread out at Tabor,
The shepherds are accountable to Jesus. God is tired of the hirelings lying and misleading people. Passover is communion, Christian people do in April once year. Easter is pagan and heathen, it is insult to Jesus.
Some churches practice absolution. They have confessions booths set up for preists to to hear confession. Only Jesus can forgive sins !!
There are dead churches and some good churches.
5:4
They will not frame thier doings to turn unto thier God, for the Spirit of whoredoms is in the midst of them, and they have not known the Lord.
Christian people must be Doers of the word, James chapter 1, not hearers only deceiving your own selves. Some Christians are play actors, lip service, it’s just social functions to them.
Some priests, and pastors have failed God and there community. Not teaching sound doctrine and putting people interest first. False doctrine is poison pills.
5:6
They shall go with their flocks, and with thier herds to seek the Lord, but they shall not find him, he has withdrawn himself from them.
I’m not judging anyone or knocking churches down.
But some refuse to repent. And some people actually enjoy being lied to by hirelings. There not sincere about serving Jesus, and obedience.
Its not once week, Christian people study Bible every day. We Carry our every day, and follow Jesus direction. We’re doers of the word.
I won’t sugar coat Gods word.
Lot of people, and hirelings have turned thier backs on God.
When we look at the context of congregation. Its infant babies on milk. They lack knowledge of God’s word. They’re spiritually dead. I’m not talking down to anyone.
The motives must be pure. Not about money or noriety. Gods word must take first priority.
We’re warned not to go to Beth aven.
Bethel means house of God.
Peace.
Just getting back to this discussion.
The primary point I was trying to make is that knowing that the people in any church are sinful, it isn’t the people you should be focused on. Find a church where the Gospel is preached and Personal Salvation is taught. Every church out there WILL have people that you will probably make sure you’re sitting on the other side of the sanctuary. Your focus shouldn’t be on THEM it should be on God and the message being given. If I thought you lived anywhere near Anderson Indiana, I would offer a personal invite to FaithChurch, Anderson. Here is this morning’s message by our senior pastor Walt Weaver.
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Unfortunately, some of the deepest wounds in my life came from people who claimed to be doing “good. That’s a hard thing to say out loud, but it’s true. Church life, Christian circles, even friendships… those have sometimes been the places where I’ve felt the most betrayed. And because of that, I find myself more guarded than I’d like to be. When someone shows kindness or offers support, my first thought isn’t always gratitude. It’s suspicion. What are they really after? Is this love with strings attached? I know that’s not how God calls us to live, but it’s a struggle. Trust is easier said than restored.
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Thank you for your response. I understand exactly what you are feeling. I feel the exact same way.
You have reason to be discouraged but its not a place you should stay. There is much to be gained in attending a good church. I’m on my 5th church and happy with it. In each previous church the leadership changed and so did the church. The church is made up of imperfect people. Some churches are dead and some are just wrong. That seems to be happening more and more.
In my efforts to share the gospel, this was the number one argument I came up against. What the church has done and I can’t argue against it because its true. We don’t have a good track record and much harm has been done by the church. I changed my approach and when this argument came up I said, “I’m not talking about the church. I’m talking about Jesus’“ and surprise, surprise, they listened.
So church is not about the people that go there. It’s about Jesus and we’re told not to give up meeting with one another. Good Bible teaching and loving churches do still exist and I think you should look for one. Fellowship is important. It’s what God uses to build us up and mature. It’s very difficult for a Christian to grow without the fellowship of others. Even bad fellowship can have its use in the life of God’s child. It’s a teaching moment.
Be encouraged! Keep looking and know that no church is perfect.
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Thank you, I guess the hard part is the betrayal. The first church was becoming more cultish so we left but the next church my wife was on staff and through gossip and false accusations that the pastor believed without any evidence or compassion, fired my wife. The second church and Christian school my son helped out in the children’s ministry and because he is male, single and quiet, the church and school decided to bully him and through gossip and false accusations he was fired (even though it was volunteer, the betrayal was deep). I was teaching at the school and I resigned and the school and church went ballistic. I was actually very surprised that they still paid me what they owed me. The one sin the church loves is a little gossip. They remind me of a bunch of middle age women at a beauty salon.
wow that is a lot of betrayal, hopefully with the time that has past things have gotten better for you and family. And i pray you find a church that better suit you all and gives you the respect that you all deserve. Nice to see you back on the forums, hope to hear from you on some of the topic here….
You could start your own house church right where you are
@pd2169637
Churches in the New Testament era were indeed small assemblies that met in homes (Acts 2:46; 20:20). So, the practice of attending a home church, or house church, is biblically allowable. There also seem to be some good reasons to have house churches as opposed to large gatherings: greater intimacy, stronger relationships, single-mindedness, etc. The fact that large churches usually have their own small groups that meet in homes speaks to the value of the house church model. Several considerations should be made, however, concerning the reasons for creating a house church or choosing to attend one.
First, the fact that first-century Christians did something does not establish it as a pattern for all generations to follow, unless there is also a clear command to do so. Simply because Scripture records an event or practice does not, of itself, establish a mandate (or, in some cases, even approval). So, for example, the fact that early Christians in Jerusalem sold what they owned and shared the profits with other believers (see Acts 2:44–45) does not mean that we must do so today—although such selflessness and generosity would certainly be acceptable. Home churches are “biblical” in the sense that there is precedent in Scripture, but there is no biblical obligation to attend a home church.
Many believers who attend house churches interpret Paul’s words in 1 Corinthians 14 as establishing a principle of participation, which implies the need for a smaller church gathering: “What then, brothers? When you come together, each one has a hymn, a lesson, a revelation, a tongue, or an interpretation. Let all things be done for building up. . . . Let two or three prophets speak, and let the others weigh what is said. If a revelation is made to another sitting there, let the first be silent. For you can all prophesy one by one, so that all may learn and all be encouraged” (1 Corinthians 14:26, 29–31). Some read this passage as not only descriptive of what was happening in Corinth but also prescriptive for all churches at all times, based on Paul’s words later in the context: “as in all the churches of the saints” and “was it from you that the word of God came? Or are you the only ones it has reached? If anyone thinks that he is a prophet, or spiritual, he should acknowledge that the things I am writing to you are a command of the Lord. If anyone does not recognize this, he is not recognized” (verses 33, 36–38). Nowhere else in Scripture do we find more consecutive verses addressing what to do when the local church gathers.
Second, home churches motivated solely by an effort to counter the “institutional church” have a questionable foundation. The given reason for starting a home church is usually to more closely align with the biblical model, but the unstated reason often seems to be displeasure with large church movements. While the complaints against large churches may be valid, they can lead to a divisive, “us-vs.-them” mentality that should be avoided (see Ephesians 4:3).
One final consideration is the issue of accountability. Any church, large or small, should follow the instructions of 1 Timothy 3:1–13 regarding elders and deacons. Members of a house church should make sure that (a) there are recognized elders and (b) the elders are biblically qualified. These men should be held accountable even as they hold the group accountable to follow sound doctrine (Titus 1:9).
In conclusion, there is nothing unbiblical about Christians gathering regularly in houses or large buildings or any other venue. Some benefits of a house church could be reproducibility, thorough discipleship through participation, a family atmosphere, and better financial stewardship. The Bible does not give any guidelines as to the proper size or location of a church meeting. What it does do is explain what is to take place at those meetings (Acts 2:42; 1 Corinthians 16:2; 1 Timothy 4:13; 2 Timothy 4:2). So long as biblical teaching (orthodoxy) and practice (orthopraxy) are foremost in the assembly, the format and location really do not matter.
J.
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Love this. Yes, the whole Sunday Church, an hour and a half, a week, if you feel like going, Sunday comes. We open our closets, put on our white robes. Pick up our Staff of Righteousness. Head off to church. We sing songs. We say, “Praise Jesus.” “Thank you, Lord,” after every other sentence. We hear the message. We praise and thank the Pastor. {After asking our friend why the Pastor is wearing sneakers.“Look at the Pastor? Don’t ya think he could have at least shaved? I mean, if he is not going to put on his best suit and shave, and wear his best watch and look like a million bucks, why am I making an effort?” “Oh, great Sermon, Pastor. It really touched me.”
Then we go home. We open our closet. Lay down our Staff or Righteousness. Hang up our white robes. And we get ready to watch the Pre Pre Pre Show. The Game. The Post Show. The Post Post Show. We go to work on Monday. We talk about the game. We talk about what Susie is wearing. We stare at what Susie is wearing. We talk about Susie and Dave.
This is not a church, folks. This is a show. An obligation. Something we do. The Church back in the day?
“And they devoted themselves to the apostles’ teaching and the fellowship, to the breaking of bread and the prayers. And awe came upon every soul, and many wonders and signs were being done through the apostles. And all who believed were together and had all things in common. And they were selling their possessions and belongings and distributing the proceeds to all, as any had need.”
On Sunday, right?
“And day by day, attending the temple together and breaking bread in their homes, they received their food with glad and generous hearts, praising God and having favor with all the people. And the Lord added to their number day by day those who were being saved.” Acts 2:42-47
Day by day. Everyday. Religion is not going to save you. Being a good little “Insert religion here” is not going to save you. Sorry. It is just the simple truth. Religion is a man-made concept and most of the time has nothing to do with the true God and or His plan of salvation.
Simply put, Jesus is “the way, the truth, and the life.” John 14:6 Jesus is the key to Salvation. It is simply accepted by you or not, a fact that without Him, you can not enter into Heaven. It is simply a fact, again, accepted by you or not, that “neither is there salvation in any other: for there is no other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved.” Acts 4:12
Is He God only on Sundays? Of course not. He is God 24/7. It always benefits us when we see ourselves as His children 24/7. A Home Church is a great idea. I encourage you to think about that @pd2169637
Peter
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We have thought about building our own church which I think is a great idea and the most biblical idea. I don’t want to give excuses but there are two main issues with this idea. The first is that we live in a very small community (one of the churches I mentioned is a mega church along with the Christian school was in a different location from where I actually live. We rented out our place on the Oregon coast and moved temporarily to the Portland area so I could teach at that school), and the second is that because of everything that has happened, I don’t know if I have the energy to start something from scratch. I will keep praying. God bless you.
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Thank you for your kind words and encouragement. God bless you
Let me talk to you heart to heart for a moment. What happened to your family was not just mishandled. It was wrong. Scripture never blesses decisions driven by fear, gossip, or appearances. God says plainly, “He that answereth a matter before he heareth it, it is folly and shame unto him” ~Proverbs 18:13. When people move faster than truth, somebody always gets wounded. In your case, it was your son, and the ripple hit your whole household.
But here is the critical distinction. The failure of Christian organizations is not the failure of Christ. Systems collapse. Jesus does not. Scripture warned us that many gatherings would keep the label but lose the life. “Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof” ~2 Timothy 3:5. You do not have to settle for a compromised church just to say you belong somewhere. God never told His people to trade truth for acceptance.
Right now, the most biblical thing you can do is what God has already placed in your hands. Make your home a place where God is honored through His Word and prayer. Open the Word together. Pray together. Stand together. Joshua did not wait for perfect conditions. He said, “As for me and my house, we will serve the LORD” ~Joshua 24:15. Many of God’s greatest works begin in living rooms long before they ever touch a building.
You are not strange for feeling alone. Elijah felt the same way, and God reminded him that He always keeps a remnant ~1 Kings 19:18. Faithful believers may be fewer today, but they are not extinct. The church is not gone. It is scattered. And God is very good at bringing His people together in His time.
So do not quit the faith because some people quit the truth. Do not let wounds turn into walls. Keep looking, but do not lower your standards. When God connects you with believers who submit to Scripture, walk in repentance, and bear fruit, you will recognize them. Jesus said, “By their fruits ye shall know them” ~Matthew 7:20.
And while you are seeking and waiting, you are welcome to join us at biblicaltruthforum.com. It is a place for Scripture-centered fellowship with others who are committed to God’s Word and walking it out in real life. It is not a substitute for gathering when God provides it, but it can be a place of encouragement while you wait on Him.
You are not lost. You are wounded. And Scripture says, “The LORD is nigh unto them that are of a broken heart” ~Psalm 34:18. Stay rooted. Stay faithful. Stay open. God has not finished writing your story yet.
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Wow! This was excellent! Thank you so much. I read your response several times and read it to my wife. This was a blessing. Thank you so much and God bless you.
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What you described is genuinely painful, and it makes sense that you feel lost. What happened touched your son, your vocation, your wife’s work, your reputation, and your trust in institutions that were supposed to reflect Christ. That is not a small wound.
A few things need to be said plainly and carefully.
First, your son was never accused of sin, only of suspicion. That distinction matters. Scripture repeatedly condemns judgment based on fear, appearance, or rumor. “He that answereth a matter before he heareth it, it is folly and shame unto him” (Prov. 18:13). What you describe is not discipline, not correction, not shepherding—but risk management driven by fear, and fear makes people abandon biblical process very quickly.
Second, the way both the school and church handled this was not Matthew 18. There was no clear accusation, no witnesses of wrongdoing, no patient pastoral conversation, no effort at restoration. Instead, there was distance, silence interpreted as guilt, and escalation without substance. Scripture is explicit that elders and leaders are to act slowly, carefully, and justly, especially when reputation is at stake (1 Tim. 5:19; Prov. 25:8–10). Calling something “Christian” does not make it biblical.
Third, your son’s reaction—while understandable in distress—was interpreted through the lens of suspicion that had already been formed. Once fear takes hold, everything becomes confirmation. Reaching out to defend himself was seen as threatening. Calling out unbiblical behavior was labeled harassment. This is tragically common when institutions protect themselves rather than people. That does not make your son evil; it means he was isolated and desperate.
Fourth—and this is the hardest part—your loss of faith is not in Christ, but in systems that bear His name. Scripture actually anticipates this. Jesus Himself warned that religious structures could reject righteousness while claiming to defend holiness (Matt. 23). Paul warned of a “form of godliness” that denies its power (2 Tim. 3:5). Losing confidence in organizations does not mean you have lost God—it means you saw something that did not look like Him.
But here is the anchor you must not let go of:
Christ did not abandon you, your wife, or your son—even if institutions did.
Jesus knows what it is to be condemned without accusation, whispered about, assumed dangerous, and rejected “for the sake of the people.” He was called a threat without proof. He was removed “for safety.” He was silenced rather than heard. Hebrews tells us He suffered outside the camp—outside the approved religious space (Heb. 13:12–13). That means He meets people precisely where trust in the system has collapsed.
You are not wrong to grieve.
You are not weak to feel disoriented.
And you are not faithless for stepping back to breathe.
But be careful not to let the failure of people who mishandled authority sever you from the Shepherd who never does. God is not synonymous with institutions. Church buildings and schools can err grievously; Christ does not.
For now, it is okay to be quiet.
It is okay to heal as a family.
It is okay to sit with God without a program, title, or platform.
Just do not conclude that because they failed to reflect Christ, Christ is no longer worth trusting.
“The LORD is nigh unto them that are of a broken heart; and saveth such as be of a contrite spirit” (Ps. 34:18).
You are not abandoned.
You are wounded.
And God is closest to people right there.
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I always felt that I was a student of the word, but I feel very small when it comes to the fantastic Godly advice I am receiving on this forum. It is like you were there. Everything you described is exactly what happened. You wrote, “First, your son was never accused of sin, only of suspicion. That distinction matters.” This is exactly true! When I confronted the pastor that he bought into all of the gossip concerning my son. His immediate response was, “No I didn’t!” When I stated that none of these accusations are true. He immediately responded that they are true. I then asked him to show me where my son sinned? He was silent.
My son is a software engineer by trade but he loved working with hyperactive (ADHD) kindergarten boys. He felt like he could make a difference with them. The problem is my son is quiet and introverted, and an easy prey to be bullied. I will also add that my son still worked with the main child that my son was accused of for about a year after this entire incident. The single mother of the child thought that my son was fantastic and continued using my son to babysit her child. The school and the church never interviewed her nor gave a legitimate response as to why. However, the school accused this mother’s son of inappropriate behavior and kicked him out of the school. Later this child was evaluated and interviewed by a psychiatrist who came to the conclusion that the child did nothing wrong.
When all of this was happening I read a lot, and I remember reading an article by a sex crime police officer and he said that when they investigate sex crimes against children, it is not the quiet one we investigate but the one throwing the party. However, the church is quick to accuse the quiet one because they must be hiding something. Why else would they be quiet? The gift of discernment has completely left the modern church. Perhaps pastors should take an FBI profiling course before becoming a pastor.
Also whenever my son came near the children, they shouted his name and ran to him, hugging him and jumping innocently all over him. Is it normal for children to run to and hug the person doing them harm?
You also wrote, “Second, the way both the school and church handled this was not Matthew 18.”. I mentioned that to the pastor and he responded that Matthew 18 does not apply in this situation. I told him that I don’t understand. How does it not apply? He had no answer and simply reiterated that Matthew 18 did not apply.
You then wrote, “Third, your son’s reaction—while understandable in distress—was interpreted through the lens of suspicion that had already been formed. Once fear takes hold, everything becomes confirmation.”. Our reaction and my son’s reaction was not great. I was in despair. My son even tried to find the mother (s) making these accusations by sending out emails to some of the parents asking if they were the ones accusing him and why? When the administrator of the school found out, he sent me a text stating the my son needs to stop. I was upset with my son and harshly rebuked him. I felt like I was in the middle of a battle with no weapons, no allies, and no defense. The school administrator sent an email to my wife accusing her of submitting to her husband. You mentioned they reacted in fear. Everything they did was motivated by fear. Not once did the school or church use scripture to justify their actions. The worst thing the school did, I didn’t even mention. They filed a restraining order against my son and had police officers deliver the order to our home.
Finally you wrote, “Fourth—and this is the hardest part—your loss of faith is not in Christ, but in systems that bear His name.”. This is so very true. My son’s faith is still strong, but his faith in “Christian” institutions have been deeply diminished. He still loves visiting our favorite Christian organization and park which are the Ark Encounter and Creation Museum in Kentucky. So even though we live in Oregon, we make sure we travel there at least once or twice a year. But it is hard for him to trusts in churches over this issue and the fact that most shut down during Covid. He felt that was a very unbiblical response and I agree.
Anyway, I wrote a lot. Thank you for your wisdom and kindness,
Paul
What kind of School and/or Church was this no name just denomination?
The church is a non denomination mega church ( about 10000 members) in Portland Oregon. I will add that the senior pastor has nothing to do with this and probably is not aware of it. This was between the one of the associate Pastors and the children’s church coordinator. The school is affiliated with The Assembly of God denomination although many of the employees including the principal attended the mega church. Our home is on the Oregon Coast and we rented out our house and moved out there to teach at the private school. We have since moved back to the Oregon Coast and I am back teaching at the public school where I was teaching before moving out there. I plan on fully retiring in a year or two.
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Follow this link and go to one of these churches, I guarantee they will welcome you with open arms and never judgment. https://orupc.com/churches/#church-map