Is being gay a sin ? why?
This has been dealt with, do a search on the upper right.
J.
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Homosexuality. Is lust. Ive heard alot of speach on this matter. And its my understanding 98%of the whole thing is sexual immorality. With all your might, live him. Or die forever eventualy we all must make a dicission. Show him love or break his heart. Scarry huh.
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Chances are, no matter what I say here today, I will be attacked by some who either have an agenda or those who have blindly accepted the lie. But what we are going to talk about today is a simple Truth. The Truth according to God Himself.
I want to start off by saying this. I condemn no one. I do not advocate violence toward anyone. I’m not saying what I’m about to say to hurt anyone. However, the truth is the Truth. Is it OK to be gay? According to God and His Word, no. It is not only against Him but nature itself.
Let’s start at the beginning. God tells His children to follow Him and His ways, and not do the things that others do. He talks directly to us about sex. First He talks about incest in Leviticus 18:1-18
Then adultery.
“And you shall not lie sexually with your neighbor’s wife and so make yourself unclean with her” Leviticus 18:20
Then homosexuality.
“You shall not lie with a male as with a woman; it is an abomination.” Leviticus 18:22
Then bestiality.
“And you shall not lie with any animal and so make yourself unclean with it, neither shall any woman give herself to an animal to lie with it: it is a perversion.” Leviticus 18:23
Here, God calls all these things an abomination unto Him. Incest, adultery, homosexuality, and bestiality. He calls these all equal sins. He says.
“Do not make yourselves unclean by any of these things, for by all these the nations I am driving out before you have become unclean, and the land became unclean so that I punished its iniquity, and the land vomited out its inhabitants.” Leviticus 18:24-25
Keep this passage in mind when talking about nations. America today is in danger of falling into this same condemnation. More on that a bit later. Jesus came to pay the price for all of it. God knows the heart and mind of the individual. Do I have the right to condemn one for being gay? Not any more than I have the right to condemn anyone else. Once they come before God and repent of their sins, they, just like all, are forgiven, and they become new creatures. If they reject Christ and God, then there is nothing I could do to them that is worthy to compare to what they shall face, gay or straight.
This is not the only place God talks about sin, and adds homosexuality into the mix. Turn to Ezekiel 16:48-51
“As I live, declares the Lord God, your sister Sodom and her daughters have not done as you and your daughters have done. Behold, this was the guilt of your sister Sodom: she and her daughters had pride, excess of food, and prosperous ease, but did not aid the poor and needy. They were haughty and did an abomination before me. So I removed them when I saw them. Samaria has not committed half your sins. You have committed more abominations than they, and have made your sisters appear righteous by all the abominations that you have committed.”
Also read Romans 1:18-32,Transgenderism- Deuteronomy 22:5, Romans 1:18-32, 1 Corinthians 11:14-15, 1 Thessalonians 4:3-5, Pedophilia - Mark 9:42, Luke 17:1-37, 2 Timothy 3:1-17, 1 Corinthians 5:1-6.
“Flee from sexual immorality. All other sins a person commits are outside the body, but whoever sins sexually sins against their own body.” 1 Corinthians 6:18
Peter
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There are a multitude of forum strings dealing with homosexuality on Crosswalk that can be easily looked up. I myself have been forbidden to offer my thoughts ever again on this subject. But there are a vast array of beliefs held on this issue by various believers of various churches.
A few questions that are important to ask-
ONE
Can believing the wrong Doctrine or Belief, or having the wrong opinion, keep you from salvation if you accept Christ as your personal Lord and Savior? And if so, how far does this extend?
Many Church Denominations separated from or originated outside of the Catholic Church, the original Church, and are considered outside of God’s Saving Grace because they wondered off. This is because the Authority of Christ’s Church was given by Christ in Scripture to the Apostle Peter (or Petros Πέτρος) for Christ said the Church would be built upon this Rock (Petros translates into Rock).That Authority is passed down through the line of Popes, who by that same Authority create Priests for each new generation of believers. The line of succession is meant to stay intact. But none of this has happened in other Denominations. They remain outside of the True Church, according to this Biblical understanding.
So… one should argue, are they also outside God’s Saving Grace even though they believe with all their hearts but remain in rebellion? Can any non-Catholic truly be Saved? Are they actually damned to hell even though all their churches claim that they are saved and have done everything they need to?
For as Scripture tells us, what we do on to others we also do on to Christ. And what we do on to others will also come back to us. Whether that be holding people in Judgment, holding people accountable for their debts, withholding Grace, or showing Grace, Forgiveness and LOVE as we are called to do for their lack.
TWO
Yes, the Word of God is unerring, but is everything that is called the WORD of GOD actually the WORD of God? Remember, when the Apostles, and their Gospels, and their Letters speak of Scripture, the Word of God, they were not necessarily talking about their own narratives, letters, instructions, and debates. That designation was placed on the written material after the fact.
They were actually talking about Jewish Scriptures and Christ Himself, who is the Word of God. And even amongst the Jewish People, there is a far range of beliefs regarding how much of Scripture is directly given by God, inspired by God, and how much is purely symbolic.
There are also at least two places where the possibility of corruption is alluded to, one in the Old Testament and one for the New. Jeremiah 8:8 warns, “’How can you say, “We are wise, for we have the law of the LORD,” when actually the lying pen of the scribes has handled it falsely?
And in this, and similar to Christ speaking against the Pharisee, there are those who are smug because they think they have gotten it all figured out but they are following an error in thinking to their own peril.
In the New Testament, Christ warns us in His parable about the Weeds and the Wheat that something false has been sown where God sows seed. But God, in His Grace, has allowed the whole thing to grow together to be sorted out at the end. The error is allowed to remain.
continued
THREE
So in all this, how do you know who to believe regarding anything? How many laws written actually come from God and how many were purely based on cultural belief, and gender role expectation, judgmental biases, and political agendas at that time? Because not everyone who claims to come from God, or claims to carry a word from God, actually does.
I look to the Compass. I look to the Cross. I look to Christ. (Matthew 22:40; Mark 12:31; Luke 10:28). And Mathew says- **37 **Jesus said to him, “‘You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart, with all your soul, and with all your mind.’ **38 **This is the first and great commandment. **39 **And the second is like it: ‘You shall love your neighbor as yourself.’ 40 On these two commandments hang all the Law and the Prophets.”
***If they actually come from God. This is how you measure it. How you Discern right from wrong, God from Satan, Man of God from False Prophet.
LOVE is your compass. And as Paul says, Romes 13: 8-10 “Let no debt remain outstanding, except the continuing debt to love one another, for whoever loves others has fulfilled the law. Love does no wrong to a neighbor; therefore love is the fulfillment of the law”
How do we resolve debts? We forgive them. Because what we do for others comes back to us. We even say in prayer, forgive us our sin as we forgive those who sin against us. Which is to counter the spirit of Barabbas, the spirit of Vengeance, which glories in paying retribution and seeing it paid, a behavior which is not in the Spirit of LOVE, the Holy Spirit. Barabas, who was so proud of his murderous ways, was the one who people chose to save from the Cross instead of Christ. And yet the Spirit of Christ says, Father, forgive them for they know not what they do.
***This is a vast shift in focus. Instead of looking for the Law to save you, trying to follow it, meeting out vengeance on all those who trespass against it, you turn your eyes toward understanding God’s LOVE and doing THAT. Knowing that by living in this LOVE, this SPIRIT, you fulfill the Law and have surrendered in Faith to God’s Saving Grace. This is the nature of the New Covenant, that you will Pursue the Highest Good in LOVE instead of side stepping everything you are told to avoid because you are afraid of God’s Judgement. Perfect Love casts out all fear. And if you LOVE, you fulfill the Law. And those who Live in God’s Grace do not live in fear. They Live in Mercy and LOVE, and they share that with others including strangers outside the Faith. And the Gospel with it, spreading God’s Kingdom naturally as you do this as LOVE and Kindness are like hot coals that convict and move people toward the good.
People who look to the Law to save them turn away from Christ. It’s a trap and anyone who tries to follow any of it, and tries to get you to follow any of it, must follow all of it to its natural conclusion. As Paul says in Galatians 5-
**2 **Mark my words! I, Paul, tell you that if you let yourselves be circumcised, Christ will be of no value to you at all. **3 **Again I declare to every man who lets himself be circumcised that he is obligated to obey the whole law. **4 **You who are trying to be justified by the law have been alienated from Christ; you have fallen away from grace. **5 **For through the Spirit we eagerly await by faith the righteousness for which we hope.6 For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision nor uncircumcision has any value. The only thing that counts is faith expressing itself through love.
And the reason why this is important is- people who ask whether being gay is a sin, or if anything else is a sin, are looking to follow the law, they look to the law for the answer, and the law itself cannot save you. As it is written in Romans 3:20 "Therefore by the deeds of the law, no flesh shall be justified in His sight, for by the law is the knowledge of sin.” and “I found that the very commandment that was intended to bring life actually brought death. For sin, taking an opportunity through the commandment, deceived me and through it killed me.” Romans 7:10-11
You are asking the wrong question. The correct questions are, “How do I LOVE God? How do I LOVE my neighbor? How do I LOVE others? How do I LOVE myself?” This is the way to be in right standing with God. And when others wrong you, forgive them as Christ has shown you. In this way, you are in God’s Grace. Holding no debts except that which is based in LOVE.
And as Scripture says, Romans 8:2 – “Therefore, there is now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus, because through Christ Jesus the law of the Spirit who gives life has set you free from the law of sin and death”
The Law of sin and death is what people chase after, and try to bind you too, when they point to the many various laws and rules and say your behavior goes against the Bible and God. While the Law of Life is the Law to LOVE one another instead. It is a shift in focus, behavior, in how we treat each other and ourselves.
**27 **Where, then, is boasting? It is excluded. Because of what law? The law that requires works? No, because of the law that requires faith. **28 **For we maintain that a person is justified by faith apart from the works of the law. **29 **Or is God the God of Jews only? Is he not the God of Gentiles too? Yes, of Gentiles too, **30 **since there is only one God, who will justify the circumcised by faith and the uncircumcised through that same faith. **31 **Do we, then, nullify the law by this faith? Not at all! Rather, we uphold the law. (Romans 3: 27-31)
And as Paul said, as I quoted previously, LOVE fulfills the Law.
continued
LOVE fulfills the Law. Not your attempt to follow the letter but your Living in the Spirit of God. In Faith. That is what fulfills the Law. LOVE forgives, and Forgiveness reaps Forgiveness. LOVE covers sin with Grace, and Grace reaps Grace. And the Kingdom of God grows this way, in Spirit. Working against the spirit of Barabbas, Vengeance and Retribution.
Romans 7 Or do you not know, brethren (for I speak to those who know the law), that the law [a]has dominion over a man as long as he lives? **2 **For the woman who has a husband is bound by the law to her husband as long as he lives. But if the husband dies, she is released from the law of her husband. **3 **So then if, while her husband lives, she marries another man, she will be called an adulteress; but if her husband dies, she is free from that law, so that she is no adulteress, though she has married another man. 4 Therefore, my brethren, you also have become dead to the law through the body of Christ, that you may be married to another—to Him who was raised from the dead, that we should bear fruit to God. **5 **For when we were in the flesh, the sinful passions which were aroused by the law were at work in our members to bear fruit to death. **6 **But now we have been delivered from the law, having died to what we were held by, so that we should serve in the newness of the Spirit and not in the oldness of the letter.
And what is this New Law that you are now married to? That is the Law of LOVE, your new focus if you are actually in Christ.
Is being gay a sin? You are a sinner regardless. Repent, accept Christ, and let His Spirit guide you to LOVE, as God LOVES… if you have not done so already. And in this, by Faith and not by works, you are saved. Knowing God’s LOVE, being in relationship with that LOVE, is the only way to Eternal Life.
But if people tell you that the LAW declares that you are a sinner because of what the LAW says, remember…so are they. And if they cling to that LAW and demand that you follow it to the letter, and pay it’s dues, they have forsaken Christ, His Law of LOVE, and the Holy Spirit. For no one is saved except by God’s Grace. All fall Short. But glory to God, because God so LOVED the world.
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There 8s not anything wrong with your questains. Sin is sin. Now if i had lived your life, from birth, could i have done it any better. To say i could have, is to say i am better than you. Why would anyone judge anothers sin? When jesus removes it from his world.
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He only removes it from those who repent. Those who go on sinning, no.
“For if we go on sinning deliberately after receiving the knowledge of the truth, there no longer remains a sacrifice for sins.” Hebrews 10:26
The flesh wants to and will do the works of the flesh.
“Now the works of the flesh are evident: sexual immorality, impurity, sensuality, idolatry, sorcery, enmity, strife, jealousy, fits of anger, rivalries, dissensions, divisions, envy, drunkenness, orgies, and things like these. I warn you, as I warned you before, that those who do such things will not inherit the kingdom of God.” Galatians 5:19-21
If Jesus came and removed all sin, then yes, everyone would go to heaven, and there would be no need to repent, no need for a saviour. That is not the case.
“For you may be sure of this, that everyone who is sexually immoral or impure, or who is covetous (that is, an idolater), has no inheritance in the kingdom of Christ and God. Let no one deceive you with empty words, for because of these things the wrath of God comes upon the sons of disobedience.” Ephesians 5:5-6
Jesus came and bore our sins. But His strips we are healed. It is only through Him that we are washed clean of our sins. If He took away the sin for all, then no one would go on sinning.
Peter
I’m proud of you. Good answer. You almost got it out. Yes. And you added that you must stop and turn away from your sin. Good job. It’s important to remember that repentance and seeking guidance through Christ’s love are key to living a fulfilling life.
God bless
Peter
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Interestingly, not once does Scripture show Christ forgiving someone who asked for it. Not one instance that I have been able to locate. In every instance I have found, he just forgave them and said to sin no more. And He asked the Father to forgive those who crucified Him… they were not repenting at the time either… But he does tell Peter to forgive 7 times 70, I think. Indicating, endless forgiveness…
So I think you might be in error here to some degree somewhere in your thinking. About the nature of Forgiveness, or Grace, or your expectations as a Christian, or God’s LOVE. But I forgive you anyway. Peace, @PeterC
So let’s talk about it. Are you claiming that you are forgiven, and you can do anything you choose and still go to heaven?
”From that time Jesus began to preach, saying, “Repent, for the kingdom of heaven is at hand.” Jesus Matthew 4:17
Peter
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I repeat, repentance did not precede Christ forgiving. Unless you can find a specific example that I could not find.
I already answered this in the other posts. I quoted Scripture and everything.
Peace,@PeterC
All Jesus.
”From that time Jesus began to preach, saying, ‘Repent, for the kingdom of heaven is at hand.” Matthew 4:17
”No, I tell you; but unless you repent, you will all likewise perish.” Luke 13:3
“And saying, ‘The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand; repent and believe in the gospel.” Mark 1:15
“Repent, for the kingdom of heaven is at hand.” Matthew 3:2
People seeking forgiveness? Paralyzed Man Mark 2:1–12; Matthew 9:1–8; Luke 5:17–26
The paralyzed man is brought to Jesus for healing. Jesus’ first words are:
“Son, your sins are forgiven.”
The religious leaders react because only God can forgive sins. Jesus responds by healing the man to prove He has that authority. This is the most explicit example of Jesus forgiving someone directly, which would be the sinful woman in Luke 7:36–50. A woman known for her sinful life comes to Jesus, weeping at His feet. Jesus says. “Your sins are forgiven.”
Again, the people question. “Who is this who even forgives sins?” This shows that people approached Jesus seeking mercy, and He granted forgiveness personally.
Then you have the criminal on the Cross Luke 23:39–43
“Remember me when you come into your kingdom.”
He doesn’t use the word “forgive,” but he is clearly seeking mercy. Jesus replies:
“Today you will be with me in paradise.”
There are many in the Word. This claim of yours is so far off it is almost too far to see.
Peter
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Again, not one of the people in Scripture asked for Christ to forgive them. It is not in the Scriptures you mentioned. He forgave them anyway.
Were they humble? In some instances. Were they in need of a miracle? Sometimes. But Repentance, a visible change of behavior, a request for forgiveness- It is not there. But God’s Mercy is always Present. And Christ says to Peter, how many times to forgive if a person sins against you?
Homosexuality is a practice often arrived at through abuse as a child, a culture like the ancient Greeks, hedonistic indulgence, or a judicial punishment from God (Romans 1).
The amount of disease, alcoholism, drug abuse, and depression indicate an unhealthy path towards destruction. Those who are able to see truth can find redemption and freedom in Christ.
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Almost out of time this morning. I will just say this. You are either truly blind or willfully twisting the Word to fit your belief system. Those people WERE seeing forgiveness. They came to Jesus. He forgave them. Then He said to some Go and sin not more. Jesus WHOLE message was repent. Tio turn away from your sin. To deny yourself and to follow Him. Nowhere does it say Jesus said, the Grace of the Father is sufficient for all sin. Nowhere does it say, Love forgives sin. Most definitly nowhere does it say all go to heaven. Sorry.
It was good talking with you again. Been a while.
Peter
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No doubt about it. They were seeing Forgiveness, Grace, Mercy, Healing, Kindness, Compassion and more in ways they may have never seen before. They were seeing LOVE, embodied, given freely without any requirement to have it reciprocated, returned or repaid. Because Unconditional LOVE requires nothing in return by its very nature. Though it does go on to give birth to the same, Unconditional LOVE. Because what is given comes back.
But to Live in Christ is to Follow His Law of LOVE, the New Law, the Law of The Spirit of Life, as we have died to the Old Law and now live in Christ. And we no longer focus on the Letter of that Old Law but the Spirit of the New.